Movies nowadays are loaded with LF effects... what are the music genres you are referring to?
Where they are placed now has a bit more bass so it is better, and I expect that they will be very good if they improve and open up a bit. No complaints about their performance, and it is quite admirable for a 4" driver.
Corinne Bailey Rae sounds great, that and some other material would sound truly wonderful with a bit more low end.
To clarify my earlier statements:
The low level detail retrieval is great, and don't get me wrong, these are truly wonderful speakers. They do so many things so very well, the only caveat that I can come up with at all is that for some music, and some films, if you are used to a sub that can fill in the very bottom end, it will lack a little bit of weight.
So there isn't a single thing that I don't like about these speakers. All that I can come up for possible improvements is that in an unfair comparison it can't beat out a system with a 10" subwoofer and better electronics when it comes to low end extension in some situations. I can't really ask for more from the speakers, and they do exceed my expectations. The fact is that in most situations I wouldn't miss my subwoofer with these speakers, and only on occasion in some material it would be nice to have.
Please don't misunderstand, that isn't a complaint, it isn't a deficiency, and it wasn't even a goal when this design was selected.
My comparison is based upon a multichannel setup with an Anthem receiver running room correction with a 10" subwoofer, and a two channel setup on an older Denon receiver that I have used before and don't like nearly as much as the Anthem unit for multiple reasons.
As mentioned yesterday, here is a picture of the finished speaker. For a first time project for speaker building, cabinetry, working with veneer, and not having done a lot of woodworking before, the results aren't terrible.
Attachments
Lerg, nice job with finish! Speaker looks nice.
I'm planning a similar finish for my Wessex. The CHR-Kens I did are a bit deeper brown.
Your observations on bass weight on the very low end are pretty similar to mine. It would be unrealistic to think that a 4" cone can match a 10" or larger one in terms of air displacement. What the drivers and the cabs do together is pretty amazing.
I'm planning a similar finish for my Wessex. The CHR-Kens I did are a bit deeper brown.
Your observations on bass weight on the very low end are pretty similar to mine. It would be unrealistic to think that a 4" cone can match a 10" or larger one in terms of air displacement. What the drivers and the cabs do together is pretty amazing.
Well, what I have is a bit more of a honey colour, Zebrawood veneer with wood conditioner and fruitwood stain from Varathane. The top coat is a few coats of the water based satin clear coat form Varathane, the diamond finish. They don't look bad, but they aren't perfect, and I still have to build grills for them. Had I known how dark the Zebrawood would look after finishing I would have done another coat of stain on the interior to darken it up a bit more.
If I get a chance to disconnect them and take a few more pictures I will post them.
If you look closely to the left of the bottom driver, the corner is missing a bit of wood, between my inexperience and the seemingly fickle nature veneer, a couple small chunks of wood escaped on those bevels. Next time I will have to work on construction and finishing, not sure when I will attempt something else though.
If I get a chance to disconnect them and take a few more pictures I will post them.
If you look closely to the left of the bottom driver, the corner is missing a bit of wood, between my inexperience and the seemingly fickle nature veneer, a couple small chunks of wood escaped on those bevels. Next time I will have to work on construction and finishing, not sure when I will attempt something else though.
yes, trimming out the veneer around the port slots is almost the trickiest part of the finishing process - well at least the most nerve wracking - if you rush it and mess up too badly, you need to strip the veneer and start all over again.
(how would he know?)
if there is a next time
I'd suggest finishing the interior surfaces of port slots during assembly of the outer wall "sandwich" nice job
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I did the finishing of the interior surfaces before doing initial construction. If you shine a light in the port slots you will see that it is stained front to back, even the back panel is stained, there shouldn't be a single bit of unfinished surface visible from the outside. I was tempted to paint them black, but I wasn't sure that it would look right, so it was stained with the same color as the interior.
Basically, the veneer took the stain a bit darker than the actual Zebrawood that I had that I was testing finishes on.
I used a sharp knife for trimming the port slots, if I spent a bit more time doing it I wouldn't have shaved a slight bit of stained wood by the very front of the slots.
Either way, for a novice/beginner, the final finishing is a huge pain with veneer with those front bevels and port slots.
Basically, the veneer took the stain a bit darker than the actual Zebrawood that I had that I was testing finishes on.
I used a sharp knife for trimming the port slots, if I spent a bit more time doing it I wouldn't have shaved a slight bit of stained wood by the very front of the slots.
Either way, for a novice/beginner, the final finishing is a huge pain with veneer with those front bevels and port slots.
No slight intended - the veneer trimming on these boxes is a PITA detail job for anyone - nice work
No slight taken, I just know that due to a combination of the flash, the camera and the colour of the veneer it isn't obvious that the vents are stained completely.
