If I posted this in the wrong forum please redirect me.
I've built two homemade speaker cabinets that can each handle 1500 watts rms @ 8 ohms and a need an amp that will be able to supply these beasts with some power.
Actually what I want to do is install a DJ amp on each cabinet so that they will be able to power themselves. So far I've searched and since I can't afford to pay 2,3, and 4 thousand dollars for an amp, being that I'm only 14, the best thing I've found is to install two of these numark dimension4 amps
http://www.electronicgiant.net/cata...=4581&osCsid=eb9c549834f8ef6589a9ec93ab8aafe1
which i can get for around $900 all together.
Now that is already more than I can afford but I'm willing to pay it as long as I can get my speakers up and working.
But the reason I'm posting is to see if anyone know of any better deals before I go spending close to a grand on these amplifiers.
Thanx.
I've built two homemade speaker cabinets that can each handle 1500 watts rms @ 8 ohms and a need an amp that will be able to supply these beasts with some power.
Actually what I want to do is install a DJ amp on each cabinet so that they will be able to power themselves. So far I've searched and since I can't afford to pay 2,3, and 4 thousand dollars for an amp, being that I'm only 14, the best thing I've found is to install two of these numark dimension4 amps
http://www.electronicgiant.net/cata...=4581&osCsid=eb9c549834f8ef6589a9ec93ab8aafe1
which i can get for around $900 all together.
Now that is already more than I can afford but I'm willing to pay it as long as I can get my speakers up and working.
But the reason I'm posting is to see if anyone know of any better deals before I go spending close to a grand on these amplifiers.
Thanx.
We need precise details as to what your speakers are.
DJ systems are either bi-amped or tri-amped with an electronic crossover and either two or three amps.
That site you linked to is not an authorized dealer for anything they list. Don't even thing about buying anything from them.
I can help you figure out what you need, but more info please.
DJ systems are either bi-amped or tri-amped with an electronic crossover and either two or three amps.
That site you linked to is not an authorized dealer for anything they list. Don't even thing about buying anything from them.
I can help you figure out what you need, but more info please.
Hi punkrokr1701
I had the same problem for my band.
The best solution is that one than djk:a tri-amped with an electronic crossover .
My personal system is the same with 200W for the low freq.
130W for the mid and 80W for the high.
The quality of this amp it is not the more important thing:reliability is that of which you have need.
The system I have work without problem from 1998.
My amp are overdimensionated: for a 200W the components are the same than a 300W ,and similar for the other amps.
If you follow this philosophy,your system will give many satisfactions to you
I had the same problem for my band.
The best solution is that one than djk:a tri-amped with an electronic crossover .
My personal system is the same with 200W for the low freq.
130W for the mid and 80W for the high.
The quality of this amp it is not the more important thing:reliability is that of which you have need.
The system I have work without problem from 1998.
My amp are overdimensionated: for a 200W the components are the same than a 300W ,and similar for the other amps.
If you follow this philosophy,your system will give many satisfactions to you
Here's some links with all the info I can find about the speakers:
3-3/8" BULLET TWEETER
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=270-055
SELENIUM 6W4P 6" WOOFER
http://www.partsexpress.com/pdf/264-422s.pdf
SELENIUM 12PW5-SLF 12" 300W PA DRIVER
http://www.partsexpress.com/pdf/264-370.pdf
For some reason I can never find anymore info on any tweeter than the basics that are in the link.
Well, I don't know what else I can put up here about the speakers.
Except that I never turn my current system up any louder than the -10db rating on my Denon A/V reciever and the volume starts at -80 db and goes to +10db and I don't intend to turn these speakers up any louder than what I already have.
So don't worry about me damageing my hearing I'm real careful about that because I also never turn my CD player up past 16, maybe 18, which is about half way.
Thanx for the input.
3-3/8" BULLET TWEETER
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=270-055
SELENIUM 6W4P 6" WOOFER
http://www.partsexpress.com/pdf/264-422s.pdf
SELENIUM 12PW5-SLF 12" 300W PA DRIVER
http://www.partsexpress.com/pdf/264-370.pdf
For some reason I can never find anymore info on any tweeter than the basics that are in the link.
Well, I don't know what else I can put up here about the speakers.
Except that I never turn my current system up any louder than the -10db rating on my Denon A/V reciever and the volume starts at -80 db and goes to +10db and I don't intend to turn these speakers up any louder than what I already have.
So don't worry about me damageing my hearing I'm real careful about that because I also never turn my CD player up past 16, maybe 18, which is about half way.
Thanx for the input.
Haha.
punkrokr1701
It is an error to consider a simple volume attenuator position like a power level.The power output of any amp is determined also by the input source level(example,a CD player had,normally,a highest level than a cassette player or a tuner).
Sorry I don't know this speakers.
In onerous situations like a DJ system,it is better to use a well known speakers in order to avoid "muting" situations.
