My view is that everything we hear can be measured, but we don't necessarily measure everything we hear, yet.
The more we take perception into the realm of measurement and math the more we advance our understanding of ourselves and our hobby.
Best,
Erik
You should turn 180 °
That's quite a difficult question requiring a lot of checking! There is another 6" design worth looking at too with the H1217-08 CA18RLY:
CA18RLY/22TAF-G
I can never decide if I really like notch filters, or simple steep rolloff. TBH, the Idunn's drivers appeal to me. That polycone looks really good. I'd then fiddle with the simple crossover a bit. But that's just me.
My choices would be:
1 - Scanspeak Rediscovery Kit - I'm absolutely smitten by the woofer performance. It deserves the crossover upgrade.
2 - Zaph ZASR71
Best!
Erik
System 7, I've been looking at all of the "usual" speaker designer's websites and have not seen the SEAS CA18/RLY/22TAF-G on Troels' website. I'll definitely look into it further.
Erik, I considered the Rediscovery but thought the cabinet constructed with one inch material would be problematic. I would like to know if 3/4 inch material, possibly with a one inch baffle would be acceptable.
I have also considered Zaph's ZRT, Troels' 3-Way Classic and the Seas A26. Ultimately my choice will depend on my budget after a month or two of selling unnecessary things on Ebay.
Zaph|Audio - ZRT - Revelator Tower
SEAS-3-Way-Classic
SEAS A26 Kit
I certainly is easy to get carried away in this hobby, isn't it?
Rick
Erik, I considered the Rediscovery but thought the cabinet constructed with one inch material would be problematic. I would like to know if 3/4 inch material, possibly with a one inch baffle would be acceptable.
I have also considered Zaph's ZRT, Troels' 3-Way Classic and the Seas A26. Ultimately my choice will depend on my budget after a month or two of selling unnecessary things on Ebay.
Zaph|Audio - ZRT - Revelator Tower
SEAS-3-Way-Classic
SEAS A26 Kit
I certainly is easy to get carried away in this hobby, isn't it?
Rick
There's a lot of different ways of doing things in speakers. Hence the differences in crossover between Zaph, MarkK and SEAS and Troels.
What I often do is look at simpler circuits that do the same as the the complex ones, because I like simple when I am building!
CA18RLY/22TAF-G
Here's an example. I reduced that one a lot!
What I often do is look at simpler circuits that do the same as the the complex ones, because I like simple when I am building!
CA18RLY/22TAF-G
Here's an example. I reduced that one a lot!
Attachments
Rick, you can use whatever cabinet thickness for any speaker kit. Thicker is better though! So don't let the recommendation for a 1" thickness make the choice for you.
Also, the Rediscovery fits in a pre-made Dayton cabinet, all you would have to do is cut out the driver holes with a router. Most of these kits Rick Taylor at Taylor Speakers has pre-made drawings for so you can order from him and just drop the drivers in.
There's no comparison to the build quality between them though. Rick does absolutely fantastic work. Best,
Erik
I usually like to set out the choices, rather than say dogmatically one thing is better than another. After all, it's YOUR hobby!
But you have a heap of easy choices with Parts Express cabinets:
Hi-Fi Speaker Cabinets in the Speaker Components Department at Parts Express | 288
These makes it easy for USA builders IMO. Choose a couple of tidy drivers, give it a crossover, and job done. 5" bass needs about 1/4 cu foot. 6.5" needs about 1/2 to 2/3 cu feet. 8" needs about a cu.foot. Double that for an MTM. Seemples.
Personally I often see beat up old speakers in thrift stores that have cabinets I can use. I get bored with carpentry. Which is not to say I am clueless about cabinets:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/223174-interesting-read-i-found-lossy-cabinet-designs-harbeth.html#post3234256
But you have a heap of easy choices with Parts Express cabinets:
Hi-Fi Speaker Cabinets in the Speaker Components Department at Parts Express | 288
These makes it easy for USA builders IMO. Choose a couple of tidy drivers, give it a crossover, and job done. 5" bass needs about 1/4 cu foot. 6.5" needs about 1/2 to 2/3 cu feet. 8" needs about a cu.foot. Double that for an MTM. Seemples.
