I find it pathetic, but there you go. The hypocrisy might be called outstanding as who else but Dan goes running to the mods when he perceives himself to be on the receiving end?
There are a bunch here who seek every opportunity to denigrate others, especially JC every time he posts, JN's response was completely inappropriate and uncalled for. I am just asking that these kinds of attacks stop, a forlorn wish perhaps but it would improve the productivity of this forum.
Dan.
Dan.
___________
When you make a statement like the one above, I look at something like this:-
"It would seem that there are many here who would like to talk about 'amateur' physics experiments with loudspeakers than I would."
And there we have it. A dissmissive, derogatory 'professional' that takes any opportunity he can at self-promotion while denigrating the efforts of others - many of them highly qualified professionals in their own right.
I would have though JC would be smart enough to recognize that although he may be good in one specific area (high distortion JFET input circuits) that's where it ends. He cannot be good at everything and should defer to others greater knowledge outside his area of expertise.
"JN's response was completely inappropriate and uncalled for."
Absolutely agree with you on that.
Agreed. "cause"
Disagree. "effect"
As an example, when a child or a puppy does something that is unacceptable, you can either ignore it or take corrective action. Ignoring emboldens the incorrect behavior. Corrective action, or even feedback on what is acceptable are two options.
Personally, I prefer it such that the "cause" never happen. If it didn't, there would be no "effect".
It's very easy for Dan to try and claim the high road by pretending the "cause" never happened, and to only attack the "effect".
Cheap seat..
And you, bonsai..as far as I'm concerned, your post was, shall we say, appropriate..I may not agree in entirety, but life is too short to worry about the small stuff.
jn
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JN,
JC just commented that he would prefer to talk about other stuff than fine points of speaker driver design, a subject that is probably better discussed on another thread. And 'amateur' physics experiments is not intended as derogatory and is entirely appropriate.......the propositions and musings are most certainly not formal investigation by the likes of JBL labs or Klippel etc.
JN, you have reacted inappropriately and rudely, I thought you are better than that, perhaps you can prove so into the future.
Dan.
I am not the only one who considered it dissmissive, derogatory, and denigrating. Given that you have chosen to attempt to rebrand it as innocent shows how you want to slant everything. I am not the only one to see that as comedic.
Calling something rude and inappropriate is just an opinion. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
Facts, everyone is not entitled to their own facts. I recommend you lose the pom poms..
As to name dropping JBL and Klippel, sigh... they are certainly not top of the food chain when it comes to magnetics. They are good, some of the best in audio.. but not in the world.
jn
Calling something rude and inappropriate is just an opinion. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
Facts, everyone is not entitled to their own facts. I recommend you lose the pom poms..
As to name dropping JBL and Klippel, sigh... they are certainly not top of the food chain when it comes to magnetics. They are good, some of the best in audio.. but not in the world.
jn
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As this is an audio forum discussing audio components, circuits and products, I believe that the only measure is how any special knowledge reflects in improvement in audio, not in a special discipline not related to audio. So the only measure are results in audio, better say audible progress in audio. All else may be interesting, but probably pointless.
Agreed. And since I am specifically discussing the magnetic structure, design, tradeoffs, testing, and improvements of loudspeakers with those here, I believe it does indeed represent a topic of interest within audio. The best part, is I approach the task with a different set of skills and experience, so am more inclined to see some out of the box things that might otherwise be missed. And I am NOT discussing how to improve a special discipline here, that would be kinda pointless, but rather, trying to bring in some knowledge from a special discipline to solve standing problems in audio.
A good example is the AE website. I looked at one of the 12 inch driver test results, and come away quite confused that a bare driver which clearly shows resonance and two hf breakpoints has a phase response of exactly zero across the entire audio band, especially through resonance.
Am I the only one who would question that result?
As to a front plate being a single turn short, that's been around what, 100 years? Has it been questioned before? If not, shouldn't it be?
jn
A good example is the AE website. I looked at one of the 12 inch driver test results, and come away quite confused that a bare driver which clearly shows resonance and two hf breakpoints has a phase response of exactly zero across the entire audio band, especially through resonance.
Am I the only one who would question that result?
As to a front plate being a single turn short, that's been around what, 100 years? Has it been questioned before? If not, shouldn't it be?
jn
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The way I see it there seems to be something happening here that might actually be of some importance........who really gives two turds about politeness, the world is a rude place, buck up.
Now back to regular programming 😛
Now back to regular programming 😛
Yes, this is all good and I do not disregard your work.
Sure, it is likely that some of us at least have knowledge sets that are useful. I have commented that I have found magnet assemblies to be noisy and that Goop clarifies/reduces this noise......if this is due to permanent magnet field modulation/domain shifting due to VC field or due to pole piece eddy currents induced by VC currents I am not sure.
Whatever the cause closer investigation of all speaker magnetic circuit components is required to clarify distortion causes.
A 'shorted turn' in magnetically conducting iron disc as opposed to copper shorting ring ?.
Dan.
You never have. I have never found you to be unpleasant.
The front plate has both magnetic and electric conduction. Magnetically, the flux lines are parallel to the front surface heading radially, and there I would go laminated plates to kill eddies. Electrically, the emf generated by the vc creates circumfrential(sp) currents, and the slit is to stop them dead. As you mentioned, the basket would have to be isolated electrically to prevent completing the loop. But the basket is not positioned to trap time varying flux, so nothing needs to be done to it other than electrical isolation, maybe a 5 mil shim of something, or a class 3 anodized surface.
This thinking reminds me of power steering in a car. With the gain set very very high, you can turn the wheel with a feather, but some would simply flip the vehicle at high speed. In that case, viscous damping would help in stability. Same thing with PID loops, the damping helps control the system.
I suspect an aluminum shorting ring to be that damping.
I think a speaker magnetic system should be made as high a bandwidth as possible, and then look at what you have left. The things needed to control then may not be the same as what is considered for control now.
jn
Apologies jn - in my haste to post, I meant to put 'JC's response was . . .' my bad, I screwed up. So I'll redo it (age . . . my mind is slipping 😉 )
"JC's response was completely inappropriate and uncalled for."
Absolutely agree with that
No, I thought your post was as out of order as was JC's (which must be number 1000 in a long list of such posts by him). But lets leave it at that if you will.
See my response to jn.
And that's where the parallel stops. Speaking from my own experience, pet animals (in particular dogs) have a very short memory span, measures in seconds. That is, if you reprimand the dog while caught in action, he will get the message, and can be effective in reflexes training. 30 seconds later, he would have no idea why he was reprimanded and take you action as a hostile behavior. Also unfair for the dog.
What applies to humans from these facts, YMMV. I would think it depends on the particular human specimen.
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