I recovered few beautiful drivers from ewaste, almost brand new. They seem to be Seas or Peerless, but cannot find them on the net:
Bass:
L 15 RC/P-TB1
H1377-08
Tweeter:
25TAFNC/QG-TB
H1223-06
Made in Norway.
I would like to use them for bookshelf speakers, and will probably need some design help as well😉
Bass:
L 15 RC/P-TB1
H1377-08
Tweeter:
25TAFNC/QG-TB
H1223-06
Made in Norway.
I would like to use them for bookshelf speakers, and will probably need some design help as well😉
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I took a flier on the TB designation. It stands for bespoke Tandberg drivers made by SEAS I reckon! 😎
These are actively filtered here I think. F on a SEAS tweeter means ferrofluid. The bass is not dissimilar to some current models like H1141-08 L15RLY/P.
I'd be looking here for ideas:
SEAS 5INCH
These are actively filtered here I think. F on a SEAS tweeter means ferrofluid. The bass is not dissimilar to some current models like H1141-08 L15RLY/P.
I'd be looking here for ideas:
SEAS 5INCH
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Oh, I could have mentioned that Tandberg speaker is called a TTC1 02, if you want to google it more.
I'd guess it's a reflex speaker, since most of SEAS' output is.
If it's like the H1141-08 L15RLY/P, you ought to be able to sweep it on frequency to locate the exact point where it needs a notch with Sweepgen. A 10dB peak around 7-8kHz ought to leap out at you! 🙂
I'd guess it's a reflex speaker, since most of SEAS' output is.
If it's like the H1141-08 L15RLY/P, you ought to be able to sweep it on frequency to locate the exact point where it needs a notch with Sweepgen. A 10dB peak around 7-8kHz ought to leap out at you! 🙂
Thanks a lot Steve, very helpful😉
I did look at Troels site earlier, but I somehow missed that page you pointed out.
I did look at Troels site earlier, but I somehow missed that page you pointed out.
There's more 😉
This one seems to be similar to
H1207-08 L12RCY/P
Having said that, it might be worth putting together another HATT MKIII.
http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/download/Humble Homemade Hifi_HATT Mk-III_copy.pdf
This one seems to be similar to
H1207-08 L12RCY/P
Having said that, it might be worth putting together another HATT MKIII.
http://www.humblehomemadehifi.com/download/Humble Homemade Hifi_HATT Mk-III_copy.pdf
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I thought the two SEAS drivers here were well nigh identical:
H1141-08 L15RLY/P
E0015-08S W15CY001
The Excel W15 just has a bit less inductance due to the copper rings. But not even much. You'd compensate that by adding an ohm to the bass shunt with the Prestige driver in Troels' W15 design.
Tony Gee's series design is going to work out a bit different on phase and level if you change a L12 to a L15 and different tweeter, but nothing you can't adjust by ear with that attenuator on the tweeter. It's quite a forgiving circuit and seemed to work OK with a 5" metal bass. About 12dB/octave on both drivers.
H1141-08 L15RLY/P
E0015-08S W15CY001
The Excel W15 just has a bit less inductance due to the copper rings. But not even much. You'd compensate that by adding an ohm to the bass shunt with the Prestige driver in Troels' W15 design.
Tony Gee's series design is going to work out a bit different on phase and level if you change a L12 to a L15 and different tweeter, but nothing you can't adjust by ear with that attenuator on the tweeter. It's quite a forgiving circuit and seemed to work OK with a 5" metal bass. About 12dB/octave on both drivers.
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The last pic is actually a L12 RC/CP-TB (not L15), that is why I mentioned HATT...
I have two L15s and two L12s. I am thinking of matching L15 with OWII and L12 with TB tweeter.
I have two L15s and two L12s. I am thinking of matching L15 with OWII and L12 with TB tweeter.
Ah, LOTS of drivers, and filters, eh? I think this is called mission creep. 😱
TBH, I didn't much like any of the filters. Though Troels gives you a choice:
DIY-Loudspeakers
Having seen a lot of the same old, same old with metal drivers and notches, I recalled a talk we had with Joachim Gerhard about his Canalis Anima speaker (below) which uses the SEAS L15 and 22TAF/G. Not strictly relevant because it's a BW3 time-aligned, just rather pretty.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/234061-best-6-5-aluminum-driver-2.html
Anyway, to break the mold, here's a derivation of one of Troels' 3 way designs with an OWI. 4th order seems to solve most of the breakup problems in my modelling. Your mileage will vary, of course, with different drivers, but high order filters are not very driver dependent. And it seems to work. Phase is good too, but no-one here ever cares about that. I used a very narrow 15cm baffle here because it seemed to help some diffraction dips. The dotted line is without the LCR notch at 1.5kHz.
