If you have a problem just get them back to Madisound and they will replace them.
Given what they cost, i’d also consider swapping them for A10.3 or A10p which IMHO are a step above.
dave
Given what they cost, i’d also consider swapping them for A10.3 or A10p which IMHO are a step above.
dave
Madisound passed the video to Mark Audio. I'm still waiting for their answer.
Since handling as much bass as possible is the most important thing for me, I think the Pluvia 11 is still the better choice. I just need to figure out this buzzing thing..
Since handling as much bass as possible is the most important thing for me, I think the Pluvia 11 is still the better choice. I just need to figure out this buzzing thing..
I suspect both the 10s go lower, but if you want max bass capability the A12pw is the winner — a bit weak on the top thou.
dave
dave
Whether a tweeter or a smaller FR — like we did using A7.3 and are planning for A10p to create a no-excuses rock-n-roll system. And some find no need of extra top.
dave
dave
So, after my pair of pluvia 11s were shipped back and re-tested by the factory, they reported that to them there is no problem at 40-50 Hz.
I had also bought a stroboscope before shipping them back, and made a video where the buzz was evident and the displacement was not more than a couple mm p-p.
Luckily I asked for a full refund before shipping them back, so I am only out of shipping cost back to Madisound. The price of knowledge..
Given that to them there is nothing wrong with the drivers, I guess the nicest thing I can say is that this model is not for me. And I really hoped that it was too. Maybe next revision will take care of this issue.
I had also bought a stroboscope before shipping them back, and made a video where the buzz was evident and the displacement was not more than a couple mm p-p.
Luckily I asked for a full refund before shipping them back, so I am only out of shipping cost back to Madisound. The price of knowledge..
Given that to them there is nothing wrong with the drivers, I guess the nicest thing I can say is that this model is not for me. And I really hoped that it was too. Maybe next revision will take care of this issue.
I had a visit just the other day from a fellow that won the P11 in deciSize CGR enclosures from a couple diyFESTs ago. He was very pleased with them. He did get them EnABLed. He got a set of A7.3eN, one to use as a centre, and one to use as back fill in his Saab 95.
dave
dave
I don't think the cone is the problem.
It is pretty evident to me that the noise is generated at the back of the driver, possibly by the spider.
Your friend probably can't hear it when the driver is mounted and other content is playing on top of the frequencies in question.
I have to say, other than this issue, they do sound very good, so I'm not surprised by what you said.
It is pretty evident to me that the noise is generated at the back of the driver, possibly by the spider.
Your friend probably can't hear it when the driver is mounted and other content is playing on top of the frequencies in question.
I have to say, other than this issue, they do sound very good, so I'm not surprised by what you said.
It is also hard to get bass out of the P11… trying to could lead to isses. The optimum P11 miniOnken is the same size as for the A7.3/CHR/CHP/CHBW.
dave
dave
It's not hard with DSP, at the expense of sensitivity.
The noise is there at a displacement much lower than xmax, so it's not because I was trying to push it.
I calculated it was probably getting between 1 and 3 Watts when I tested it.
The noise is there at a displacement much lower than xmax, so it's not because I was trying to push it.
I calculated it was probably getting between 1 and 3 Watts when I tested it.
DSP (or other EQ) to get more bass will necessarily exchange more excursion & more power to get that bass.
I should note that the Frugel-Horn XL gets reasonable bass out of the P11, being a horn you get gain at LF the opposite of what happen susing EA to get bass.
dave
I should note that the Frugel-Horn XL gets reasonable bass out of the P11, being a horn you get gain at LF the opposite of what happen susing EA to get bass.
dave
True if one wants to increase bass and keep mids-highs the same. But if ones is ok sacrificing sensitivity, and still not push the driver above xmax, I don't see why the driver should have any problem. Especially if fed by only 3 Watts at the very most.
You’ll have to excuse me, but i am skeptical of the 3W. For every ocatve of bass extension you are quadrupling excursion as well as the required power. And if the box is not sealed, you are unloading below the box cut-off.
dave
dave
I calculated that from the fact that my DAC has a digital volume controller and my amp is rated at a certain max power. The 3 Watt was actually a figure in excess. Most likely it was actually under 1.
Dropbox - Pluvia 11 Stroboscope.mp4
My DA11 has a digitally controlled volume control, which has a maximum setting of 56 and goes by increments of 1 dB.
The max rated power of the amplifier is 300W at 4 ohms.
I start to play the 50 Hz tone and increase the volume until the noise is very evident, with the Lavry DA11's volume at 30, that is -26 dBFS.
Then I sit the driver down and use a stroboscope at around 50.5 Hz, so that the motion is clearly shown.
Right next to it I put the paper ruler, with the full 15 mm peak-to-peak theoretical travel length in evidence, for clarity.
My DA11 has a digitally controlled volume control, which has a maximum setting of 56 and goes by increments of 1 dB.
The max rated power of the amplifier is 300W at 4 ohms.
I start to play the 50 Hz tone and increase the volume until the noise is very evident, with the Lavry DA11's volume at 30, that is -26 dBFS.
Then I sit the driver down and use a stroboscope at around 50.5 Hz, so that the motion is clearly shown.
