Hello everyone,
About a year ago I built a set of C-Notes last year from a flat pack kit & painted/veneered them. I enjoyed the project quite a bit and the speakers have treated me quite well as the primary speakers in my apartment living room.
I'm itching for a winter project and would like to take on something a little more complicated. I have access to woodworking tools, so I am able to build my own cabinet. I would like to make a second pair of speakers for my room/office to listen to music while working from home. I'm a bit torn between going for some tower speakers for the living room & moving the C-Notes to my office or building another set of bookshelves and keeping the C-Notes where they are.
The more I research the more I realize that beyond entry level DIY kits like the C-Notes there's no clear "best" DIY kits in my price range of $300-600. I see a lot of comments that in 2023 it is harder for DIY to compete both on price with commercial offerings and technologically e.g. in terms of dispersion. I'm no expert so I'm not sure how seriously to take those claims - part of the value for me is the enjoyment and learning I get out of the project. I like good sound but I'm hardly an audiophile.
Some speakers that have piqued my interest and which I'm curious to hear opinions on:
Any other suggestions are appreciated!
About a year ago I built a set of C-Notes last year from a flat pack kit & painted/veneered them. I enjoyed the project quite a bit and the speakers have treated me quite well as the primary speakers in my apartment living room.
I'm itching for a winter project and would like to take on something a little more complicated. I have access to woodworking tools, so I am able to build my own cabinet. I would like to make a second pair of speakers for my room/office to listen to music while working from home. I'm a bit torn between going for some tower speakers for the living room & moving the C-Notes to my office or building another set of bookshelves and keeping the C-Notes where they are.
The more I research the more I realize that beyond entry level DIY kits like the C-Notes there's no clear "best" DIY kits in my price range of $300-600. I see a lot of comments that in 2023 it is harder for DIY to compete both on price with commercial offerings and technologically e.g. in terms of dispersion. I'm no expert so I'm not sure how seriously to take those claims - part of the value for me is the enjoyment and learning I get out of the project. I like good sound but I'm hardly an audiophile.
Some speakers that have piqued my interest and which I'm curious to hear opinions on:
- Amigas - Right now on sale for $300 w/ baffle only at Parts Express, which is enticing. I've heard some criticism that the design is outdated, but it also seems widely built.
- Speedsters - Ribbon tweeter is interesting and folks seem to enjoy the sound profile a lot. A bit expensive right now since no full kit exists.
- Hivi 3.1A w/ Sehlin mod - On paper looks great.
- CSS 1TD - Higher end on price but seems to get rave reviews & has upgrade path to 1TDX.
Any other suggestions are appreciated!
These won first place in the under $300 category at Parts Express Speaker Design Competition - by @DaveFred who posts here.
Post #33 has some final pics. Simple xo. https://www.htguide.com/forum/forum...5-8-scanspeak-d2604-833000-in-wg300-~42-litre
You'd need an adapter for the waveguide. The large chamfer/facet will improve your woodworking skills.
Post #33 has some final pics. Simple xo. https://www.htguide.com/forum/forum...5-8-scanspeak-d2604-833000-in-wg300-~42-litre
You'd need an adapter for the waveguide. The large chamfer/facet will improve your woodworking skills.
Maybe its hard to compete with CHEAP ($50) commercial offerings. I think it's easier now more than ever to out perform commercial offerings as the menu of quality drivers keeps growing.
I wouldn't avoid a particular design just because it's been around a while; for example, the Amigas have been been built by many people and get uniformly good reviews.
I don't have any particular recommendations, but I suggest looking at a design which has been widely built, well reviewed and by a noted designer. Do you have a particular cabinet size, driver configuration etc in mind?
Geoff
I don't have any particular recommendations, but I suggest looking at a design which has been widely built, well reviewed and by a noted designer. Do you have a particular cabinet size, driver configuration etc in mind?
Geoff
These are now my main listening speakers, and even my biased self thinks they sound pretty good. 🙂
If you go look at the thread where I document making them, it does not include the background on how I chose that woofer or came to that cabinet design, a lot of background work went into just making those decisions.
Also posted in that thread are the 108 (?) measurements for 360º horizontal and vertical on axis tweeter and woofer response. I think having all that data accurately measured went a long way towards it being the winning design.
