I'll be trying for my firt TL project soon, a 8 inch in a TL. Paired with a dipole 5" and tweeter.
The dipole mid and tweeter is already made, and sounds awsome.
(same mid and same tweeter as the ones ive posted about before, the unnamed ones (got no money for anythig else..))
the crossover points will be 200hz and 2500 hz, all second order
as for the TL, i got no books, thx to planet10 for his wonderfull website where im trying to extract every information I can 😉
one thing thought,
The start of my tl is like 1.5 x sd and end is like tapered to 2 x sd
that good or bad?
and how does a rear opened TL sound, compared to a fornt opened TL
And i've found no info yet on how qms and qts will affect the whole thing,
Do i really only have to consider only FS?,
as its my first one i'll have to play alot with stuffing I guess. I'll ask some kid with a small and long arm to put more stuffing when needed until it sounds good😉
and why isnt there any TL's in the line of speakers sold in normal stores like futureshop... $1k range speakers.
i'll be using those with a good amp, for jazz mainly... some rock, but never hip hop and such, got other speakers for that 😉
The dipole mid and tweeter is already made, and sounds awsome.
(same mid and same tweeter as the ones ive posted about before, the unnamed ones (got no money for anythig else..))
the crossover points will be 200hz and 2500 hz, all second order
as for the TL, i got no books, thx to planet10 for his wonderfull website where im trying to extract every information I can 😉
one thing thought,
The start of my tl is like 1.5 x sd and end is like tapered to 2 x sd
that good or bad?
and how does a rear opened TL sound, compared to a fornt opened TL
And i've found no info yet on how qms and qts will affect the whole thing,
Do i really only have to consider only FS?,
as its my first one i'll have to play alot with stuffing I guess. I'll ask some kid with a small and long arm to put more stuffing when needed until it sounds good😉
and why isnt there any TL's in the line of speakers sold in normal stores like futureshop... $1k range speakers.
i'll be using those with a good amp, for jazz mainly... some rock, but never hip hop and such, got other speakers for that 😉
I recently designed and built my first t-line speakers. They turned out even better than I expected.
As to why there aren't more t-line speakers in stores, I suspect that the complexity of building a proper taped-line box and the resulting size and weight are probably the main reasons. Another is probably fashion.
In case you're interested, here's my handiwork:
www.geocities.com/bunkie21
As to why there aren't more t-line speakers in stores, I suspect that the complexity of building a proper taped-line box and the resulting size and weight are probably the main reasons. Another is probably fashion.
In case you're interested, here's my handiwork:
www.geocities.com/bunkie21
Awsome work, excelent website,
hehe the driver im using has the exact same Fs as your's and my TL is 2.1 meters instead of 2.2... 🙂 same "problem" as on ur design.
Only difference is that im using a AR 8" driver i found in a surplus store.. :|
What I really like on your design is the simplicity, I try to go with first order filters when possible too.. and such
One thing ive been wondering is, whats the difference between a front firing one, and a rear firing one, any ideas?
hehe the driver im using has the exact same Fs as your's and my TL is 2.1 meters instead of 2.2... 🙂 same "problem" as on ur design.
Only difference is that im using a AR 8" driver i found in a surplus store.. :|
What I really like on your design is the simplicity, I try to go with first order filters when possible too.. and such
One thing ive been wondering is, whats the difference between a front firing one, and a rear firing one, any ideas?
Ilianh said:
That is kind of weird. Typical now for a TL is 3 or 4:1 taper. You should download Martin's software and give it a go.
The difference shouldn't be to much... you might get a little less midrange leakage with a rear terminus, but those should be pretty well killed by the damping already.
You haven't gotten to the Martin King part of the site yet then. You should go visit Bob Brine's Site and Martin's.
Until recently it wasn't possible to model a TL so it was a lot of work to design a TL, but it is mostly that the boxes are more complex (they can't be as easily rolled off the automated box folding assembly lines) and heavier so they cost more to ship.
And bunkie -- i haven't forgot about getting your project up on the TL site.
dave
holly.....
thats some complicated stuff.. (www.quarter-wave.com)
I'll have to work on it..
anyway,
3 or 4:1?
here most of the people use 1.5:1 ( or similar)
http://www.t-linespeakers.org/design/taper.html
Is there any differences between those
and you are stating on youre website that "Lines with a smaller Start/End ratio have "leaner" bass"
what does that exactly mean?
thats some complicated stuff.. (www.quarter-wave.com)
I'll have to work on it..
anyway,
3 or 4:1?
here most of the people use 1.5:1 ( or similar)
http://www.t-linespeakers.org/design/taper.html
Is there any differences between those
and you are stating on youre website that "Lines with a smaller Start/End ratio have "leaner" bass"
what does that exactly mean?
