I'm sorry, but your post is confusing to me. But it seems to me if you want to move the music a bit you could use the balance control a lot more effectively and easier than moving the speakers around for every recording.
So, what about stereo? Isn't that what I was referring to in my post? I only added that a mono disc can be useful to check.
Sure if you sit anywhere on the centerline between the two speakers you will generally get decent sound and image. But that's not the only way to get decent sound and image, though I understand that that is not well understood.
But it's the best way unless the room is really screwing with the relative sound pressure levels in either half of the room from the two speakers, and if that's the case, why not simply use the balance control and preserve the time element?
Better to short circuit your balance button ( and get rid of its noise and distortion) and position your speakers and your listening position once forever. And it is not a complicated process. Pretty trivial, in fact.
Equilateral triangle IS a requisite.
Yes, and the position and the dimensions/angles of that equilateral triangle are room dependent.... that's what this 'controversy' is all about. Once the principles of setting that triangle so that it 'cooperates' with the room are learned yes it does become trivial and second nature.
How the room decor/arrangement/ergonomics works out is another matter. Ime/imo balance control can't/rarely fixes centering problems because program embedded noise and system noise swings with the pan setting also.
Dan.
How the room decor/arrangement/ergonomics works out is another matter. Ime/imo balance control can't/rarely fixes centering problems because program embedded noise and system noise swings with the pan setting also.
Dan.
Last edited:
A lot of time could have been saved if it had been made clear from the outset that the laws of bendy physics were being used
Perhaps he was referring to your mention of equilateral triangles with angles/sides depending on the room. The issue would be that equilateral triangles always have equal angles = 60 degrees. The angles can't differ from that value in Euclidean space, but they can differ in curved space models (e.g. we can model black holes as warping space-time into some curvature). Possibly, you may have been thinking of Isosceles triangles, rather than equilateral?
We could think to add a digital delay to the nearest enclosure if they are not at the same distance from the listener ?
Or to glue the speakers, for people nostalgic of gramophones ?
Or, on the contrary, to spread them in such a way that one would think to listen to headphones ?
I worry to go with a flying saucer close to a black hole each time I want to listen a record of Frank Zappa or David Lee Roth.
YouTube
But beware, it has been reported that some listeners had mysteriously disappeared after they cheated with the equilateral law.
Attachments
A Strategic Air Command friend (no longer with us) told me that flying through the Bermuda Triangle the navigation equipment would go on the blink! So every so often they would do it for fun!!!
I believe the tale seeing as she was a chaplain and very no nonsense.
The other story about her, was one day she found someone selling drugs in the church parking lot. All 4' 10" of her tackled the 6' 1" dealer, he beat her off sending her to the hospital. The police explained to her that the local professional crime folks did not tolerate such things and the dealer would quickly get out of town once he realized what he had done. He did, but after he thought things had cooled off he came back. That was noted when his body was found floating in the nearby river.
I liked her quite a bit.
Contrary to popular belief, magnetic declination or any other magnetic variation in that area is not anything special.
There are other places around the globe where navigation using magnetic heading becomes impossible.
An Overview of the Earth's Magnetic Field
Such pilots carry in their bookcases a magnetic declination map (official print, subject to frequent revisions). Ask them to show you one and then make the question on what principle(magnetic, inertial, radio?) the navigation equipment “which go on the blink” work
George
Who was in charge of the "lowering" ? Her or the local professional crime folks ?
George,
I suspect they weren't using a magnetic compass. Don't know what location system was in use then. GPS if around back then probably wasn't fully implemented. But it seemed it was sort of a game to map out where their instruments didn't work. (Cuba?)
BTY folks wanted her to go to War College so they could make her a General. She liked where she was, mainly a civilian Pastor.
As to magnetic compasses, when I was doing Jacob's Field (Baseball) in Cleveland very close to the lake, the satellite antenna guys were convinced the satellite antennas were on the wrong side of the ballpark. I took up my great uncle's K&E compass. He had used it to make maps to route water from the Hoover Dam (Near Bolder Colorado) to Los Angeles. Later he used it to map the Grand Canyon national park. It showed the due South was North. Easy to determine where north really was you could see the lake that separated the United States from Canada.
BTY my great uncle's last project was to help layout the borders of Israel. I did learn a bit about surveying from him!
Last edited:
Motor oil thread first.
NNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!
lolol
Howie
Youse gots sometin against this?:
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/attachments/rx-2nd-gen-2004-2009/214519d1309192909-new-dubs-for-the-rx-lex.jpg
Howie
So, given the prevailing view that one must sit at the point of a triangle with the speakers for the best sound, with no definition of how large or small this point actually may be, one can easily conclude that there is only one seat in the house worth sitting in.
So, what about the sound in a music venue where you listen to the music on the venue sound system? The music comes from the speakers on the side of the stage, not from the place where the musicians are standing/sitting and playing. You do not have to sit at a triangle point with the venue speakers to get good sound. You can pretty much be anywhere in the venue as long as you are not right up close to one side of the stage and getting blasted by the speaker on that side.
The venue doesn't matter. It can be large or small. The venue speakers will equally put the same amount of sound into the venue space so that it does not matter where you are in the venue space, you will hear each speaker equally.
Why can't you do that at home?
So, what about the sound in a music venue where you listen to the music on the venue sound system? The music comes from the speakers on the side of the stage, not from the place where the musicians are standing/sitting and playing. You do not have to sit at a triangle point with the venue speakers to get good sound. You can pretty much be anywhere in the venue as long as you are not right up close to one side of the stage and getting blasted by the speaker on that side.
The venue doesn't matter. It can be large or small. The venue speakers will equally put the same amount of sound into the venue space so that it does not matter where you are in the venue space, you will hear each speaker equally.
Why can't you do that at home?
Ooh,ooh, Mr. Kotter, Mr. Kotter....I got this!!
Because the stage won't fit in the home??
Seriously though, the discussion is about soundstage, how the system can fool us into "seeing" the sounds spacially.
That must be distinguished from fidelity.
For me, a good system is capable of supporting the imaging even if I am not directly on axis. While the source ITD is fixed relative, ILD off axis throws perception around a bit. Some thing are done to compensate, such as horizontal dispersion characteristics and toe in/out.
But eventually, the farther off axis you get, the image elements will shift relative to the central image source, and frequency dependent localization as well such that the image breaks up.
Humans...go figure.
Jn
Because the stage won't fit in the home??
Seriously though, the discussion is about soundstage, how the system can fool us into "seeing" the sounds spacially.
That must be distinguished from fidelity.
For me, a good system is capable of supporting the imaging even if I am not directly on axis. While the source ITD is fixed relative, ILD off axis throws perception around a bit. Some thing are done to compensate, such as horizontal dispersion characteristics and toe in/out.
But eventually, the farther off axis you get, the image elements will shift relative to the central image source, and frequency dependent localization as well such that the image breaks up.
Humans...go figure.
Jn
- Status
- Not open for further replies.