This sounds very promising Steve! .
I made 1 litre bass reflex desk top speakers which are surplus to requirements. The sound nice but unfortunately a lot of port noise even with the biggest I could fit in the cabinets .
Could these be separatly housed within the cabinet in a 2" OPEN backed and stuffed tube going from the baffle through the back of the cabinet (hope that makes sense ) think I have seen this done on another build .
I made 1 litre bass reflex desk top speakers which are surplus to requirements. The sound nice but unfortunately a lot of port noise even with the biggest I could fit in the cabinets .
Could these be separatly housed within the cabinet in a 2" OPEN backed and stuffed tube going from the baffle through the back of the cabinet (hope that makes sense ) think I have seen this done on another build .
Using the CHN as midTweeter would be killer, but i question whether it is the right approach with the CHP-70.2.
I’d try the Monacor, the CHP just needs some help above its purposely shelved down top. That the roll-off ends in a shelf does make XO harder.
If a better tweeter would help i have a couple very small dayton tweeters i’d be happy to donate for the cost of shipping (but given the curren tstate of the plague i don’t know who long it would take even by air)
I don’t recall doing a passive for those 1st FF85wKeN/SF W14, but i must have coubled something together, they were played (to great accolades) with John’s 6G4B PP amp.
I really liked this box, but the drivers got repurposed for Tysen V2.
dave
I’d try the Monacor, the CHP just needs some help above its purposely shelved down top. That the roll-off ends in a shelf does make XO harder.
If a better tweeter would help i have a couple very small dayton tweeters i’d be happy to donate for the cost of shipping (but given the curren tstate of the plague i don’t know who long it would take even by air)
I don’t recall doing a passive for those 1st FF85wKeN/SF W14, but i must have coubled something together, they were played (to great accolades) with John’s 6G4B PP amp.
I really liked this box, but the drivers got repurposed for Tysen V2.
dave
I'm a bit nervous of getting involved in this one! Because so many people here are more experienced with this sort of thing. Dave, Scott, Michael Chua.
FWIW, Dave, Simon has a 85dB 2" fullranger already: Fountek FR58EX 2" Neodymium Full Range Speaker Driver
Looks promising to me.
I am just wary of the Monacor HT-22/8 here. It needs a steep rolloff above 3kHz at its best. To match that, you might need some steep and high order rolloff on the 5" fullranger, and that would defeat the object of simplicity.
I don't see why you shouldn't keep the Founteks in their 1L box, and use it on top of a new one with the bigger CHP 70.2. It does look to me like the Fountek is more of a closed box driver in this application. It ought to be easy enough to make a low order crossover. FWIW, you just can't use them open backed in the same enclosure as a bass unit. They interact too much, which will distort.
But I want to see what Michael Chua came up with too. I suppose I could email him myself for confidentiality. I really don't like sounding all confident with other people's projects unless I have tried something similar myself. Maybe Michael could look in here, along with Scott and Dave's usual contribution.
Just a thought, but it always helps to know the DC resistance of the drivers. Can you measure them with a multimeter? Fountek are a bit vague.
FWIW, Dave, Simon has a 85dB 2" fullranger already: Fountek FR58EX 2" Neodymium Full Range Speaker Driver
Looks promising to me.
I am just wary of the Monacor HT-22/8 here. It needs a steep rolloff above 3kHz at its best. To match that, you might need some steep and high order rolloff on the 5" fullranger, and that would defeat the object of simplicity.
I don't see why you shouldn't keep the Founteks in their 1L box, and use it on top of a new one with the bigger CHP 70.2. It does look to me like the Fountek is more of a closed box driver in this application. It ought to be easy enough to make a low order crossover. FWIW, you just can't use them open backed in the same enclosure as a bass unit. They interact too much, which will distort.
But I want to see what Michael Chua came up with too. I suppose I could email him myself for confidentiality. I really don't like sounding all confident with other people's projects unless I have tried something similar myself. Maybe Michael could look in here, along with Scott and Dave's usual contribution.
Just a thought, but it always helps to know the DC resistance of the drivers. Can you measure them with a multimeter? Fountek are a bit vague.
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OK, 85 dB is a ways from the 82 dB i saw earlier. If it is that sensitive one might be able to make it work.
I am not an XO designer (or not a very experienced one).
dave
I am not an XO designer (or not a very experienced one).
dave
I wonder if this Monacor DT-74/8 might be a plan?
Monacor DT-74/8 Miniture HiFi Dome Tweeter, 8Ω 30Wmax from Monacor PS8.28
Looks similar to the Audax TW010E1:
Audax TW010E1 10 mm Polymer Dome Tweeter
Then you can just go with Michael Chua's design:
Markaudio CHP-70-P Gen2 with Audax TW010E1 – AmpsLab
Box differences aside. I don't think we want that tiny 1.7L box he used with a subwoofer.
Edit, I've just thought of another balanced drive polymer tweeter which looks even better:
Visaton SC 5, 8 Ohm, 0.5 Inch - Dome Driver – Impact Audio
Thing is, the Audax is hard to get in the UK.
Monacor DT-74/8 Miniture HiFi Dome Tweeter, 8Ω 30Wmax from Monacor PS8.28
Looks similar to the Audax TW010E1:
Audax TW010E1 10 mm Polymer Dome Tweeter
Then you can just go with Michael Chua's design:
Markaudio CHP-70-P Gen2 with Audax TW010E1 – AmpsLab
Box differences aside. I don't think we want that tiny 1.7L box he used with a subwoofer.
Edit, I've just thought of another balanced drive polymer tweeter which looks even better:
Visaton SC 5, 8 Ohm, 0.5 Inch - Dome Driver – Impact Audio
Thing is, the Audax is hard to get in the UK.
