I've been trying to follow the various threads on this forum and have gleaned some useful info. I do see, however, a lot of general references to tweaking various transports without much explination of what and why.
I recently picked up a Marantz CD6000OSE on eBay at good price and I am wondering what tweaks might be useful. I am thinking of a Scott Nixon DAC but am not sure what other steps I should take.
I would say, without trying to be too bombastic
that I am fairly adept with technical subjects, having been involved in all sorts of electronic/computer systems, including board level repair and engineering for the past 30 years.
But I don't want to tear into this thing (even at the price I paid) without some clearer direction.
Also, are schematics available for the Marantz... Gee, remember when you could go to your local repair shop and get a Photofacts on anything that ran electrons? Or am I dating myself?
Sorry for the long post...
I recently picked up a Marantz CD6000OSE on eBay at good price and I am wondering what tweaks might be useful. I am thinking of a Scott Nixon DAC but am not sure what other steps I should take.
I would say, without trying to be too bombastic
that I am fairly adept with technical subjects, having been involved in all sorts of electronic/computer systems, including board level repair and engineering for the past 30 years.But I don't want to tear into this thing (even at the price I paid) without some clearer direction.
Also, are schematics available for the Marantz... Gee, remember when you could go to your local repair shop and get a Photofacts on anything that ran electrons? Or am I dating myself?
Sorry for the long post...
Two simple reversible tweaks:
- stuff it with bitumen everywhere inside,
- put bluetac where possible in the transport (not too much, though)
Good luck
Tom
- stuff it with bitumen everywhere inside,
- put bluetac where possible in the transport (not too much, though)
Good luck
Tom
Tom,
Thanks for the quick reply. I presume these tweeks are to damp down physical vibrations. I am not sure how useful that would be considering the (major) street outside my building is rougher then any in Bagdad and anytime a truck decided to plow through the holes it's as if the building was hit by an earthquake.
I will still try some damping but I am also interested in some electronic tweeks. Over 50 hits and only you were kind enough to respond. How does one get things going, start another thread on what CD player/Caps/resistors/DAC to use/buy/build?
So many knowledgeable people out there and I can't land more then one kind soul...
Thanks for the quick reply. I presume these tweeks are to damp down physical vibrations. I am not sure how useful that would be considering the (major) street outside my building is rougher then any in Bagdad and anytime a truck decided to plow through the holes it's as if the building was hit by an earthquake.
I will still try some damping but I am also interested in some electronic tweeks. Over 50 hits and only you were kind enough to respond. How does one get things going, start another thread on what CD player/Caps/resistors/DAC to use/buy/build?
So many knowledgeable people out there and I can't land more then one kind soul...
Hello!
Did you do a search? Think there has been some threads about CD6000 earlier.
Also, there are some general tweaks that might apply to the CD6000, too.
There's a lot about the CD63, but I don't know how applicable these might be.
It would be of help if you have a service manual to your player.
General tweaks:
1) shortcut the output caps if they are of lower quality. Measure the DC before the caps, BEFORE you shortcut. A value of <50mV is OK
2) check what opamps you have and change them for better ones, put good sockets in, then you can try different opamps
3) if changing the opamps, put bypass caps of 0,1uF from the +/- voltage legs to ground as close as possible to the chip
4) as I said before, stuff it with bitumen and bluetac, even more important when you have vibrations in your house. Bitumen and bluetac is cheap and you can easily remove it
5) clean up the power supply by using better regulators and separating the supply to the analogue and digital sections
6) put in a new clock, look for the Kwak-clock, it's a cheap and good alternative constructed by a guy at the forum (alhough I haven't tried it myself - yet)
Specific Marantz tweaks:
1) IF the first opamp after the DAC uses a differential input, it would be a good idea to match the components around that opamp within 0,1% tolerance. Made a great difference on my CD63 - as great as the clock change and output cap shorting
Hope this is enough. I believe you will find a lot of details concerning most (all?) of these tweaks if you do a search on the forum.
Good luck!
Tom
Did you do a search? Think there has been some threads about CD6000 earlier.
Also, there are some general tweaks that might apply to the CD6000, too.
There's a lot about the CD63, but I don't know how applicable these might be.
It would be of help if you have a service manual to your player.
