I propose some debate about this terrible accident that we have suffered here.
The reason for this disaster - which took several lives, all from the same family - seems to be:
The lithium battery of an electric skateboard!
Among the millions of lithium batteries that exist, the percentage of accidents is insignificant, but that is no excuse to leave everything as it is. I think there is a lack of information / precautionary notices on the use of battery chargers, whether they are for the device they are?
In my town, a lady was absent from her home, leaving her cell phone on charge, thinking to wrap it up in a short time, unfortunately, it took longer than expected and her house caught fire.
The last NoteBook that I bought about two years ago, supported full charge of the lithium battery when it was recently purchased, that lasted a very short time, and then the /vs charge programming system was activated. performance etc The maximum programmable is 60%, it does not allow more load no matter how much you choose different settings. Good for that.
So, if it's all the fault of overcharging the Lithium batteries - as seems to be the most logical conclusion, they should affix caution notices in big red letters with a warning like this or something similar to the packaging and appliances:
Explosion hazard when charging the battery! " Read the instructions carefully, and return the form stating that you have read and understood this warning " We will not be held responsible in cases of explosion or its consequences "
PS: Here you can see the photo of the fire, the flames emerging from the apartment.
I haven't been able to attach it, I don't know if it's because of the new forum, it was easy for me before to upload photos from newspapers, now it's impossible ! 🤔
https://www.iprofesional.com/actual...-en-un-edificio-de-recoleta-hay-cinco-muertos
The reason for this disaster - which took several lives, all from the same family - seems to be:
The lithium battery of an electric skateboard!
Among the millions of lithium batteries that exist, the percentage of accidents is insignificant, but that is no excuse to leave everything as it is. I think there is a lack of information / precautionary notices on the use of battery chargers, whether they are for the device they are?
In my town, a lady was absent from her home, leaving her cell phone on charge, thinking to wrap it up in a short time, unfortunately, it took longer than expected and her house caught fire.
The last NoteBook that I bought about two years ago, supported full charge of the lithium battery when it was recently purchased, that lasted a very short time, and then the /vs charge programming system was activated. performance etc The maximum programmable is 60%, it does not allow more load no matter how much you choose different settings. Good for that.
So, if it's all the fault of overcharging the Lithium batteries - as seems to be the most logical conclusion, they should affix caution notices in big red letters with a warning like this or something similar to the packaging and appliances:
Explosion hazard when charging the battery! " Read the instructions carefully, and return the form stating that you have read and understood this warning " We will not be held responsible in cases of explosion or its consequences "
PS: Here you can see the photo of the fire, the flames emerging from the apartment.
I haven't been able to attach it, I don't know if it's because of the new forum, it was easy for me before to upload photos from newspapers, now it's impossible ! 🤔
https://www.iprofesional.com/actual...-en-un-edificio-de-recoleta-hay-cinco-muertos
A building on an industrial site in Haarlem where electric scooters are charged caught fire twice within a few months due to issues with lithium batteries and an acquantaince of mine from Amsterdam had to leave his house once because the electric bicycle company next to him had caught fire.
I always wonder whether these things are due to someone tampering with the charging electronics (improper repair), poor design or simply a double failure. There normally should be measures to prevent fire or explosion when the charger fails to stop charging.
I always wonder whether these things are due to someone tampering with the charging electronics (improper repair), poor design or simply a double failure. There normally should be measures to prevent fire or explosion when the charger fails to stop charging.
Someone I know from the local Repair Cafe once asked my advice. He was trying to repair the battery of his neighbour's electric bicycle. It consisted of a series string of lithium-ion cells and a big PCB, and he had measured that there was a DC voltage across the string of series connected cells, but it got blocked by a big transistor on the PCB. Could he just short it?
I told him that I was sure he could, but if he did his neighbour's house would probably burn down.
I told him that I was sure he could, but if he did his neighbour's house would probably burn down.
I dislike those lithium batteries.
I think they're dangerous, and the invention of them is bad.
This is why I decided to go with a gasoline powered bike 4 stroke engine.
Besides, and electric bike's lithium batteries are hundreds of dollars, and gasoline is much cheaper, even today.
I think they're dangerous, and the invention of them is bad.
This is why I decided to go with a gasoline powered bike 4 stroke engine.
Besides, and electric bike's lithium batteries are hundreds of dollars, and gasoline is much cheaper, even today.
Some of them lack thermal fuses.
And poor selection or cost cutting means the batteries are discharged at a faster rate than intended by the battery builder.
Tesla vehicles do not catch fire so easily...
And the vehicles which did catch fire must have had smaller than ideal batteries, cheap ones, or with both descriptions.
That is asking for trouble.
Not the battery maker's fault if some bean counter insists on putting a 18 Ah battery when a 60 Ah is needed.