Right next to it I put the paper ruler, with the full 15 mm peak-to-peak theoretical travel length in evidence, for clarity.
Back on topic, I've been sorting through one of my old HDDs prior to it being recyled & discovered a handful of designs I haven't posted before for half a dozen different drivers. Three were for the Pluvia 11, so I'll put them here. Nothing novel about two, just straightforward vented boxes, but may be of interest / use. The third is a bit different though. 😉
First up, compact standmount / desktop monitor (using the term purely to describe a modestly sized box). Looking back at the box alignment & brief notes I'd stuck onto the line drawing, it was done as a deliberately small box, with a very lightly elevated LF alignment to help compensate for the higher Fb & lend a little extra subjective weight to the bottom end. Vent tuning is reasonably broad so shouldn't have the on-off effect of a very narrowly tuned alignment. Resaved as a png file from the original bitmap to keep size down. Please excuse the simple (rubbish) drawing. CAD is not my thing. It should be sufficient though as these are very simple boxes. I assumed a non-flared vent; for anyone who wants to change the duct size, Dave's pdf is also attached.
First up, compact standmount / desktop monitor (using the term purely to describe a modestly sized box). Looking back at the box alignment & brief notes I'd stuck onto the line drawing, it was done as a deliberately small box, with a very lightly elevated LF alignment to help compensate for the higher Fb & lend a little extra subjective weight to the bottom end. Vent tuning is reasonably broad so shouldn't have the on-off effect of a very narrowly tuned alignment. Resaved as a png file from the original bitmap to keep size down. Please excuse the simple (rubbish) drawing. CAD is not my thing. It should be sufficient though as these are very simple boxes. I assumed a non-flared vent; for anyone who wants to change the duct size, Dave's pdf is also attached.
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And the second. Larger standmount, this one with two drivers. I suspect I had a mixture of TAD and Omega in mind with this one. Given the impedances, I'd probably series wire & if you want to low-pass the lower driver, simplest way would be to shunt with a 56uF cap (& adjust from there as desired).
Same remarks as above apply re the vent: non-flared was assumed, if you want to adjust, feel free, Dave's pdf with scaling formulas attached here too. I wouldn't reduce the size though if you want to avoid potential excess velocities.
Same remarks as above apply re the vent: non-flared was assumed, if you want to adjust, feel free, Dave's pdf with scaling formulas attached here too. I wouldn't reduce the size though if you want to avoid potential excess velocities.
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How is talking about the Pluvia 11 being plagued by extreme noise at the back of the cone not on topic on a thread called Pluvia 11?
Seriously, stay away from this driver. The Eikona 2 is infinitely better when it comes to noise at the back. Too bad its piston area is much smaller, therefore not capable to produce as much bass (in a closed box). But at least it's clean bass.
Seriously, stay away from this driver. The Eikona 2 is infinitely better when it comes to noise at the back. Too bad its piston area is much smaller, therefore not capable to produce as much bass (in a closed box). But at least it's clean bass.
Well, you appeared to have made your point about being dissatisfied with your units (I understand Madisound provided you a full refund), and since you had not posted anything else for some time, I assumed you had finished & that the thread could return to wider discussion, box designs &c.
Third one.
Yes, this is a bit 'different'. Don't bother telling me all the things wrong with it, because I'm very well aware of them, and did it anyway. It's a little (well, 5ft) reference to Winslow Burhoe & EPI as it was in the early 1970s, and their then range-topper, the M1000 quadratic tower. Yes, it's a square section MLTL with a driver on each vertical face, all wired in the same electrical polarity (you won't get much cabinet output if you wire drivers sharing the same internal volume out of polarity 😉 ). Eccentric, yes. But the EPI M1000 did & still does have its fans, so it clearly does some things very right for some people. Is it hi-fi in the usual sense? No. But that misses the point as it doesn't prioritise the same things.
Third one.
Yes, this is a bit 'different'. Don't bother telling me all the things wrong with it, because I'm very well aware of them, and did it anyway. It's a little (well, 5ft) reference to Winslow Burhoe & EPI as it was in the early 1970s, and their then range-topper, the M1000 quadratic tower. Yes, it's a square section MLTL with a driver on each vertical face, all wired in the same electrical polarity (you won't get much cabinet output if you wire drivers sharing the same internal volume out of polarity 😉 ). Eccentric, yes. But the EPI M1000 did & still does have its fans, so it clearly does some things very right for some people. Is it hi-fi in the usual sense? No. But that misses the point as it doesn't prioritise the same things.
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Fair enough. Just making the point that my grievances with this driver are not off topic on a thread whose subject is the driver itself.
To be fair, I just had to send back a $800 pair of speakers that claimed to have addressed the air flow at the back of the cone through their special basket/magnet design. They were only slightly less noisy than the Pluvia 11.
So although I clearly don't like this driver, I have to put it in context and realize that unfortunately most of the drivers out there have the same problem.
The good news is that there are drivers that don't, and for about the same price. Mentioning the Eikona 2 earlier was maybe somewhat unfair given it costs more than twice. But the driver cost is such a small part of a speaker's total cost that I thought someone looking for the same qualities as myself in a driver might benefit from that piece of information.
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