I will admit that the next time I do something like this I am not looking forward to trimming veneer again.
I don't really take credit for them looking nice though, all of the credit for that goes to the Zebrawood and its interesting grain pattern.
I will admit that the next time I do something like this I am not looking forward to trimming veneer again.
I don't really take credit for them looking nice though, all of the credit for that goes to the Zebrawood and its interesting grain pattern.
don't sell your craft short - on more than one occasion I've made a sow's ear out of silk purse - you'll just never see photos of same
but the most important part of course is how they make you feel when you hit play and close your eyes, and I think I know the answer in this case
When I close my eyes while they are playing I am saddened because they aren't mine so they don't get to go home with me. The other thing that saddens me is that the phantom center channel effect is good but it isn't great, and that is because they are being held back by the Denon.
Other than those facts, they are great. It makes me want to consider bulding a Mar-Ken7^2 with twin Alpair 7 drivers, MAOP coated if Mark makes them for the Alpair 7, and then build something for bass reinforcement. That will be quite a ways off though, so I can only dream for now.
Other than those facts, they are great. It makes me want to consider bulding a Mar-Ken7^2 with twin Alpair 7 drivers, MAOP coated if Mark makes them for the Alpair 7, and then build something for bass reinforcement. That will be quite a ways off though, so I can only dream for now.
Sorry guys - a bit OT. I've been playing a Dayton Tripath amp for the past few days - overall I'm finding it more musical vs a lot of other chip amps amps I've listened to. Not lacking in bass either. There's a fanatic following of Tripath among enthusiasts too - why don't we see any HT amps from the big guys (Denon, Marantz, Kenwood) with these chips?
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The good Tripath chipsets in good board implementations sound awesome ...
The reason they aren't used more widely is probably that the company went bankrupt
.... The reason they aren't used more widely is probably that the company went bankrupt
That's true, but the chips have been cloned by many and will be around for a while.
Bob
As far as the effectiveness of phantom center channel is concerned, if the Denon is a recent true surround receiver/processor, it's not necessarily to blame. Being a recent convert to a "proper" (small) surround system, I've been convinced by my ears of the significance of a discrete center speaker. While not as transparent as a minimalist tube amp (particularly 2A3 SE), it can sound quite decent for non-critical ("I'm writing a review for 6-moons") musical listening - Dolby ProII Music synthesized surround certainly can rock for parties (or at least what passes for them at my age) .
This late discovery I will blame on a combination of the complexity of calibration and level setting on my prior (Denon) AV receiver, and the aesthetics /furniture layout of the room at the time, which precluded implementation of any more than 2 + 1 channels.
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Yes indeed - and fortunately! These are strange circumstances though - the big players would probably never implement a Tripath amp without a corporate backer behind the technology - this seems to be the immutable way of big corporations. So you have to go to less established players or build your own ...
Chris, I would have agreed about the need for a center channel with the Denon had it not been for the fact that I decided to connect an external DAC to it and set it to pure direct mode. The imaging was far better than anything the Denon could do on its own.
I was actually going to drop down to a 2.1 system from a 5.1 system and replace the Denon AVR-888 with a self-built F5 until I got a chance to play with an Anthem MRX 300. If I didn't have the center channel already I could live without it with the MRX 300. The MRX 300 without the help of an external DAC was better than the Denon for imaging, it only got better with Anthem Room Correction. I know you probably don't want to be tempted into buying one, but if your local dealer can loan you one you might change your mind about how good a phantom center is and how much better than a Denon it can get.
I wasn't convinced until I got to try one, and I wouldn't want to give it up.
As for the Tripath dilemma, I would think that part of the reason why it isn't in more main stream units is also that the power ratings aren't that high on a lot of the designs, and the higher you go in HT equipment, the bigger the numbers get on the labels. Its probably a very hard sell to get somebody to purchase a 7x20W receiver despite how good it might sound.
I was actually going to drop down to a 2.1 system from a 5.1 system and replace the Denon AVR-888 with a self-built F5 until I got a chance to play with an Anthem MRX 300. If I didn't have the center channel already I could live without it with the MRX 300. The MRX 300 without the help of an external DAC was better than the Denon for imaging, it only got better with Anthem Room Correction. I know you probably don't want to be tempted into buying one, but if your local dealer can loan you one you might change your mind about how good a phantom center is and how much better than a Denon it can get.
I wasn't convinced until I got to try one, and I wouldn't want to give it up.
As for the Tripath dilemma, I would think that part of the reason why it isn't in more main stream units is also that the power ratings aren't that high on a lot of the designs, and the higher you go in HT equipment, the bigger the numbers get on the labels. Its probably a very hard sell to get somebody to purchase a 7x20W receiver despite how good it might sound.