Currently i play with a young people orchestra (it's my job)and i know these problems
It is an error to consider a simple volume attenuator position like a power level.The power output of any amp is determined also by the input source level(example,a CD player had,normally,a highest level than a cassette player or a tuner).
Sorry I don't know this speakers.
In onerous situations like a DJ system,it is better to use a well known speakers in order to avoid "muting" situations.
Currently i play with a young people orchestra (it's my job)and i know these problems
Why do people insist on quoting their speaker wattage output as the sum of all of the driver outputs? If you used an electronic crossover and an amplifier for each driver then yes you could say the system accumalitively uses that much power, but it wouldn't have anywhere near the SPL.
Anyway, you have 2 options, passive crossovers and you will will only need 1 amp, with a max power rating of 300watts, or nearer 600watts if you want to stress your speakers a bit.
Or get a 3way stereo electronic crossover, and buy 3 amps, none of which need to be anywhere near the 1500watts figure you quoted.
The amp for the tweeters needs only be about 50watts (if your main bass speaker is 300watts then at that level the tweeter will consume about 15% of that to retain the same noise level).
Looks like your mid amp need be about 100watt, and your bass amp 300-400watts i would say.
If you actually used 1 of those numark amps per speakerbox (1350watts @ 8ohms bridged) you would kill all of your speakers instantly.
Anyway, you have 2 options, passive crossovers and you will will only need 1 amp, with a max power rating of 300watts, or nearer 600watts if you want to stress your speakers a bit.
Or get a 3way stereo electronic crossover, and buy 3 amps, none of which need to be anywhere near the 1500watts figure you quoted.
The amp for the tweeters needs only be about 50watts (if your main bass speaker is 300watts then at that level the tweeter will consume about 15% of that to retain the same noise level).
Looks like your mid amp need be about 100watt, and your bass amp 300-400watts i would say.
If you actually used 1 of those numark amps per speakerbox (1350watts @ 8ohms bridged) you would kill all of your speakers instantly.
Sorry, also forgot to mention i'd go with the electronic crossovers and 3 seperate amps otherwise you're going to need attenuators, at 1watt your midrange is twice as loud as your bass speaker and your treble is twice as loud as your midrange. The sensitivities vary a great deal, so some volume tweaking is going to be needed.
hi Elaar,
you can try to teach, but he won't listen.
(For the benefit of our listening readers.)
I think you need to adjust your recommended power to take account of driver sensitivity.
Sensitivty ranges from 91db to 99db/2.83Vac, a factor of 6.3.
So, if the mid driver can take 100W (or 200W if you take care to never overload the system) then the tweeter needs only 15.8W (32W). Peak SPL from the tweeter is about 114db if it can take a 32Wpk signal.
Why on earth (in room) he thinks he needs three tweeters is beyond me.
you can try to teach, but he won't listen.
(For the benefit of our listening readers.)
I think you need to adjust your recommended power to take account of driver sensitivity.
Sensitivty ranges from 91db to 99db/2.83Vac, a factor of 6.3.
So, if the mid driver can take 100W (or 200W if you take care to never overload the system) then the tweeter needs only 15.8W (32W). Peak SPL from the tweeter is about 114db if it can take a 32Wpk signal.
Why on earth (in room) he thinks he needs three tweeters is beyond me.
Hi AndrewT,
I've got a question that is on-topic that i've always wondered about, just wondering if you can enlighten me
How does the output (SPL) alter when you have multiple exact drivers playing the same sound compared to just one?
I always assumed that if you measured the SPL output infront of say 2 bass speakers next to each other, the SPL at that single point would be the same as that taken infront of just 1 bass speaker, but the 2 bass speaker system would "appear" louder because it radiates/disperses at an improved angle, this i'm assuming to be wrong (and rather simplified).
elaar
I've got a question that is on-topic that i've always wondered about, just wondering if you can enlighten me
How does the output (SPL) alter when you have multiple exact drivers playing the same sound compared to just one?
I always assumed that if you measured the SPL output infront of say 2 bass speakers next to each other, the SPL at that single point would be the same as that taken infront of just 1 bass speaker, but the 2 bass speaker system would "appear" louder because it radiates/disperses at an improved angle, this i'm assuming to be wrong (and rather simplified).
elaar
Hi,
if the two bass speakers are close together they gain in sensitivity by about +3db.
If you drive them with exactly the same power as the original one then they are louder by this +3db.
This also applies to all other pairs of drivers IF the separation distance is close compared to the wavelength of the signal being reproduced. This gain will drop off as you approach mid frquencies due to the size of the bass basket.
I'm not sure what happens with the D'appolito (how is that spelt?) arrangement when the two mid drivers have the single treble in between. The gap seems a bit large for mid frequencies to see that sensitivity gain. There is also the interference problem when listening off axis to think about. Bass is omnidirectional, mid is becoming directional and this causes lobing in the polar response. Bass is much simpler if it weren't for the room effects.
There is a further gain to be made.
The two bass drivers will draw nearly double the power from a robust power amp when they are paralleled. This gives rise to a further near +3db gain in SPL. A poor amplifier might only gain +1db when asked to drive paralleled drivers.
