Hello folks,
I'm new here. I have a moth flutterbuster tt psu. It is not working at the moment. Everytime I power the unit up , it blows the internal fuse (600mA). There is a 47R wirewound resistor in the circuit , just infront of the Fuse, i believe that this is now open circuit and there fore it has probably burnt out. I would like to try and get the unit back up and running, even if that means putting it into a repair shop.
Do any of you guys have any experience of this unit and also does anybody have any literature, eg Circuit schematic or just a user manual that they could get to me.
Even if this does not help me it will assist the fixer in the reapir shop.
The unit has a 240v 50Hz input and a 200 - 230v output at either 50 or 67.5 Hz , depending on the toggle switch position. It designed to power a TT with a 'Basik' type PSU and a AC syncronous motor , eg Systemdek iiX , Thorens, Linn LP12 etc.
I have taken some pictures of the unit and you can see them here. it looks like quite a simple unit with a fairly low parts count. It is a few years old now though so i don't know how many of the components are still available, or even what some of them are. If any body could assist and would like to play 'spot the component' i would appreciate it, I have filled in the blanks that I think i know .
1) 47R wirewound ceramic resistor (open circuit !)
2) Fuse 600mA ( in series with #1 from live supply)
3) ??? has 4 legs and W08G9102 written on it
4) Diodes (IN4002)
5) Transistor (TIP49 )
6) Polystyrene/foil Capaicitor ????
7) Transistor ( TIP 50 )
8) OP AMP ?? LN324N
9) Trimming Capacitor ??
10) Transistors ?? ( BC 546 )
11) Capacitor
12) Capacitor
13) Diode ??? ( PH 12 ?? )
14) IC ?? ( M706B1 )
15) Crystal Oscilators
16) Green LED
17) Toggle switch
As you may have gathered , I am a keen Hi-Fi enthusiast with a basic knowledge of Electrics, electronic circuits are not one of my strong points but i am working on improving that knowledge. Im probably won't try to fix this myself , however it would be good to know a little bit about the circuit, for when i take it to the repair shop. Any help greatly appreciated.
Here's the Pic:
Circuit board picture
Regards
S&C
I'm new here. I have a moth flutterbuster tt psu. It is not working at the moment. Everytime I power the unit up , it blows the internal fuse (600mA). There is a 47R wirewound resistor in the circuit , just infront of the Fuse, i believe that this is now open circuit and there fore it has probably burnt out. I would like to try and get the unit back up and running, even if that means putting it into a repair shop.
Do any of you guys have any experience of this unit and also does anybody have any literature, eg Circuit schematic or just a user manual that they could get to me.
Even if this does not help me it will assist the fixer in the reapir shop.
The unit has a 240v 50Hz input and a 200 - 230v output at either 50 or 67.5 Hz , depending on the toggle switch position. It designed to power a TT with a 'Basik' type PSU and a AC syncronous motor , eg Systemdek iiX , Thorens, Linn LP12 etc.
I have taken some pictures of the unit and you can see them here. it looks like quite a simple unit with a fairly low parts count. It is a few years old now though so i don't know how many of the components are still available, or even what some of them are. If any body could assist and would like to play 'spot the component' i would appreciate it, I have filled in the blanks that I think i know .
1) 47R wirewound ceramic resistor (open circuit !)
2) Fuse 600mA ( in series with #1 from live supply)
3) ??? has 4 legs and W08G9102 written on it
4) Diodes (IN4002)
5) Transistor (TIP49 )
6) Polystyrene/foil Capaicitor ????
7) Transistor ( TIP 50 )
8) OP AMP ?? LN324N
9) Trimming Capacitor ??
10) Transistors ?? ( BC 546 )
11) Capacitor
12) Capacitor
13) Diode ??? ( PH 12 ?? )
14) IC ?? ( M706B1 )
15) Crystal Oscilators
16) Green LED
17) Toggle switch
As you may have gathered , I am a keen Hi-Fi enthusiast with a basic knowledge of Electrics, electronic circuits are not one of my strong points but i am working on improving that knowledge. Im probably won't try to fix this myself , however it would be good to know a little bit about the circuit, for when i take it to the repair shop. Any help greatly appreciated.