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I have a bunch of those (with different/smaller) bezel for give away.
I’d hesitate to use them below 5k.
dave
I've used those sort of tiny "balanced drive" tweeters myself. Balanced drive because the dome weighs as much as the surround. I think you are quite right to not go below 5kHz. And Michael Chua seemed to take that onboard.
Markaudio CHP-70-P Gen2 with Audax TW010E1 – AmpsLab
But they can work very well. I was just looking at the Visaton SC5:
SC 5 - 8 Ohm | Visaton
I'm not quite sure about this, but the optimiser in Boxsim might have problems with an incomplete driver file, can't remember, but it is quite easy to simulate for frequency response: Software | Visaton
A typical project with a couple of 3" fullrangers is easily put into the projekte folder with Boxsim, and off you go: CT Center 81 – Boxsim Projektdatenbank
Looks like this:
CT CENTER 81 | Visaton
Just gives you ideas. But really, I'm interested in Michael Chua's ideas here. He's done it. No disrespect intended. You are the fullranger expert! LOL
Markaudio CHP-70-P Gen2 with Audax TW010E1 – AmpsLab
But they can work very well. I was just looking at the Visaton SC5:
SC 5 - 8 Ohm | Visaton
I'm not quite sure about this, but the optimiser in Boxsim might have problems with an incomplete driver file, can't remember, but it is quite easy to simulate for frequency response: Software | Visaton
A typical project with a couple of 3" fullrangers is easily put into the projekte folder with Boxsim, and off you go: CT Center 81 – Boxsim Projektdatenbank
Looks like this:
CT CENTER 81 | Visaton
Just gives you ideas. But really, I'm interested in Michael Chua's ideas here. He's done it. No disrespect intended. You are the fullranger expert! LOL
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If you want an inexpensive dome tweeter, then have a gander at the Seas 19TAFD/G. Overlooked because it's inexpensive. If you use it right, it also happens to be very good. I don't have time to work up a full design at present, which is a trifle moot until the baffle dimensions and desired voicing are known. But if you work it right, with that unit, 2nd order electical HP with a damping shunt resistor should get you in the right region; possibly minor level padding upstream of the series cap. Depends what you do with the low pass of course. As a broad point, the CHP has a very shallow cone profile so there is somewhat less acoustic offset compared to some other units. With a cone tweeter, there's little in the direct front-rear plane, so any minor delay needed tends to come from the vertical offset.
Bargain at that price. 😉 Harbeth use a version of it in a couple of models IIRC. The short-lived MBA also used it for their two products; from a performance POV, they deserved to do better, there was never much wrong with the sound. BTW, your book should now be on the way Dave, I got a message from the courier -they've had to change some scheduling due to the virus lockdown.
Been there, worn the T-Shirt. Washed it, Ironed it! Put new ferrofluid in it.... 😀
H0532-08 19TAFD/G
Have sent His Chuaness an email. Await further developments. I'm not going anywhere. His Borisness has ordered me to stay at home via Text Message. 😱
H0532-08 19TAFD/G
Have sent His Chuaness an email. Await further developments. I'm not going anywhere. His Borisness has ordered me to stay at home via Text Message. 😱
A text from our Great Leader ��
I look forward to hearing any further information. I took a good look at Ampslab and he definitely has done a lot with the chp70 so hopefully some ideas .
Cheers Simon
I look forward to hearing any further information. I took a good look at Ampslab and he definitely has done a lot with the chp70 so hopefully some ideas .
Cheers Simon
MIchael Chua, what a gent, got back to me with some helpful data. He's busy amplifiering at the moment, so can't look in.
Anyhoo, it's all simple enough and doable.
And I do think the Visaton SC5 tweeter will just slot in.
He is planning a bigger version himself, using a simple bit of bafflestep.
The simple circuit is just 5 components. The bafflestep version an extra 4, but reusing the other 5.
I'd go for it, Simon. 😎
Anyhoo, it's all simple enough and doable.
And I do think the Visaton SC5 tweeter will just slot in.
He is planning a bigger version himself, using a simple bit of bafflestep.
The simple circuit is just 5 components. The bafflestep version an extra 4, but reusing the other 5.
I'd go for it, Simon. 😎
Loudspeaker Projects – Passive, Active & Time Aligned – AmpsLab
I seem to remember that B&Q will cut sheet of timber to size for nothing. 10 cuts free or something.
You might scout out Wilmslow and Impact for most of the bits:
Speaker Repair, Speaker Kits, Loudspeaker Repair, Kits and Drive Units, Subwoofer Amplifier Kit
Impact Audio - Visaton Loudspeakers, TEAC, Myryad & Roksan HiFi Sy
Both do generic circuit boards.
Soldering Irons at Screwfix, IIRC.
Seems to me you could do all sorts of things from a simple 10L reflex box to a FrugelHorn III:
Fullrange speaker kits | KJF Audio
From what I've seen, it will work just as a fullranger to get you started. But does fall away at 5kHz.
I seem to remember that B&Q will cut sheet of timber to size for nothing. 10 cuts free or something.
You might scout out Wilmslow and Impact for most of the bits:
Speaker Repair, Speaker Kits, Loudspeaker Repair, Kits and Drive Units, Subwoofer Amplifier Kit
Impact Audio - Visaton Loudspeakers, TEAC, Myryad & Roksan HiFi Sy
Both do generic circuit boards.
Soldering Irons at Screwfix, IIRC.
Seems to me you could do all sorts of things from a simple 10L reflex box to a FrugelHorn III:
Fullrange speaker kits | KJF Audio
From what I've seen, it will work just as a fullranger to get you started. But does fall away at 5kHz.