• Disclaimer: This Vendor's Forum is a paid-for commercial area. Unlike the rest of diyAudio, the Vendor has complete control of what may or may not be posted in this forum. If you wish to discuss technical matters outside the bounds of what is permitted by the Vendor, please use the non-commercial areas of diyAudio to do so.

Legato Tweakers Thread...

Status
This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.
TCR 50ppm vs 100ppm, 2.25W vs 1W, Caddock are non inductive vs Vishay CcF60 who knows...
Not wishing to keep you from trying whatever you like.

Neither TCR (thermal coefficient) nor inductance (the tiny amount we are talking here) would have any negative effect in the circuit for those resistors. Now more than 1uH or so I would be worried. :)

Now if you put some boutique resistor in there and love it, well more power too you. :)
 
Member
Joined 2009
Paid Member
Russ I was greatly impressed how sounds the Legato with the standard parts. Possible the 15nF teflon film & aluminium foil 1% caps are a big upgrade so I start to look for other possible critical parts like are the resistors, which are the others resistors not rated 1W more criticals? or do you have another idea to upgrade the Legato?
 
The datasheet don't tell nothing of the I/V resistor because said:

"The I/V converter, and the DAC post filter. Selection of an appropriate op amp for the I/V converter is critical for obtaining optimum dynamic performance from the PCM1704. The OPA627 is recommended for this application. Op amps with similar characteristics and faster settling times may also be used. The suggested DAC post filter is a second-order lowpass active filter, using the multiple feedback (MFB) circuit technique. The OPA2134 is an excellent choice for the op amp in this circuit, since it is designed for high performance audio applications. The post filter is used to reconstruct and band limit the DAC output signal"

If I remember well I read that PCM1704 I/V pasive resistor is 100 ohms, please could you help me how can be do?

100 is too high if you decided to use passive I to V. Distortion figures will suffer…

with active, OP based I to V, better result could be obtained with OP's with lower than 627 input bias current specs because the OP's bias current compare directly with DAC's current LSB... so it becomes a factor at 24bit resolution... in particular if the ground topology, adequate decoupling / voltage rails regulation can provide low noise conditions. Without too much checking, I think twisted pair I to V boards could be used with 1704's but only in dual differential configuration (4 X 1704's for both channels).

There are posts around here and “over there” that explain in detail I to V conversion for single 1704 per channel…

Cheers,
Boky
 
Member
Joined 2009
Paid Member
Vishay CCF60 are also non-inductive, as are most metal film resistors.

TCR is not current noise; it is an measure of resistance change with temperature.

I know what is TCR (temperature coefficient resistance) so is the value expressed in ppm the resistor can change with the temperature BTW thanks to remember me:)

Also I know that current noise is expressed in mV or uV over the audio bandwith not in ppm;)
 
Member
Joined 2009
Paid Member
merlin what kind of teflon caps you used?

i think my legato have wima and panasonic z caps.

Teflons are USA NOS

Yes your Legato have Wima & Panasonic
 

Attachments

  • DSC00031.jpg
    DSC00031.jpg
    588.6 KB · Views: 307
Thanks Spartacus! So to translate... I surmise that I shouldn't notice any difference between metal films having noise parameters of, say, 5 nV/V and 30 nV/V? When you say the 'high-end' Vishays, I assume you mean TX2575 series? I'm curious about metal film resistors with magnetic components like the steel end caps in Vishay MBA/SMA series? http://www.vishay.com/docs/28767/28767.pdf Irrelevant or avoid? I haven't yet learned how the stock Vishay CCF60s are constructed.

Well, I wouldn't be categorical about anything someone else would hear. Personally I wouldn't expect the CCS resistors to make much if any difference, provided they are decent quality - which the Dales are. But of course no one should stop you experimenting if you want to find out for yourself! :)

Re. the Vishays, yes, I'm planning to try out some TX2575 at some point myself for I/V. They measure exceptionally well, which seems to correlate with anecdotal reports of their sound, so they are worth trying IMO.
 
Well, I wouldn't be categorical about anything someone else would hear. Personally I wouldn't expect the CCS resistors to make much if any difference, provided they are decent quality - which the Dales are. But of course no one should stop you experimenting if you want to find out for yourself! :)

Re. the Vishays, yes, I'm planning to try out some TX2575 at some point myself for I/V. They measure exceptionally well, which seems to correlate with anecdotal reports of their sound, so they are worth trying IMO.

Hi Dan

I used Vishay S104D resistors for I/V as they have a current rating of 1W and TX2575 as output resistors (for SE) All I can say is my Legato sounds damned good.

I'm slightly confused as to whether 1W is necessary for the I/V resistors. If not then the TX2575 would be excellent otherwise consider the S104D's they work very well I think. To my ears there was an improvement.

Vishay (Texas components) make the Z foil version S104Z @ 1W, which would be even better but a bit pricey.

I'm sure you won't be disappointed whatever you choose. If you want I can give you the prices I was quoted for various types.
 
Last edited:
Member
Joined 2007
Paid Member
Sorry, forgot to reply. My tweeters are Fountek ribbons, and I also have some Grado SR80i headphones. Not sure why that's relevant though?

Since the talk was swirling around "glassy sound" and high pass filtration, etc., I just wondered if maybe you were a full-range advocate. ...since many of those implementations roll off on both sides... When talking about what we hear, and each us of is obviously different, we tend to assume that our speakers and acoustics are 'reference'. I know MINE are! :p No seriously, BII SQ and pre-DAC crossovers have made me think that I'm not such a hopeless speaker designer after all! ;)

Cheers,

Frank
 
re: Lagato 2....

On the TPA website, is the schematic and users manual version 2?

The Lagato2 kit that I just receved is screened "Version 2.0.0"
But I can not find any reference to the "doubled up" I/V resistors, i.e. the 680R that was mentioned previously in this thread...or any other doubled up resistor. The docs and .xls parts list don't show the reference... I'm a bit confused.... ( and a little lost without the appropriate corresponding documentation... especially getting ready to purchase components for tweaking, let alone just stuffing the board with original parts)

JD
 
Last edited:
current documentation for the current product... that's all. As that is what I would reference when building (intead of going back and forthing to figure out the differences) I confuse easily and need an exact "paint by the numbers" reference as the baseline.
example.... enclosed in the parts are 681 ohm resistors...... there is no reference to the in the parts list or schematic so I have to clue where they go.......

For me it's difficult to learn how a 2011 Ferrari is put together if I have a 2010 manual.
JD


What kind of reference are you expecting to see?

There should be 4 resistors per side where before there were only two.

And there is also no buffer to omit. :)
 
Last edited:
Status
This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.