The total gain when doubling up bass drivers of the same impedance to a power amp is nearly +6db. If two amplifiers are used, each dedicated to a bass driver then the full +3db SPL increase will be achieved.
if the two bass speakers are close together they gain in sensitivity by about +3db.
If you drive them with exactly the same power as the original one then they are louder by this +3db.
This also applies to all other pairs of drivers IF the separation distance is close compared to the wavelength of the signal being reproduced. This gain will drop off as you approach mid frquencies due to the size of the bass basket.
I'm not sure what happens with the D'appolito (how is that spelt?) arrangement when the two mid drivers have the single treble in between. The gap seems a bit large for mid frequencies to see that sensitivity gain. There is also the interference problem when listening off axis to think about. Bass is omnidirectional, mid is becoming directional and this causes lobing in the polar response. Bass is much simpler if it weren't for the room effects.
There is a further gain to be made.
The two bass drivers will draw nearly double the power from a robust power amp when they are paralleled. This gives rise to a further near +3db gain in SPL. A poor amplifier might only gain +1db when asked to drive paralleled drivers.
The total gain when doubling up bass drivers of the same impedance to a power amp is nearly +6db. If two amplifiers are used, each dedicated to a bass driver then the full +3db SPL increase will be achieved.
AndrewT: I disagree about the paralleled speakers part, because the current when pralleld doubles, but divides equally into the two speakers (voltage on the pair remains the same as if on connected), which makes them work the same as if conected to separate amps. The overall gain is only +3dB and less (depending on the amp quality).
I modeled the woofers in BassBox v6.0
Two in parallel will be about 102dB/2.83V1M at 100hz for small signals. 300W at any frequency below 120hz will cause the driver to exceed x-max in a maximally flat tuned box (Fb=50hz), the F3=70hz.
The tweeter with it's 1" coil will handle maybe 10W continuous, or 100W program material if crossed over above 4Khz at 18dB or steeper.
The mid-bass is a 91dB 1.3" coil unit intended for car stereo.
The less said about all of these drivers, the better.
If they came from Parts Express less than 45 days ago, they may be returned for a full credit towards something useful. Depending on whether of not he has started on the cabinets, and how big they are, they may be salvageable.
I would propose a bi-amped system at about 150hz, with a passive crossover for the high frequency driver. It would be best to start with a clean sheet of paper, but we need to know exactly where he's at on the details.
Two in parallel will be about 102dB/2.83V1M at 100hz for small signals. 300W at any frequency below 120hz will cause the driver to exceed x-max in a maximally flat tuned box (Fb=50hz), the F3=70hz.
The tweeter with it's 1" coil will handle maybe 10W continuous, or 100W program material if crossed over above 4Khz at 18dB or steeper.
The mid-bass is a 91dB 1.3" coil unit intended for car stereo.
The less said about all of these drivers, the better.
If they came from Parts Express less than 45 days ago, they may be returned for a full credit towards something useful. Depending on whether of not he has started on the cabinets, and how big they are, they may be salvageable.
I would propose a bi-amped system at about 150hz, with a passive crossover for the high frequency driver. It would be best to start with a clean sheet of paper, but we need to know exactly where he's at on the details.
Hey guys, I am listening to everything you post up here are, trust me, I think about everything thing that is said in here.
Just don't underestimate because I'm 14
and though I admit I am still nieve I'm an very smart person and I do consider everything that is said.
So please tell me what I need to do, teach me I'm ready to learn.
Thanx.
Just don't underestimate because I'm 14
and though I admit I am still nieve I'm an very smart person and I do consider everything that is said.
So please tell me what I need to do, teach me I'm ready to learn.
Thanx.
Well my young man, you might have to be patient and wait a few years - just go on and play with your beasts, enjoy life and save your money - in your age things go very fast, things change so quick and before you know of it you will be doing it very differently, trust me you will learn when time comes
But if you really want to spend money, maybe a parametric equalizer could give you some fun
But if you really want to spend money, maybe a parametric equalizer could give you some fun
Hi Ku,
which part of my answer do you not agree with?
The sensitivity increase or the nearly power doubling increase if using a good amplifier?
When you halve the impedance of the load on an amplifier the voltage does not remain the same.
The closer to maximum output the worse the extra loading affects the output voltage.
Two identical amps will be capable of delivering more power into two speaker (or resistive) loads than one of those amps into half the load impedance.
The overall gain is the combination of the sensitivity gain and the extra power gain.
which part of my answer do you not agree with?
The sensitivity increase or the nearly power doubling increase if using a good amplifier?
wrong.
When you halve the impedance of the load on an amplifier the voltage does not remain the same.
The closer to maximum output the worse the extra loading affects the output voltage.
no it doesn't.
Two identical amps will be capable of delivering more power into two speaker (or resistive) loads than one of those amps into half the load impedance.
no.
The overall gain is the combination of the sensitivity gain and the extra power gain.
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