And he will find another job when the company folds up.
And poor selection or cost cutting means the batteries are discharged at a faster rate than intended by the battery builder.
Tesla vehicles do not catch fire so easily...
And the vehicles which did catch fire must have had smaller than ideal batteries, cheap ones, or with both descriptions.
That is asking for trouble.
Not the battery maker's fault if some bean counter insists on putting a 18 Ah battery when a 60 Ah is needed.
And he will find another job when the company folds up.
Small batteries blow up because they were made to be charged from a USB port.
They worked fine until USB ports with high power outputs appeared.
I managed to get one off charge and cooled down just before it blew up several years ago.
They worked fine until USB ports with high power outputs appeared.
I managed to get one off charge and cooled down just before it blew up several years ago.
FWIW this is Osvaldo´s missing picture:
Scary, think there were 9 people inside that blazing wall-to-wall inferno, and 5 of them died, fire extended to upper floor appartment leaving 18 others hospitalized for burns but specially for partial asphyxia and smoke inhalation.
A whole Family destroyed in seconds, all for a defective "toy".
Scary, think there were 9 people inside that blazing wall-to-wall inferno, and 5 of them died, fire extended to upper floor appartment leaving 18 others hospitalized for burns but specially for partial asphyxia and smoke inhalation.
A whole Family destroyed in seconds, all for a defective "toy".
Last edited:
I once had a lithium torch (flashlight) battery accidentally roll off the kitchen breakfast bar straight into the toaster. Next time I made toast I had a jet of flame reaching to the ceiling. Threw the (hastily unplugged) toaster into the sink and doused it. When I tipped the battery out, it was still glowing bright orange. 😳
Took me a few minutes to figure out what had happened and missus still isn't impressed years later 😵
The ferocity of the flame and how difficult it was to cool the lithium certainly was an eye opener.
Took me a few minutes to figure out what had happened and missus still isn't impressed years later 😵
The ferocity of the flame and how difficult it was to cool the lithium certainly was an eye opener.
I agree that most people with no technical background are unaware of the fire risk associated with lithium battery technology, and product documentation usually does not contain sufficient mitigation instructions. Think of all the people who put their phone on top of the bed to charge it. Most teenagers probably do that. For my part, I try to give this information whenever it is useful to do so. I presented the company safety manager with adequate documentation that convinced him to publish provisions and procedures that avoid risky behavior. For example, do not use mechanically deformed or cracked battery packs for power tools; do not accumulate paper, rags and solvent containers next to working chargers. It seems obvious to us, but for a person with no specific training it is not at all.
It is absolutely true that lithium batteries have risks/issues. I won't deny that.
However, it's also true that many devices are made with bad physical layout, improper BMS systems, cut-rate parts and cheaply-made cells themselves.
We also have to consider several other factors when we hear about Teslas catching fire. Yes, Tesla has more work to do to make their vehicles safe. However, a couple of stock analysts I was listening to a while ago made a good point when they said that you always hear in the news about Teslas catching fire, but not so much other, less fancy cars. There may be a few reasons for this.
First, Teslas catching fire catches people attention. Teslas are a known status symbol, and Musk is a famous person. Would it get your attention as much if it were a Prius that caught fire? Probably not.
Second, statistically speaking, Tesla has sold/produced more electric cars than any other company for the US market. Therefore, all else being equal, it stands to reason that there will be more incidents with Teslas than with other models of electric cars.
Third, Tesla stock can be shorted. And many people are shorting the stock. Therefore, there's an incentive for some people to keep going on about how Tesla doesn't have their batteries right yet.
Finally, I know that a lot of right-wing people in the US hate the whole idea of Tesla, Musk and eletric cars. So certain right-leaning networks will report anything they can that makes Musk or Teslas look bad. Some of their viewers love the negative reports.
Back at the technical level, from what I've read, high quality cells are fairly safe, and pouches are not as safe, but can be made safe when some safeguards are included with the product.
However, it's also true that many devices are made with bad physical layout, improper BMS systems, cut-rate parts and cheaply-made cells themselves.
We also have to consider several other factors when we hear about Teslas catching fire. Yes, Tesla has more work to do to make their vehicles safe. However, a couple of stock analysts I was listening to a while ago made a good point when they said that you always hear in the news about Teslas catching fire, but not so much other, less fancy cars. There may be a few reasons for this.
First, Teslas catching fire catches people attention. Teslas are a known status symbol, and Musk is a famous person. Would it get your attention as much if it were a Prius that caught fire? Probably not.
Second, statistically speaking, Tesla has sold/produced more electric cars than any other company for the US market. Therefore, all else being equal, it stands to reason that there will be more incidents with Teslas than with other models of electric cars.
Third, Tesla stock can be shorted. And many people are shorting the stock. Therefore, there's an incentive for some people to keep going on about how Tesla doesn't have their batteries right yet.