@A4eaudio What did you think of them?
David.
I really liked them. I think they're a good example that sometimes (a LOT of times?) we should stop looking at the price of speakers and drivers. If you put grilles on them and said they had $600 in drivers, no one would question that.
Indeed! Long time ago a very popular high end/boutique manufacturer intentionally chose a driver manufacturer's cheapest designs with special labels added.
Is this reasonable?
-looks like a small Elsinore
Madisound Peerless 830656 sale $15 usd x8= $120 usd
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/approx-5-woofers/peerless-830656-5.25-woofer/
Interesting, this speaker uses four Peerless 830656 & Dayton ND20FB-4 , simple crossover, you don't need a router.
https://techtalk.parts-express.com/forum/speaker-project-gallery/38135-i-don-t-like-candles
https://techtalk.parts-express.com/...rless-mtmmm-and-mmtmmmm-2-5-way-designs/page2
post#18
mattk, "I used Zaph's ZA5.5tt crossover topology (see http://zaphaudio.com/ZA5/ ) as a starting point in PCD, since he knows what he is doing, and adjusted values to get a reasonably flat response with a good reverse null."
--
diff driver- possible Cabinet 40 litres
http://zaphaudio.com/ZA5/ZA5.5t.pdf
======================
https://techtalk.parts-express.com/...lery/56059-the-armadillo-tm-a-k-a-lil-dillo-s
post#1
The "Armadillo TM" A.K.A. "Lil' Dillo's"
I decided to do the first ones in a 10 liter (.35 cu ft) ported cab, lined and fairly well stuffed, with a tuning around 55hz.
The overall dimensions are 8" W x 12" H x 10.5" D with a 2" dia. x 5" long port (15.707963 in3). The sealed version Would be about 6-7" deep and heavily stuffed. A single dowel brace to tie the sides together seems adequate with 3/4" panels. The woofer and tweeter are 6" and 2" from the top edge of the cabinet, with the tweeter flush mounted and the woofer surface mounted. The port is recessed into the back panel 1/4" and glued in, with a 1/2" round-over on the outside end.
---
-looks like a small Elsinore
Madisound Peerless 830656 sale $15 usd x8= $120 usd
https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/approx-5-woofers/peerless-830656-5.25-woofer/
Interesting, this speaker uses four Peerless 830656 & Dayton ND20FB-4 , simple crossover, you don't need a router.
https://techtalk.parts-express.com/forum/speaker-project-gallery/38135-i-don-t-like-candles
https://techtalk.parts-express.com/...rless-mtmmm-and-mmtmmmm-2-5-way-designs/page2
post#18
mattk, "I used Zaph's ZA5.5tt crossover topology (see http://zaphaudio.com/ZA5/ ) as a starting point in PCD, since he knows what he is doing, and adjusted values to get a reasonably flat response with a good reverse null."
--
diff driver- possible Cabinet 40 litres
http://zaphaudio.com/ZA5/ZA5.5t.pdf
======================
https://techtalk.parts-express.com/...lery/56059-the-armadillo-tm-a-k-a-lil-dillo-s
post#1
The "Armadillo TM" A.K.A. "Lil' Dillo's"
I decided to do the first ones in a 10 liter (.35 cu ft) ported cab, lined and fairly well stuffed, with a tuning around 55hz.
The overall dimensions are 8" W x 12" H x 10.5" D with a 2" dia. x 5" long port (15.707963 in3). The sealed version Would be about 6-7" deep and heavily stuffed. A single dowel brace to tie the sides together seems adequate with 3/4" panels. The woofer and tweeter are 6" and 2" from the top edge of the cabinet, with the tweeter flush mounted and the woofer surface mounted. The port is recessed into the back panel 1/4" and glued in, with a 1/2" round-over on the outside end.
