Hi
I'm looking at a pricing exercise of 'densified' wood for a speaker build here in the US.
One manufacturer is Richlite that makes a material from recycled cardboard/paper and resin.
(I can estimate the cost per sq ft )
Panzerholtz has been around, but unobtanium in the US ... saw a video from an audio show from this year where a speaker manufacturer had Panzerholtz baffles and said he had a source in the South East due to their use in auto racing.
Does anyone know of such a source?
Would love to see a comparison between Richlite, Panzerholtz and other 'densified' materials.
Thx.
I'm looking at a pricing exercise of 'densified' wood for a speaker build here in the US.
One manufacturer is Richlite that makes a material from recycled cardboard/paper and resin.
(I can estimate the cost per sq ft )
Panzerholtz has been around, but unobtanium in the US ... saw a video from an audio show from this year where a speaker manufacturer had Panzerholtz baffles and said he had a source in the South East due to their use in auto racing.
Does anyone know of such a source?
Would love to see a comparison between Richlite, Panzerholtz and other 'densified' materials.
Thx.
Stranded/fossilized bamboo plywood. We used PlyBoo.
And as to what Mr Gel said: the engineering design of the enclosure can trump brute force materials. Bamboo also does not need anything but a clear finish, so its higher cost has to be compared to plywood + veneer and the time to add the veneer.
dave
Did not know about PlyBoo, but that doesn't help in trying to find the US distributor of Panzerholtz.
The thing about Richlite, you also don't need to do much to the finish either. But its god awful expensive.
Its not just the ply but also the resin / glue used too.
If you have an estimate (rough numbers) for price of PlyBoo that would be great.
Lots of resellers in the US...
Also do you know of anyone who has done some sound tests of the material(s)?
I saw some old threads where people got samples of Richlite.
As to the cabinet design... yes that does matter, but once you have the design... then which material? ;-)
Another option was picawood, but very little info... see https://mockingbirddistribution.com/pyon-sound/picawood/
The thing about Richlite, you also don't need to do much to the finish either. But its god awful expensive.
Its not just the ply but also the resin / glue used too.
If you have an estimate (rough numbers) for price of PlyBoo that would be great.
Lots of resellers in the US...
Also do you know of anyone who has done some sound tests of the material(s)?
I saw some old threads where people got samples of Richlite.
As to the cabinet design... yes that does matter, but once you have the design... then which material? ;-)
Another option was picawood, but very little info... see https://mockingbirddistribution.com/pyon-sound/picawood/
I tend to use the “least” material i can (except we use 15mm because 12mm, althou suffiient in many cases, is harder to work with.
we used Stranded Plyboo (18mm) for enclosures that we also built with 15mm quality plywood. It was prettier, and easier to finish but the plywood box was just as good. Confirmed our enginering design was good.
dave
Isn't "Trespa" (TM) something like that? Tufnol also makes similar materials. Less marketing branding but good stuff.
If you like 'densified", nothing better then cast lead. But a bit less practical I guess
So if you read the first post, there was a guy at an audio show, I'll have to find the clip where he was selling his speakers that had baffles made from Panzerholtz. He said that he had a supplier in the South East. Associated w the Auto Racing industry.
Densified wood is interesting in that they treat the wood (chemically) then when they make their plywood, (compressed under high pressure and heated... the resin/glue/phenolic resin ?sp? is absorbed into the cell structures creating a strong bond. I'm paraphrasing and you can find some YouTube videos on people making 'bulletproof' wood.
The result is a material that is lighter and stronger... (see the link on picawood)
@Dave, there are some articles that talk about the acoustic properties of Panzerholts and someone showed the rapid decay of vibrations versus other materials. I don't know much about the acoustic properties of Richlite... or other of these materials.
There is one company making Granite OB Baffles and Panzerholtz for Baffles seems to be 'popular' in some of these high price speakers.
I agree that stiffness is important along w the price point and work-ability of the material.
Again, I don't know of what tests have been done on these materials. It would be interesting and 'expensive' to see.
I'd imagine using an accelerometer to measure the decay of a knock... or something like that.
I'd leave it to the professionals who do sound tests for a living to figure out the best way to test/compare these materials along w MDF,HDF and ply.
There are some distributors of Richlite that are willing to donate/sell scrap from projects so depending on the size of the speaker... it could work for a test box.
Densified wood is interesting in that they treat the wood (chemically) then when they make their plywood, (compressed under high pressure and heated... the resin/glue/phenolic resin ?sp? is absorbed into the cell structures creating a strong bond. I'm paraphrasing and you can find some YouTube videos on people making 'bulletproof' wood.
The result is a material that is lighter and stronger... (see the link on picawood)
@Dave, there are some articles that talk about the acoustic properties of Panzerholts and someone showed the rapid decay of vibrations versus other materials. I don't know much about the acoustic properties of Richlite... or other of these materials.
There is one company making Granite OB Baffles and Panzerholtz for Baffles seems to be 'popular' in some of these high price speakers.
I agree that stiffness is important along w the price point and work-ability of the material.
Again, I don't know of what tests have been done on these materials. It would be interesting and 'expensive' to see.
I'd imagine using an accelerometer to measure the decay of a knock... or something like that.
I'd leave it to the professionals who do sound tests for a living to figure out the best way to test/compare these materials along w MDF,HDF and ply.
There are some distributors of Richlite that are willing to donate/sell scrap from projects so depending on the size of the speaker... it could work for a test box.
Sorry, that one is already known.
https://bkbindustrial.com/
They are the NA distributor of Delignit (Panzerholtz).
The guy in the YouTube video who was using it for the front baffles on his speakers said he had a source in the South East and made it sound like it was the US. Not Quebec.
That's why I was hoping that there was an actual reseller in the US.
There are a couple of densified wood suppliers ... which I include Richlite. which is made in the US and not imported.
Thanks though... had my hopes up... although I guess the thing about shipping is that there may be ways to reduce it...
https://bkbindustrial.com/
They are the NA distributor of Delignit (Panzerholtz).
The guy in the YouTube video who was using it for the front baffles on his speakers said he had a source in the South East and made it sound like it was the US. Not Quebec.
That's why I was hoping that there was an actual reseller in the US.
There are a couple of densified wood suppliers ... which I include Richlite. which is made in the US and not imported.
Thanks though... had my hopes up... although I guess the thing about shipping is that there may be ways to reduce it...