General tweaks:
1) shortcut the output caps if they are of lower quality. Measure the DC before the caps, BEFORE you shortcut. A value of <50mV is OK
2) check what opamps you have and change them for better ones, put good sockets in, then you can try different opamps
3) if changing the opamps, put bypass caps of 0,1uF from the +/- voltage legs to ground as close as possible to the chip
4) as I said before, stuff it with bitumen and bluetac, even more important when you have vibrations in your house. Bitumen and bluetac is cheap and you can easily remove it
5) clean up the power supply by using better regulators and separating the supply to the analogue and digital sections
6) put in a new clock, look for the Kwak-clock, it's a cheap and good alternative constructed by a guy at the forum (alhough I haven't tried it myself - yet)
Specific Marantz tweaks:
1) IF the first opamp after the DAC uses a differential input, it would be a good idea to match the components around that opamp within 0,1% tolerance. Made a great difference on my CD63 - as great as the clock change and output cap shorting
Hope this is enough. I believe you will find a lot of details concerning most (all?) of these tweaks if you do a search on the forum.
Good luck!
Tom
The offset...that is offset...
50mV is OK for a power amp...but not to a source component...
Imagine the normal voltage gain in a power amp (30 x)...
50mV x 30= 1.500 mV=1,5Volts of of set!!!
Poor woofer!!😉
50mV is OK for a power amp...but not to a source component...
Imagine the normal voltage gain in a power amp (30 x)...
50mV x 30= 1.500 mV=1,5Volts of of set!!!
Poor woofer!!😉
Hello!
So, the 1,5V signal output form the CD becomes 30 x 1,5V = 45V.
Poor speaker.
Usually there's a cap on the input on every component, isn't there?
🙄
So, the 1,5V signal output form the CD becomes 30 x 1,5V = 45V.
Poor speaker.
Usually there's a cap on the input on every component, isn't there?
🙄
Tom,
Thanks for the reply again! I did do a search but mostly got discouraged as the threads degenerated into personal attacks over whose Op Amp was better, etc.
I really don't have patience for the high THD in many of those threads. I like good practical advice and pointers. I am willing to try most things if they make sense.
I tried to find a schematic for the CD-6000 but the one thread with a link didn't work. Any clues where to pursue one?
As to your specific ideas (thanks!!! 🙂 ) what do you mean by "shortcut the caps?" Do you mean to short them out, as in remove them?
Ah, yes, hence the concern about the ripple...
I'll go through the forums again to see if I can glean some useful stuff in all the noise.
I do appreciate your patience and help!
<A>
Thanks for the reply again! I did do a search but mostly got discouraged as the threads degenerated into personal attacks over whose Op Amp was better, etc.
I really don't have patience for the high THD in many of those threads. I like good practical advice and pointers. I am willing to try most things if they make sense.
I tried to find a schematic for the CD-6000 but the one thread with a link didn't work. Any clues where to pursue one?
As to your specific ideas (thanks!!! 🙂 ) what do you mean by "shortcut the caps?" Do you mean to short them out, as in remove them?
Ah, yes, hence the concern about the ripple...I'll go through the forums again to see if I can glean some useful stuff in all the noise.
I do appreciate your patience and help!
<A>
Hello!
Too bad you can't find anything relevant for the CD6000.
I find this thread very useful, indeed.
You just have to "filter" stuff out. You might also try to contact "garmin", he's the guy with the Polish site. Maybe he can give you more extracted, compact tips.
As I said I can give you loads of links to CD63 mods, but I can't determine how relevant they are.
Ergo has suggested that you bypass the second opamp and shortcut the HDAM, but use the last FETs of the HDAM to drive the output. Haven't tried that one, though.
Look at www.audioasylum.com, too.🙄 But I must say that the most compentent and friendly advice you'll get here (not saying that I am terribly compentent)
Try to find the Schematic It's under the word "tutaj"
It's better to shortcut the caps with a bit of thick wire. The concern with the caps is that they block DC that can potentially harm your speakers. If you feel uncomfortable with that risk, put in Black Gates.
If you balance the 10, 27k resistors at the first opamp after the DAC, not only the sound will improve, the DC offset will go to almost zero.
Of the mods I have made, these made the biggest audible sound difference:
- output caps shorting
- getting the 10 and 27k resistors at the first opamp after the DAC into 0,1% tolerance
- LCAudio clock
- separate regulators for the DAC digital, analogue and oscillator parts
IMHO, no need to get at the opamps, if you don't want to.
Good luck!
tom
Too bad you can't find anything relevant for the CD6000.
I find this thread very useful, indeed.
You just have to "filter" stuff out. You might also try to contact "garmin", he's the guy with the Polish site. Maybe he can give you more extracted, compact tips.
As I said I can give you loads of links to CD63 mods, but I can't determine how relevant they are.
Ergo has suggested that you bypass the second opamp and shortcut the HDAM, but use the last FETs of the HDAM to drive the output. Haven't tried that one, though.