---
Attachments
Last edited:
A reasonable thing would be to build a sort of a flagship loudspeaker one would like to
keep for a long time. Something you would not need to upgrade. Usually these
should be more expensive and larger cabinet speakers.
keep for a long time. Something you would not need to upgrade. Usually these
should be more expensive and larger cabinet speakers.
from OP post #1
"The more I research the more I realize that beyond entry level DIY kits like the C-Notes there's no clear "best" DIY kits in my price range of $300-600. "
Build the one in Post #5
$? Paul Carmody-Spitfire
https://sites.google.com/site/undefinition/updates/hivil6-4r
"The more I research the more I realize that beyond entry level DIY kits like the C-Notes there's no clear "best" DIY kits in my price range of $300-600. "
Build the one in Post #5
$? Paul Carmody-Spitfire
https://sites.google.com/site/undefinition/updates/hivil6-4r
more Spitfire
https://techtalk.parts-express.com/.../64518-paul-carmody-s-spitfire-anf-burro-subs
Spitfire Tower
https://m.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.803345086378645.1073741861.601735219872967&type=3
posts 5,8,12
https://techtalk.parts-express.com/forum/tech-talk-forum/64878-paul-s-spitfire-kit-with-front-port
https://sites.google.com/site/undefinition/floorstanding-speakers/amiga
https://techtalk.parts-express.com/.../64518-paul-carmody-s-spitfire-anf-burro-subs
Spitfire Tower
https://m.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.803345086378645.1073741861.601735219872967&type=3
posts 5,8,12
https://techtalk.parts-express.com/forum/tech-talk-forum/64878-paul-s-spitfire-kit-with-front-port
https://sites.google.com/site/undefinition/floorstanding-speakers/amiga
Last edited:
Here is another one I did that I think sounds very good, and unknowingly, is similar to Paul C's Spitfire,
https://www.canuckaudiomart.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=63986
https://www.canuckaudiomart.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=63986
My Stances are about that price. Could likely build Bottleships for that too.
The Sophomores are a bit less, and the Nephila a bit more.
Just in case you are looking for something else...
The Sophomores are a bit less, and the Nephila a bit more.
Just in case you are looking for something else...
Thanks everyone for your feedback! Do folks have particular opinions on the Amigas? I am considering pulling the trigger on those since they're $270 for a pair right now which feels like a steal.
Qualitatively, I see a lot of rave reviews for the Amigas on balance. I do see some folks who have gotten some poorer off-axis measurements. I know more recently people have been raving about waveguided tweeter designs that can help solve some of the supposed dispersion issues - should I be favoring a "newer" design in that respect? It's a little hard for me to evaluate as a non-expert 🙂
Qualitatively, I see a lot of rave reviews for the Amigas on balance. I do see some folks who have gotten some poorer off-axis measurements. I know more recently people have been raving about waveguided tweeter designs that can help solve some of the supposed dispersion issues - should I be favoring a "newer" design in that respect? It's a little hard for me to evaluate as a non-expert 🙂
Given the large number of constraints and compromises there is no best.
I have heard of, not heard, any of those mentioned (i did do the [original] drawings for that CSS).
I’d have a number of suggestions, none use a tweeter,
Every review needs a bag of salt on your shoulder.
dave
Last edited:
One of the issues in DIY is of course that you can't audition the speakers before buying/building; each designer has their own 'house sound', for want of a better word. And there's always your room(s) to consider.
I've built projects by several noted designers, some of whom are on this Forum, and have never been disappointed by the quality of their sound or their value.
If you're looking at the Amigas, I find Paul Carmody's write ups of his designs to be honest about his projects' sound and any issues: for example, he notes that the Amigas will have a dB limit due to the limitations of the RS180 woofer. I built his Classix IIs and found his write up to be spot on, in particular, he's honest about their musical design goals.
I agree that reviews of any product should be read with caution, but when something is widely built and reviewed, common themes should come through.
I'd also consider:
Geoff
I've built projects by several noted designers, some of whom are on this Forum, and have never been disappointed by the quality of their sound or their value.
If you're looking at the Amigas, I find Paul Carmody's write ups of his designs to be honest about his projects' sound and any issues: for example, he notes that the Amigas will have a dB limit due to the limitations of the RS180 woofer. I built his Classix IIs and found his write up to be spot on, in particular, he's honest about their musical design goals.
I agree that reviews of any product should be read with caution, but when something is widely built and reviewed, common themes should come through.
I'd also consider:
- cabinet size and complexity of construction;
- your musical preferences; (e.g. I find Curt Campbell's Tritrix better for jazz and classics than the Classix, which shine for older pop/rock)
- crossover complexity and parts cost;
Geoff