I haven't thought of using a dowsing rod for circuit analysis and troubleshooting. Maybe that would work.
John,
John Scher - not Graham for those NJ shows... iirc.
I would have sought you out, but who knew?
Ok, but if you bond it back to the main ground rod, you now have a differential between the two grounds, and you are no longer isolated at all... this is what bothers me.
In my case that would be a wire that would run about 100 feet. Makes zero sense to me.
In a lightning condition where there is a close hit or a hit, something is going to blow up, no matter what. I'd prefer to take my chances with the breakdown voltage of the iso transformer or the Romex (ick) than float the iso transformer on the end of 100 feet of 3 or 4 conductor wire and call that "grounded".
Unless you run something like 00 ga. back to the "main ground rod" and you rely upon the ground conductor (like 12ga or 10ga if you spent the big bux) that ground wire is going to go up like a fuse if there is a real hit that causes a potential between ground rods.
At least imho.
Tell me where this is wrong, please.
(edit: sounds like a job for an MOV, Transzorb, gas discharge tube, or spark gap)
In the USA we use a 0-120vac system with a third wire for "ground". Power is typically provided as 120 - 0 - 120 at the breaker box. This makes 240vac available for larger appliances (and running to iso transformers for audio nuts). So, the 120-0-120 (or 115-0-115) that I suggested would provide standard power on two out of phase legs, from the much stiffer "240vac" source. I am not suggesting that in Europe where the power is 0-230vac that a CT at ground is preferable. Sorry if that caused any confusion.
_-_-bear
John Scher - not Graham for those NJ shows... iirc.
I would have sought you out, but who knew?
pooge said:
Ok, but if you bond it back to the main ground rod, you now have a differential between the two grounds, and you are no longer isolated at all... this is what bothers me.
In my case that would be a wire that would run about 100 feet. Makes zero sense to me.
In a lightning condition where there is a close hit or a hit, something is going to blow up, no matter what. I'd prefer to take my chances with the breakdown voltage of the iso transformer or the Romex (ick) than float the iso transformer on the end of 100 feet of 3 or 4 conductor wire and call that "grounded".
Unless you run something like 00 ga. back to the "main ground rod" and you rely upon the ground conductor (like 12ga or 10ga if you spent the big bux) that ground wire is going to go up like a fuse if there is a real hit that causes a potential between ground rods.
At least imho.
Tell me where this is wrong, please.
(edit: sounds like a job for an MOV, Transzorb, gas discharge tube, or spark gap)
Juergen Knoop said:
In the USA we use a 0-120vac system with a third wire for "ground". Power is typically provided as 120 - 0 - 120 at the breaker box. This makes 240vac available for larger appliances (and running to iso transformers for audio nuts). So, the 120-0-120 (or 115-0-115) that I suggested would provide standard power on two out of phase legs, from the much stiffer "240vac" source. I am not suggesting that in Europe where the power is 0-230vac that a CT at ground is preferable. Sorry if that caused any confusion.
_-_-bear
Re: Re: Re: Re: Wall of Sound
My BS detecting days are over. I thought I only ever reacted to the really over the top stuff. I'm interested mainly in audio electronics as instrumentation. The small "gear footprint" in my household would shock most of you. Though I am considering one of Earl Geddes speaker kits or the buy direct only little Magnepans.
BTW I still use a Weston voltmeter (one of the big wooden ones) to monitor my solar panels. Last calibrated 2/3/1950, with the parallax mirror, reads better than 1% right out of a dumpster.
bear said:
My BS detecting days are over. I thought I only ever reacted to the really over the top stuff. I'm interested mainly in audio electronics as instrumentation. The small "gear footprint" in my household would shock most of you. Though I am considering one of Earl Geddes speaker kits or the buy direct only little Magnepans.
BTW I still use a Weston voltmeter (one of the big wooden ones) to monitor my solar panels. Last calibrated 2/3/1950, with the parallax mirror, reads better than 1% right out of a dumpster.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Wall of Sound
Scott, nice dance steps!
You've managed to avoid dealing with the central point at all!
Why not use some good headphones for critical listening, small footprint work? STAX? You did say you finally heard "a difference" between Redbook and MP3 using headphones, remember? 😀
Who knows, maybe you will hear some things that surprise you?
Or maybe you don't like "surprises" of this sort?
I got a GE line voltage meter, with the mirror scale, hand scribed scale, calibration curve on the lid, mahagony box, probably 1920s vintage, out of the dumpster. Been in constant service here for 25 years now. Great bit of fine classic instrumentation.
You gonna use a 5mhz. scope and a Lafayette bakelite mini VOM to test ur opamps at work? Just checking.
_-_-bear
scott wurcer said:
Scott, nice dance steps!
You've managed to avoid dealing with the central point at all!
Why not use some good headphones for critical listening, small footprint work? STAX? You did say you finally heard "a difference" between Redbook and MP3 using headphones, remember? 😀
Who knows, maybe you will hear some things that surprise you?
Or maybe you don't like "surprises" of this sort?
I got a GE line voltage meter, with the mirror scale, hand scribed scale, calibration curve on the lid, mahagony box, probably 1920s vintage, out of the dumpster. Been in constant service here for 25 years now. Great bit of fine classic instrumentation.
You gonna use a 5mhz. scope and a Lafayette bakelite mini VOM to test ur opamps at work? Just checking.
_-_-bear
Bear, I use a Simpson AC voltmeter gotten from a surplus chassis for the last 25 years. Have a couple old Simpson voltmeters and a wonderful Triplett 630NS that I got 44years ago. Don't use them much, anymore except for high voltage.