Look at www.audioasylum.com, too.🙄 But I must say that the most compentent and friendly advice you'll get here (not saying that I am terribly compentent)
Try to find the Schematic It's under the word "tutaj"
It's better to shortcut the caps with a bit of thick wire. The concern with the caps is that they block DC that can potentially harm your speakers. If you feel uncomfortable with that risk, put in Black Gates.
If you balance the 10, 27k resistors at the first opamp after the DAC, not only the sound will improve, the DC offset will go to almost zero.
Of the mods I have made, these made the biggest audible sound difference:
- output caps shorting
- getting the 10 and 27k resistors at the first opamp after the DAC into 0,1% tolerance
- LCAudio clock
- separate regulators for the DAC digital, analogue and oscillator parts
IMHO, no need to get at the opamps, if you don't want to.
Good luck!
tom
Tweaks
Have a look at the 723/753 Philips thread, these are the same as Marantz 4000 & 5000, although different machines the theory referred to by Nuuk in post #63 may be what you're looking for:
http://www.cfmedia.org/mods.pdf
Also even though it does go off topic being a valve mod, this may help. It notes some of the differences between the 6000 & 5000 models:
http://www.heartaudio.nl/enter.html?target=Tubed_CD_playersHeart_CD6000.html
Cheers
Paul
Have a look at the 723/753 Philips thread, these are the same as Marantz 4000 & 5000, although different machines the theory referred to by Nuuk in post #63 may be what you're looking for:
http://www.cfmedia.org/mods.pdf
Also even though it does go off topic being a valve mod, this may help. It notes some of the differences between the 6000 & 5000 models:
http://www.heartaudio.nl/enter.html?target=Tubed_CD_playersHeart_CD6000.html
Cheers
Paul
LM340T5
I like to use the LM340T5 on the PSU of the digital circuits.
They are direct replacements of the 7805, but better ones.
On a Marantz cd-player I have, I even had the trouble to do a pre-regulation with LM317 before the LM340T5.
Results were fantastic!
I like to use the LM340T5 on the PSU of the digital circuits.
They are direct replacements of the 7805, but better ones.
On a Marantz cd-player I have, I even had the trouble to do a pre-regulation with LM317 before the LM340T5.
Results were fantastic!
The CD that put 1,5 Volt DC at the amp....
First the 1,5 volt signal output from CD is a alternating Voltage not a DC voltage ...the speaker will be happy with this musical signal...if it like the tune...😉
Second yes...in a +- 100W amp efectively you are putting 45 volts AC at the speakers terminals...what's the problem??.....
About a cap at the input on every component...it can't automactily be assumed!!
With this understanding how components work...i will be a litle more carefull giving advices!!
Zombie said:
First the 1,5 volt signal output from CD is a alternating Voltage not a DC voltage ...the speaker will be happy with this musical signal...if it like the tune...😉
Second yes...in a +- 100W amp efectively you are putting 45 volts AC at the speakers terminals...what's the problem??.....
About a cap at the input on every component...it can't automactily be assumed!!
With this understanding how components work...i will be a litle more carefull giving advices!!
Well, I stand corrected.
Don't modify anything...buy smth 5 times as expensive instead - and never assume the next component has a cap...
cheers
tom
p.s. I do really respect and admire people that are mute when somebody asks for positive advice, and when some other person does, they get out to bite that guy's head off.
If you complain about smth, suggest an alternative...well, seems like I did that, too - "put in a pair of Black Gates". What advice did you guys give, carlosfm and Tube_Dude?
Don't modify anything...buy smth 5 times as expensive instead - and never assume the next component has a cap...
cheers
tom
p.s. I do really respect and admire people that are mute when somebody asks for positive advice, and when some other person does, they get out to bite that guy's head off.
If you complain about smth, suggest an alternative...well, seems like I did that, too - "put in a pair of Black Gates". What advice did you guys give, carlosfm and Tube_Dude?
The right to answer...
In a nutshell!!
I haven't criticesed any of your mods...even if a can't agreed with you in a few...
I only have told you that 50 mV off set in a source component is not a good design practice...if the power amp is DC coupled the woffer goes to heaven...😉
And many readers(specialy the begineers) could believe that this 50 mV would be normal!!
And only your answer to my first post...made me express some more comments...🙂...because it show some misunderstood in some basics as DC and AC...
In a nutshell!!
I haven't criticesed any of your mods...even if a can't agreed with you in a few...
I only have told you that 50 mV off set in a source component is not a good design practice...if the power amp is DC coupled the woffer goes to heaven...😉
And many readers(specialy the begineers) could believe that this 50 mV would be normal!!
And only your answer to my first post...made me express some more comments...🙂...because it show some misunderstood in some basics as DC and AC...