Here's the Pic:
Circuit board picture
Regards
S&C
Oh well, I've done a little more investigating and can now fill in a few more holes, only because my Valhalla PSU board has tell tale component idents 😉
I reckon:
No 3) is a bridge rectifier, makes sense now as it has 2 x s marks and + & - for the AC/DC connections
No14 ) is a Zener diode
Regards
S&C
flutterbuster
I used to own one of these.Driving an Airpax motor
there was absolutely no audible difference between
it and the ordinary resistor/capacitor arrangement supplied by the T/T manufacturer (Manticore)
IMO it is a con.
I used to own one of these.Driving an Airpax motor
there was absolutely no audible difference between
it and the ordinary resistor/capacitor arrangement supplied by the T/T manufacturer (Manticore)
IMO it is a con.
Hi Supermodel,
Thanks for replying.
My current record player ( Old Linn LP12) only has 33 rpm facility. I would like to be able to play my 45 rpm records, i was hoping that this cheap little unit would allow me to do that. 45's sound terrible at 33 rpm 🙂 . I used to own a Linn 45 rpm pulley adaptor however it is such a tight interference fit that i was scared of breaking something whilst fitting it . I only used it once, then sold it.
A linn lingo AC psu or a DC motor/psu conversion kit are out of my price range at the moment.
Thanks for replying.
My current record player ( Old Linn LP12) only has 33 rpm facility. I would like to be able to play my 45 rpm records, i was hoping that this cheap little unit would allow me to do that. 45's sound terrible at 33 rpm 🙂 . I used to own a Linn 45 rpm pulley adaptor however it is such a tight interference fit that i was scared of breaking something whilst fitting it . I only used it once, then sold it.
A linn lingo AC psu or a DC motor/psu conversion kit are out of my price range at the moment.
I have a Flutterbuster which I have used with a Rega - big difference- and also with a Pink Triangle Export. The PT had its own power supply board but I found that using the Flutterbuster to clean up the mains before it entered the PT's own board made a surprising improvement. It was well worth while. (I now have a battery driven Gyrodec, which is much better.)
Why not phone up Moth? I've always found them helpful - I think the knowledgable guy is called Mike. THey can tell you the most common problems with the unit. I did have problems with the Flutterbuster at first and had it repaired under warranty. I got the impression there was a bug in the design (Paravicini), but I had no more problems with it.
Why not phone up Moth? I've always found them helpful - I think the knowledgable guy is called Mike. THey can tell you the most common problems with the unit. I did have problems with the Flutterbuster at first and had it repaired under warranty. I got the impression there was a bug in the design (Paravicini), but I had no more problems with it.
Hi,
I did contact Moth in the first instance and got this reply :
"No wiring details available, we stopped production of the unit some 6/8 years ago.
Remove the 13A plug from the turntable, and replace with an IEC plug, suitable to fit the socket on the rear of the Flutterbuster. Connect the Flutterbuster to the mains.
Mike Harris
Moth Group"
Not really that useful but worth a try. i would have thought that a manufacturer might have kept a copy of the circuit schematic , just for their archive , but obviously not. I would hope to get more than 6 years of life out of most of my Electrical components so this has made me think twice about this brand.
Regards
Sid
I did contact Moth in the first instance and got this reply :
"No wiring details available, we stopped production of the unit some 6/8 years ago.
Remove the 13A plug from the turntable, and replace with an IEC plug, suitable to fit the socket on the rear of the Flutterbuster. Connect the Flutterbuster to the mains.
Mike Harris
Moth Group"
Not really that useful but worth a try. i would have thought that a manufacturer might have kept a copy of the circuit schematic , just for their archive , but obviously not. I would hope to get more than 6 years of life out of most of my Electrical components so this has made me think twice about this brand.