Ilianh said:
There are 2 kinds of TL design. Classic design which was seat of the pants, cut & try, which is there for historical purposes (and i should make it a bit clearer, i just added a comment to the taper page, thanks for the nudge). Getting a good TL was always as much luck & experience as science.
And now that we have realistic TL models, the virtual design method where the TL can be simulated before it is built. Both King's & Augspurger's work have shown that much larger taper ratios are desirable.
dave
Ilianh said:
Do you have any stuffing in that line? You have some enormous ripples showing up.
Good to see some graphs -- looks like if you can kill the ripple without losing the bottom you could reach into the 30s.
dave
Yes, i do have some stuffing 😉 in very small quantities.. 0.05 lb per cubic foot
By loosing the ripple, I loose that small "spike" wich raises my response at around 35 hz, my F3 gets way lower..
its either I have ripple, or I have a lower F3
i'll try to find something between those 2
I was hoping to use this driver to cover up to 200hz.
By loosing the ripple, I loose that small "spike" wich raises my response at around 35 hz, my F3 gets way lower..
its either I have ripple, or I have a lower F3
i'll try to find something between those 2
I was hoping to use this driver to cover up to 200hz.
Ilianh said:
I'm talking about the big ripples (that look almost like square waves) starting at about 150 hz & up.
dave
ok, hum, when i first opened the worksheet, I looked at Martin King's design, to see what a good design is suposed to look like, and it had alot of ripple too, about as much as I do. I dont see how that ripple is supposed to be bad, when i'll cut this woofer at like 150-200 hz.
I avoid all the ripple thats bigger than 150hz by doing that
If I make it so I wont have ripple, I basicly loose all my bass, i'd have a 5" doing better bass (this is a 8")
and this would need around .9 lbs/ft^3 (the absolute max is 1) so thats alot
an the tl is exactly 1/4 wavelenght of the driver's Fs.
I avoid all the ripple thats bigger than 150hz by doing that
If I make it so I wont have ripple, I basicly loose all my bass, i'd have a 5" doing better bass (this is a 8")
and this would need around .9 lbs/ft^3 (the absolute max is 1) so thats alot
an the tl is exactly 1/4 wavelenght of the driver's Fs.
Ilianh said:
I don't remeber any of Martin's line's having that much ripple. And unless you are using an infinite slope XO you want fairly clean response out an octave or 2 beyond the woofer's cut-off.
What geometry are you using? Have you taken advantage of any of the geometry tricks that help kill ripple? Offset driver, taper, restricted port (aka mass-loading)?
Try shortening the line a bit.
dave
ripple is at expense of bass response.
check Martin's TL Open End.mcd
heres a pic of it, his f3 is lower but his design is good till 200 hz
Im using this same geometry
http://homepage.mac.com/tlinespeakers/TLS/design/foldings/images/RS6_Xparent.JPG
check Martin's TL Open End.mcd
heres a pic of it, his f3 is lower but his design is good till 200 hz
Im using this same geometry
http://homepage.mac.com/tlinespeakers/TLS/design/foldings/images/RS6_Xparent.JPG
Attachments
ok, well heres what i think that is my final version...
reduced ripple, kindof good bass response and phase aint bad
I had to reduce the lenght to 60 " (80" was 1/4 wavelenght)
And had to make a 6:1 sd ratio (wich i dont think is too good ), but as Planet 10 said restricted port could help, and it did.
heres the pic
reduced ripple, kindof good bass response and phase aint bad
I had to reduce the lenght to 60 " (80" was 1/4 wavelenght)
And had to make a 6:1 sd ratio (wich i dont think is too good ), but as Planet 10 said restricted port could help, and it did.
heres the pic
Attachments
I was making my Xo today, and seeing the need in parts for something like a second order 200hz part for the bandpass for the mid on the dipole part...
and if i dont use electrolytics, polyprop ones would cost alot (ALOT) for something like this....
i'd maybe wanna make the cutoff poit a bit higher to reduce costs... something like 500 hz.. what do u guys think?
and if i dont use electrolytics, polyprop ones would cost alot (ALOT) for something like this....
i'd maybe wanna make the cutoff poit a bit higher to reduce costs... something like 500 hz.. what do u guys think?
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