Now we're cooking! Thanks to all of you, especially those who contacted me directly with info. However, I see the biting, fighting, and sniping starting in this thread. Can we avoid it? I hate having to filter through everyone's personal problems just to get some solid info.
Let's face it, audio is subjective. Measurements are like statistics, sometimes their accurate, sometimes they're ridiculous. If we can agree that not everything works for everybody and EVERYBODY (shouting intentional) has their own preferences and opinions.
Please feel free to express them, but make them constructive. Take the battle off-line or move it to the Texas forum. We are supposed to be a community that shares and teaches. Whilst that may make us a family, let's leave the dysfunctional part for our holiday get-togethers.
Back to solder. I recieved a very nice email response with schematic from Elso Kwok for his clock circuit. Anyone have practical experience with his design. Any advantage to rolling this one as opposed to purchasing something more kit like, such as the LC?
After this, we can tackle DACs!
Thanks all, again!
<A>
Let's face it, audio is subjective. Measurements are like statistics, sometimes their accurate, sometimes they're ridiculous. If we can agree that not everything works for everybody and EVERYBODY (shouting intentional) has their own preferences and opinions.
Please feel free to express them, but make them constructive. Take the battle off-line or move it to the Texas forum. We are supposed to be a community that shares and teaches. Whilst that may make us a family, let's leave the dysfunctional part for our holiday get-togethers.
Back to solder. I recieved a very nice email response with schematic from Elso Kwok for his clock circuit. Anyone have practical experience with his design. Any advantage to rolling this one as opposed to purchasing something more kit like, such as the LC?
After this, we can tackle DACs!
Thanks all, again!
<A>
Zombie,
Don't remove the cap, just try another (better?) one if you are not haappy with the results.
Sometimes even a different value cap gives better results.
I once changed two series 220 uF/50v caps on a cd-player with two series 22 uF/16v caps, and I liked the results.
Yes, true.
Bass got better definition.
Don't remove the cap, just try another (better?) one if you are not haappy with the results.
Sometimes even a different value cap gives better results.
I once changed two series 220 uF/50v caps on a cd-player with two series 22 uF/16v caps, and I liked the results.
Yes, true.
Bass got better definition.
Hello!
I wasn't picking a fight, I was just ironic. This because the person that kindly asked for advice should have received a reply why not to take out the output caps. Not me...
Something else - CD63 MkII KIS:
I was thinking about using the LCclock PSU unit to feed all of the DACs seprate units (osc, analogue, digital) instead of using the 10 and 15V feeds through separate regulators as I currently do.
Is any gain in sound quality to be expected? Or maybe I should use it to feed the analogue section instead?
Any opinions/experiences appreciated!
What about attaching the psu under the supporting rail at the back of the player (the one that goes over the xformer)?
Hope you national team won last night! Mine did!
I wasn't picking a fight, I was just ironic. This because the person that kindly asked for advice should have received a reply why not to take out the output caps. Not me...
Something else - CD63 MkII KIS:
I was thinking about using the LCclock PSU unit to feed all of the DACs seprate units (osc, analogue, digital) instead of using the 10 and 15V feeds through separate regulators as I currently do.
Is any gain in sound quality to be expected? Or maybe I should use it to feed the analogue section instead?
Any opinions/experiences appreciated!
What about attaching the psu under the supporting rail at the back of the player (the one that goes over the xformer)?
Hope you national team won last night! Mine did!
When will the insanity stop... I seem to have eBay fever and found that I had also won a NAD 521i which arrived today. 
Anybody have experience with those?
I suppose the same mods and suggestions apply.
As for your suggestions, I have done the following:
1) Ordered 2 packages of the Blu-glop for damping
2) Ordered a Scott-Nixon DAC
3) Had some great correspondence with Elso Kwak and as soon as I can figure out how to get him some Euros without popping them in an envelope and trusting luck, I'll give his clock a try.
Anybody had experience with this DAC:
http://members.chello.nl/~m.heijligers/DAChtml/dactop.htm
Now all I have to do is find the time to open up the CDPs!
Thanks all, again...
<A>
Anybody have experience with those?
I suppose the same mods and suggestions apply.
As for your suggestions, I have done the following:
1) Ordered 2 packages of the Blu-glop for damping
2) Ordered a Scott-Nixon DAC
3) Had some great correspondence with Elso Kwak and as soon as I can figure out how to get him some Euros without popping them in an envelope and trusting luck, I'll give his clock a try.
Anybody had experience with this DAC:
http://members.chello.nl/~m.heijligers/DAChtml/dactop.htm
Now all I have to do is find the time to open up the CDPs!
Thanks all, again...
<A>
- Status
- Not open for further replies.