Bear, you are right, Sequerra's speakers are more forgiving than a REAL analytical speaker should be. I NEVER make serious component evaluations with them. I have used 5 different models over the years and use 3 different versions of the MET 7 at this time. However, I use the WATT 1's OR my STAX tube driven Lambda headphones for serious work. Both are almost too revealing, especially for TV or CD sound (my CD sound at least).
Bear, you are right, Sequerra's speakers are more forgiving than a REAL analytical speaker should be. I NEVER make serious component evaluations with them. I have used 5 different models over the years and use 3 different versions of the MET 7 at this time. However, I use the WATT 1's OR my STAX tube driven Lambda headphones for serious work. Both are almost too revealing, especially for TV or CD sound (my CD sound at least).
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Wall of Sound
Do you think Sennheiser HD650's are good enough? That's all I have and I'm not about to buy anything else.
bear said:
Do you think Sennheiser HD650's are good enough? That's all I have and I'm not about to buy anything else.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Wall of Sound
Sorry, may I suggest next time when you have a question for a specific member only to use the little button labelled "email"?
For the rest, you nicely avoided almost everything I was saying (including the example and question). No problem, we'll keep living in different world, hopefully not to often on collision courses. 🙂
bear said:
Sorry, may I suggest next time when you have a question for a specific member only to use the little button labelled "email"?
For the rest, you nicely avoided almost everything I was saying (including the example and question). No problem, we'll keep living in different world, hopefully not to often on collision courses. 🙂
ok, your second and third links are nice first of April jokes, your first link was pulled/separated from the overall discussion. If you really sure that ceramic caps are good for power supply decoupling (your words) then my job is secure. Please continue to spread your skillfull opinion as wide as possible, at least across this board.
janneman said:
I thought it was John Donne:
"Therefore, send not to know
For whom the bell tolls,
It tolls for thee."
😉
dimitri said:
I will certainly do so.
And don't bother to justify your opinions, JC Assistants don't do that, it's in the job description. Oblique comments like yours are highly appreciated across this board.
And don't worry, nobody wants your job. You are safe.
Excuse me; unfortunately I'm not JC Assistant. Nevertheless, thank you for your comment, now I see that you never worked for test and measurement.
dimitri said:
Really? Here are some quotes that I'm sure you'll find "pulled/separated from the overall discussion".
Should I understand you refused the generous offer?No, you are right, I never "worked for test and measurement". Only you know the relevance in the current context, but whatever...
john curl said:
dimitri said:
john curl said:
You certainly need to work on your sense of humor. 🙂
Over and out.
Mike Gergen said:
Hi
Any standard relating to equipment such as test bench / lab power supplies may be relevant here.
I’ve got several modern lab power supplies, all of which have fully floating secondary circuits. The most modern is a Topward band unit containing two independent variable supplies. There is only one internal transformer and the secondaries for both supplies are fully isolated from ground/mains earth.
This allows the supplies to be connected in series with other external power supplies.
Mains earth binding posts are provided on the front panel so that the supplies can be strapped to earth if required.
Are types of equipment like this just exempt from the earthed secondary rule? Are there more stringent requirements for the primary-secondary isolation / construction of the transformer (Though I would not have guess so, looking at these units)?
Cheers,
Glen
G.Kleinschmidt said:
Exactly as my HP6627A lab PS. Four 0-20V/80V @ 40W fully floating outputs in one enclosure, single power transformer. The spec says outputs can be floated up to 240Vdc to any other terminal or the chassis ground.
Syno8, the word is Associate, not Assistant. Colleague is even a better word. Be precise, if you are going to parse with us. You are not originally from an English speaking country, I would suspect.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Wall of Sound
I have no idea if they are "good enough" or not! Truly don't.
But you did say that they permitted you to hear the diff between MP3 and Redbook, right? So, on that basis they are the best you have. Perhaps they will also permit you to discern other differences as well?
Have you changed the opamps in the IV and buffer (filter if there is one) in your DAC? If you listen with your headphones, perhaps you will hear a difference? Could this be possible? Why not try it?
Or if that opamp is not convenient, pick some others in the signal path that are?? Maybe even a competitor's low distortion product too?
And tell me, why would a man of your means not consider the purchase of a wonderful to listen to ES headphone?
_-_-bear
scott wurcer said:
I have no idea if they are "good enough" or not! Truly don't.
But you did say that they permitted you to hear the diff between MP3 and Redbook, right? So, on that basis they are the best you have. Perhaps they will also permit you to discern other differences as well?
Have you changed the opamps in the IV and buffer (filter if there is one) in your DAC? If you listen with your headphones, perhaps you will hear a difference? Could this be possible? Why not try it?
Or if that opamp is not convenient, pick some others in the signal path that are?? Maybe even a competitor's low distortion product too?
And tell me, why would a man of your means not consider the purchase of a wonderful to listen to ES headphone?
_-_-bear
Bear,
Why don't we leave it at, "let's get together at the next burning amp or whatever and you can show me what you mean". As I found last year face to face removes a lot of the BS. I does give one pause, 35yr. and not one good missile into the Lipshitz/Toole bunker.
Why don't we leave it at, "let's get together at the next burning amp or whatever and you can show me what you mean". As I found last year face to face removes a lot of the BS. I does give one pause, 35yr. and not one good missile into the Lipshitz/Toole bunker.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Wall of Sound
Sorry we crossed paths. I already explained that to JC. I don't indulge my hobbies, midwest, blue collar, Catholic, etc. A teenage car meant your dad bought you a $50 Fiat smoker with a bad clutch.
bear said:
Sorry we crossed paths. I already explained that to JC. I don't indulge my hobbies, midwest, blue collar, Catholic, etc. A teenage car meant your dad bought you a $50 Fiat smoker with a bad clutch.
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