TBH, I didn't much like any of the filters. Though Troels gives you a choice:
DIY-Loudspeakers
Having seen a lot of the same old, same old with metal drivers and notches, I recalled a talk we had with Joachim Gerhard about his Canalis Anima speaker (below) which uses the SEAS L15 and 22TAF/G. Not strictly relevant because it's a BW3 time-aligned, just rather pretty.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/234061-best-6-5-aluminum-driver-2.html
Anyway, to break the mold, here's a derivation of one of Troels' 3 way designs with an OWI. 4th order seems to solve most of the breakup problems in my modelling. Your mileage will vary, of course, with different drivers, but high order filters are not very driver dependent. And it seems to work. Phase is good too, but no-one here ever cares about that. I used a very narrow 15cm baffle here because it seemed to help some diffraction dips. The dotted line is without the LCR notch at 1.5kHz.
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That's rather good IMO! I'm impressed. SEAS always do their anechoic measurements in a suitable box. Probably 12 litres here. 🙂
Compares with H1141-08 L15RLY/P
You know you wanted to see the phase response of my suggested 4th order filter, the only variable being notching the bassmid peak around 1.2kHz! And you can do better by adding a tiny 1R to the second bass shunt. These red components aren't preferred values, just what boxsim came up with doing its optimise thing.
Compares with H1141-08 L15RLY/P
You know you wanted to see the phase response of my suggested 4th order filter, the only variable being notching the bassmid peak around 1.2kHz! And you can do better by adding a tiny 1R to the second bass shunt. These red components aren't preferred values, just what boxsim came up with doing its optimise thing.
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Slapped in few off-the-shelf crossover components, and measured again...
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I'm enjoying this thread, zdr! 😀
You're no mug with speakers I can tell. 😎
I have a natural prejudice against metal cones, because they look so horrible on frequency response and phase. I haven't taken one on myself yet. But Joachim Gerhard is still going for them in a big way. His latest design uses this SEAS jobbie:
H1488-08 L16RNX
Metal tweeters I don't mind. Give them a, say, 7.5R and 0.68uF zobel and they don't sizzle so much. My own workshop below. I've been seriously reducing bass coils to get rid of the boominess lately.
You're no mug with speakers I can tell. 😎
I have a natural prejudice against metal cones, because they look so horrible on frequency response and phase. I haven't taken one on myself yet. But Joachim Gerhard is still going for them in a big way. His latest design uses this SEAS jobbie:
H1488-08 L16RNX
Metal tweeters I don't mind. Give them a, say, 7.5R and 0.68uF zobel and they don't sizzle so much. My own workshop below. I've been seriously reducing bass coils to get rid of the boominess lately.
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Well, I am a noob when it comes to speaker design. I have built a few, but designed none so far. If I hadn't run into these babies in need for love, I would probably not even be building the speakers again - too much dust and all. I also need something to do while waiting for my new USB DAC boards to arrive😉
I dug out my ZLCR rig and downloaded Visual Analyser - so I got myself a working ZLCR meter again😉 Problem is, LIMP does not work with any hw I tried, so cannot really measure the impedance and phase... Any other (free) options out there? Maybe Visual Analyser can pull it off?
Visual Analyser
I dug out my ZLCR rig and downloaded Visual Analyser - so I got myself a working ZLCR meter again😉 Problem is, LIMP does not work with any hw I tried, so cannot really measure the impedance and phase... Any other (free) options out there? Maybe Visual Analyser can pull it off?
Visual Analyser
I think you have inadvertently designed one of Joachim Gerhard's simple butterworth filters. He did slip up and tell me that he used second order with metal drivers with good results. And he is the top man with metal drivers IMO. 🙂
These put phase at 90 degrees and you can flip tweeter polarity as often as not, which I won't go into. But it makes for good sound off-axis in most directions. Something to be said for a 9KHz notch (Yes I know the peak LOOKS like it's at 8KHz, but that is wrong...) and a zobel on the tweeter IMO. Cheap components which do good things IMO. Try it.
The bass looks weak and wrong, but when you add room gain it's probably OK. 😎
Should be a twangy sort of speaker that does justice to Rock an' Roll guitar like Dire Straits. Troels would doubtless take down the 1.5kHz mid a bit, but that's HIS style.
These put phase at 90 degrees and you can flip tweeter polarity as often as not, which I won't go into. But it makes for good sound off-axis in most directions. Something to be said for a 9KHz notch (Yes I know the peak LOOKS like it's at 8KHz, but that is wrong...) and a zobel on the tweeter IMO. Cheap components which do good things IMO. Try it.
The bass looks weak and wrong, but when you add room gain it's probably OK. 😎
Should be a twangy sort of speaker that does justice to Rock an' Roll guitar like Dire Straits. Troels would doubtless take down the 1.5kHz mid a bit, but that's HIS style.
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