Regards
Sid
Hello folks,
just a quick update for the Archive. the fault was traced to two x transformers having stright short circuits and a third one being 'Leaky'.
I'm trying to find an alternative or better still original of one of the IC's. The details are
Manufacturer : SGS-Thomson Microelectronics
Part Number: M706B1 or 88925
(vague) Description: DIL8 IC,
I don't know what it is or what it does, i do know that it sits in a DIL8 socket and so is easy to replace, I'd like to have a suitable spare for the future 'just in case'. Any help tracing this part greatfully appreciated , i have checked all the (limited ) places that i know where to look. Thanks.
just a quick update for the Archive. the fault was traced to two x transformers having stright short circuits and a third one being 'Leaky'.
I'm trying to find an alternative or better still original of one of the IC's. The details are
Manufacturer : SGS-Thomson Microelectronics
Part Number: M706B1 or 88925
(vague) Description: DIL8 IC,
I don't know what it is or what it does, i do know that it sits in a DIL8 socket and so is easy to replace, I'd like to have a suitable spare for the future 'just in case'. Any help tracing this part greatfully appreciated , i have checked all the (limited ) places that i know where to look. Thanks.
The M706B1 is a 16 stage frequency divider chip, can't find an equivalent,
divides down the crystal (to the left) frequencies to something usable.
(highly unlikely to go wrong, except being phutted by the power supply)
🙂 sreten.
P.S. by transformers I assume you actually meant transistors 😉
I would have replied suggesting some basic checks, but as your
an electronics amateur and its a mains voltage circuit, I didn't.
divides down the crystal (to the left) frequencies to something usable.
(highly unlikely to go wrong, except being phutted by the power supply)
🙂 sreten.
P.S. by transformers I assume you actually meant transistors 😉
I would have replied suggesting some basic checks, but as your
an electronics amateur and its a mains voltage circuit, I didn't.
Correct. Spell checked but not proof read. 😱
Thanks very much for your reply, much appreciated. If you do have any suggestions for checking things out , i'm all ears and eager to give them a go. I'm actually a Commercial Aircraft Maintenance Engineer by trade (20+ years) . Working with potentially lethal voltages is something that i regularly have to do at work and have a healthy respect for. Working with discrete/individual electronic components and circuits is something that i will admit is fairly new to me , but i feel i am learning all the time. Learning from personal experience is the only way in my book. I reckon I'm reasonably handy with a DMM and have acomplished quite a few electrical/electronic projects over the last few months, always putting the safety of myself and others first and erring on the side of caution. If i'm not sure of something I always ask first !
Here's my little online photo album that I've put together over the last few months, any further ideas that you could give will be greatly appreciated :
Sids Photo album
As you can surmise its a simple 250V AC regenerator
circuit, the output frequuency being quartz locked.
Its name "FlutterBuster" is entirely misleading as mains
frequency variations are minimal and do not cause
flutter when then occur as the variation is too slow.
It should guarantee a fully symmetric AC signal to the motor.
Its main crudity is its plug-in compatibility, it still relies on the
basic resistor and capacitor phase network for the motor.
🙂 sreten.
A few things I would have done :
A bit of tracing to work out the basic power supply
arrangements and where the output comes from.
1) check the power supply capacitors, on your DMM on
resistance you you should be able to charge and discharge
them, no evidence of a short, i.e. constant resistance.
2) checked the diode bridge for a short.
3) Removed and check the four output transistors, DMM on
resistance they should measure as a pair of back to back
diodes C to B to E with no path from collector to emitter.
NPN and PNP the "diodes" are in opposite direction.
3) Because I'm slightly reckless powered it up with the 4
output transistors removed to see if the fuse still blows.
circuit, the output frequuency being quartz locked.
Its name "FlutterBuster" is entirely misleading as mains
frequency variations are minimal and do not cause
flutter when then occur as the variation is too slow.
It should guarantee a fully symmetric AC signal to the motor.
Its main crudity is its plug-in compatibility, it still relies on the
basic resistor and capacitor phase network for the motor.
🙂 sreten.