Finally, I know that a lot of right-wing people in the US hate the whole idea of Tesla, Musk and eletric cars. So certain right-leaning networks will report anything they can that makes Musk or Teslas look bad. Some of their viewers love the negative reports.
Back at the technical level, from what I've read, high quality cells are fairly safe, and pouches are not as safe, but can be made safe when some safeguards are included with the product.
The average laymen do not know how to charge a cell phone properly yet they are trusted with an electric scooter, EV etc. Drama.
We used to think lead acid batteries were already dangerous enough to the uninformed..
BTW A Tesla that has had an accident is put in a water tank for 24 hours here (by the fire brigade).
We used to think lead acid batteries were already dangerous enough to the uninformed..
BTW A Tesla that has had an accident is put in a water tank for 24 hours here (by the fire brigade).
FWIW one "official" theory about the disappeared Malaysia to Beijing plane was that it was carrying a containerload of lithium batteries.
No proof of course until plane is recovered, but hey, at least plausible enough to be considered by them.
No proof of course until plane is recovered, but hey, at least plausible enough to be considered by them.
IMO, this is where proper government regulation comes in. But we can't have that, can we?
Considering the number of cell phones in use, the number of fires or destructive incidents is probably insignificant. Not zero, but nothing is perfectly safe. Scooter type stuff, OTOH, seems to be terrible by any standard. Being paranoid, I do make sure my battery powered stuff is on a non-flammable surface when charging. It's probably still too close to other stuff that can burn, as lithium fires are highly active. Quality matters a lot in this instance and I don't know what, if any, regulations are in place for construction and testing.
I don't see how a certain politically-oriented group would be the one to dislike the tesla's.
If you produce an automobile with known and dangerous issues, it's more of a reputation that I'd suspect would alert anyone (with common sense) to be against owning one, regardless of your political stature.
OK so don’t use a lithium battery in your smoke detector. But not having at least one in your bedroom is just silly. (Also one in the kitchen and by the furnace, maybe even a separate water heater. Who knows if you have a garage!)
I could mention my carbon monoxide detector did save a life. I was away for the weekend, but the alarm was loud enough to earn a neighbor which was where the gas was coming from!
Also do you have two ways of egress from your bedroom?
Every so often something catches fire in my shop. The last time someone was cutting wood that had a nail in it. The spark caught the dust collector bag on fire. The fellow standing in front of the nearest fire extinguisher did not see it! The operator of the saw hit the emergency power off switch and that shut off everything including the dust collector, so the flames went out. The dust collector was then moved outside the building.
As that was in the wood shop there is now a water hose in addition to a fire extinguisher. I believe code requires two or three for a space my size. I keep eight around, all tested annually and all marked with signs.
Previous fire was someone’s clothing catching on fire while using a hand grinder. They did notice that well in time! (Not using the available fire resistant clothing.)
Fires happen! Being prepared is just good sense!
However for a real disaster we could talk about the flood!!!
I could mention my carbon monoxide detector did save a life. I was away for the weekend, but the alarm was loud enough to earn a neighbor which was where the gas was coming from!
Also do you have two ways of egress from your bedroom?
Every so often something catches fire in my shop. The last time someone was cutting wood that had a nail in it. The spark caught the dust collector bag on fire. The fellow standing in front of the nearest fire extinguisher did not see it! The operator of the saw hit the emergency power off switch and that shut off everything including the dust collector, so the flames went out. The dust collector was then moved outside the building.
As that was in the wood shop there is now a water hose in addition to a fire extinguisher. I believe code requires two or three for a space my size. I keep eight around, all tested annually and all marked with signs.
Previous fire was someone’s clothing catching on fire while using a hand grinder. They did notice that well in time! (Not using the available fire resistant clothing.)
Fires happen! Being prepared is just good sense!
However for a real disaster we could talk about the flood!!!
Last edited:
They don't hate on Musk/Tesla autos becauase of the battery dangers. They just hate on anything that isn't gas-powered. It's an increasing problem in southern US states that Tesla drivers plug in to charge and come back to find their charging cable removed by guys in pickup trucks.
They're also very suspicious of anything that isn't gas-powered.
Have you ever been to the rural areas of the U.S. (especially the south)?
I haven't been, but I saw this movie a long time ago and I think things must not have changed much, your account of the "prank" of those guys proves it... 🙄
Attachments
Thanks, but my name is not Osvaldo.... 😉FWIW this is Osvaldo´s missing picture:
Scary, think there were 9 people inside that blazing wall-to-wall inferno, and 5 of them died, fire extended to upper floor appartment leaving 18 others hospitalized for burns but specially for partial asphyxia and smoke inhalation.
A whole Family destroyed in seconds, all for a defective "toy".