Personally I often see beat up old speakers in thrift stores that have cabinets I can use. I get bored with carpentry. Which is not to say I am clueless about cabinets:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/223174-interesting-read-i-found-lossy-cabinet-designs-harbeth.html#post3234256
Now you are being penny wise and pound foolish! Please, if you go that route, don't use my name as some one who gave you advice.
Just get the Dayton cabinets then.
Best,
Erik
Hey Pico!
As it turns out my current crossover is external, but for aesthetic reasons I'd really like to consolidate them all into the cabinet. Please tell me what experience you've had that tells you it's a bad idea.
Thanks!
Erik
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Now you are being penny wise and pound foolish! Please, if you go that route, don't use my name as some one who gave you advice.
Hi Erik - believe me - gluing 1/2 inch sheets to get one inch thickness would be a last resort. I anticipate it will be difficult to locate one inch MDF in my area but would exercise all options before "doing the gluing". I may go shopping at Lowes & Home Depot this weekend just to satisfy my curiosity.
Rick
1/2" MDF might be OK for a 5-10L cabinet. I think you want something like 3/4" chipboard or particle board for bigger.
Of course, the real lightweight BBC LS3/5A "lossy" pros go for rigid 1/2" birch ply, as did the builders of the famous FAST Mosquito fighter bomber in WW2. If you have ever sat on a bentwood ply chair, you will appreciate just how rigid this thin stuff is.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/223174-interesting-read-i-found-lossy-cabinet-designs-harbeth.html#post3234256
Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good. Perfectly good cabinets can be simply constructed. It is a noobie mistake to stick wooden battens all over the panels and joins. It actually makes things worse, and causes deep resonances. Really the idea is the vibration FLOWS all around the cabinet. Panel damping then can absorb them. You can use little 2" beech battens at stress points, but NEVER big lengths of pine softwood.
That stuff is 1/4" Regupol acoustic floor underlay. Cork and rubber, which you stick to panels. The light white fluff in my chipboard speakers below is called BAF is to absorb standing waves around 3kHz. I include a big Harbeth M40.1 3 way to show some good ply construction and damping panels, but really the same principles apply to chipboard.
Of course, the real lightweight BBC LS3/5A "lossy" pros go for rigid 1/2" birch ply, as did the builders of the famous FAST Mosquito fighter bomber in WW2. If you have ever sat on a bentwood ply chair, you will appreciate just how rigid this thin stuff is.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/223174-interesting-read-i-found-lossy-cabinet-designs-harbeth.html#post3234256
Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good. Perfectly good cabinets can be simply constructed. It is a noobie mistake to stick wooden battens all over the panels and joins. It actually makes things worse, and causes deep resonances. Really the idea is the vibration FLOWS all around the cabinet. Panel damping then can absorb them. You can use little 2" beech battens at stress points, but NEVER big lengths of pine softwood.
That stuff is 1/4" Regupol acoustic floor underlay. Cork and rubber, which you stick to panels. The light white fluff in my chipboard speakers below is called BAF is to absorb standing waves around 3kHz. I include a big Harbeth M40.1 3 way to show some good ply construction and damping panels, but really the same principles apply to chipboard.
Attachments
I have a question on the crossover for this design. What if i want to use this with one woofer? I know it kills the whole MTM-design but i like to try this one on my idunn. Just because i can ;-).
Now, i am no expert at all at crossovers, but i guess the fact that the two woofers are in parallel means they have an impedance of 4ohm? What needs to be changes in the tweeter cross over section to correct for an 8 ohm impedance when leaving out one woofer?
Thanks for your suggestions
Stefan
Now, i am no expert at all at crossovers, but i guess the fact that the two woofers are in parallel means they have an impedance of 4ohm? What needs to be changes in the tweeter cross over section to correct for an 8 ohm impedance when leaving out one woofer?
Thanks for your suggestions
Stefan
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