A few things I would have done :
A bit of tracing to work out the basic power supply
arrangements and where the output comes from.
1) check the power supply capacitors, on your DMM on
resistance you you should be able to charge and discharge
them, no evidence of a short, i.e. constant resistance.
2) checked the diode bridge for a short.
3) Removed and check the four output transistors, DMM on
resistance they should measure as a pair of back to back
diodes C to B to E with no path from collector to emitter.
NPN and PNP the "diodes" are in opposite direction.
3) Because I'm slightly reckless powered it up with the 4
output transistors removed to see if the fuse still blows.
I came across this thread while searching for M706B1 on Google to find out what it was.
I'm repairing my dad's turntable PSU because he plugged it in after dropping it. It's very similar to this picture: Link (Copied link from above). It uses 2 M706B1's, 1 for each frequency and a LM324N Quad Op-amp.
There are 2 TIP50's in it and on one of them, the Collector and Emitter is shorted and there's evidence that they've both got very hot (burn marks on PCB).
I've checked the TIP50 datasheet and it's current rating is only 1A.
What would be a suitable replacement with a higher current rating?
I have an old spare cheap ATX PSU that uses 2 NPN E13009L transistors for the switching section. These have an Absolute Maximum Rating of 24A collector current in pulse mode (12A in DC mode).
Obviously a turntable will draw much less than that but would using these affect the output frequency/voltage and sound of my dad's LP's?
I'm repairing my dad's turntable PSU because he plugged it in after dropping it. It's very similar to this picture: Link (Copied link from above). It uses 2 M706B1's, 1 for each frequency and a LM324N Quad Op-amp.
There are 2 TIP50's in it and on one of them, the Collector and Emitter is shorted and there's evidence that they've both got very hot (burn marks on PCB).
I've checked the TIP50 datasheet and it's current rating is only 1A.
What would be a suitable replacement with a higher current rating?
I have an old spare cheap ATX PSU that uses 2 NPN E13009L transistors for the switching section. These have an Absolute Maximum Rating of 24A collector current in pulse mode (12A in DC mode).
Obviously a turntable will draw much less than that but would using these affect the output frequency/voltage and sound of my dad's LP's?
I know this is an old thread, but just wondering....are these Flutterbusters and the silimar product from Moth Group/HiFiNews Accessory Club, called the PureCycle, suitable just for Airpax type 110v motors? I'm wondering, as they have a UK mains voltage output, whether they could be used with more powerful motors such as Garrard 401s, or even with a DAC?
vintageaxeman - sorry, no, they only just provide enough power for the airpax type.
I will add to the old caution in the thread above - the internal design is horrible from a safety POV / dangerous since the design is NOT isolated from the mains and with parts like the control switch ( a metal toggle on the one I was given to look at) having totally inadequate clearance/creepage distance from live to mains power. Not recommended!
I will add to the old caution in the thread above - the internal design is horrible from a safety POV / dangerous since the design is NOT isolated from the mains and with parts like the control switch ( a metal toggle on the one I was given to look at) having totally inadequate clearance/creepage distance from live to mains power. Not recommended!
I remember the original design description in hi fi news and remember it did mention about powering 301/401's.
Typed pure cycle power supply and was taken to this page. Ben Duncan's Pure cycle
Reading the information there it does suggest it can be tweaked for 301's etc.
Typed pure cycle power supply and was taken to this page. Ben Duncan's Pure cycle
Reading the information there it does suggest it can be tweaked for 301's etc.
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Ben Duncan's 'Pure Cycle' is a fundamentally different and considerably more-refined thing - an transformer-isolated LV , regulated, split-rail supply, feeding both a very-low-distortion oscillator and a small power amplifier, into an output transformer used to step-up voltage to serve mains-AC motors as used in many turntables.
In other words - the thing done right, and a world away from the 'Flutterbuster' which, let me re-iterate more clearly- is a potential diy deathtrap.
In other words - the thing done right, and a world away from the 'Flutterbuster' which, let me re-iterate more clearly- is a potential diy deathtrap.