John Curl's Blowtorch preamplifier part II

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Richard, what's the purpose of such test? Do you want to quantify the damage that's being done by inserting AD/DA in the signal chain?

yes. That includes - all folded in together - all sources of distortion and noise. Got suggestions before I place an order for ADC? Then I'll add to it until the whole path of equipment is added in....... the system distortion as a whole that I listen to. Because we dont just hear one piece of gear at a time but the whole system. My personal goal would be to have a complete audio system that was <.1% at my normal listening levels in my home. Actually, I think I can get under .25% including speakers ( excluding bass) or headphones.



THx-RNMarsh
 
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I run external USB soundcard connected to my netbook as a matter of course.

That said, the measured performance figures for modern desktop higher end internal soundcards are spectacularly good.
The Xonar_Essence_ST/specifications/ claims 124 dB SNR, Output THD+N at 1kHz:0.0003% (-110dB), and audiophile goodies like Nichicon "Fine Gold" capacitors and
Op-amp swap kit content:
1 x Needle-nose pliers
2 x LME49720
1 x MUSES8820

Dan.

Yes , nice !
But only as good as what powers it.
The typical PC SMPS is a RF laden disaster waiting to happen. Scope the typical
PC's ground -major RF.
I'm sure Asus has a REAL good PS to conduct these tests at the factory.

OS
 
Got suggestions before I place an order for ADC?

Richard, both of you - you and JC probably know enough people in the industry. I'd suggest you talk to them, since they are the ones who have access to all the latest and greatest and/or have the knowledge.
If I could justify the purchase, I personally would go for some complete custom design, like dCS did back in the day, or at least something that don't use on-chip decimation filters. Or even go DSD route with off-line decimation to PCM using SOTA software.
If budget is limited, in addition to what you have found, I would also consider some ADCs by Mytek.
DISCLAIMER: I am in no way related to them.

Best,
 
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I am still intrigued by the fact that 24bit R-2R audio DACs are EOL and DS is the only game in town. I remember the backlash against bitstream from some quarters in the early 90s. Is multibit just too expensive at this level or are the latest DS chips so good that they equal the performance of other technologies? For those chasing the resolution and low IM of 24 bit systems this would seem to be a vital question. If you believe the slide from a few pages ago then DS has artifacts that are audible so the benchmark DAC is not the benchmark...
 
If budget is limited, in addition to what you have found, I would also consider some ADCs by Mytek.
DISCLAIMER: I am in no way related to them.

Best,

I found this comment interesting. AFAIK most/all the pro-summer products use ESS IC's at this time.

I tested:

- A Benchmark DAC1 feeding Hypex UcD400HG with HxR monoblock amps into Tyler Acoustic Decade D1 speakers

- A Benchmark DAC1 direct into Sennheiser HD-650 headphones

- A Mytek Stereo96 DAC direct into Sennheiser HD-650 headphones

- A Mytek Stereo96 DAC into a Sontec MEP-250EX EQ into a FCS P3S ME compressor (both engaged) back into a Mytek Stereo96 ADC into my DAW

- A Macbook laptop, both built-in speakers and with headphones using the CPU's 1/8" jack

All produced audible intermodulation with the 30khz+33khz test file I linked. So, I'd say the issue is pretty common and not just related to consumer level or none high end equipment.
 
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Frank
All this process of manually upsampling a 44.1k you propose, is actually automatically performed by the humble DAC in the CD player.
x4, x8, x16 oversampling, then interpolation, then the low pass (reconstruction) filtering and you have that good approximation of the analog HF waveform.

Re pixel driven multi-driver loudspeaker -aka digital loudspeaker-see here (this is the first of many refining patents) :

APPARATUS AND METHODS FOR GENERATING PRESSURE WAVES

George
 
the test results in stereophile suggest its pretty darned good inside a PC as well.

Yes , "inside the PC" ....
As long as your analog is wearing it's "RF condom" , it might be alright when hooked
to it.
I'm running toslink spdif to my TV , then to my amp. Better SQ , no ground loop.
Why get a -124db sound card just to have it swamped out by a ground loop ?
A PC is not really audio equipment , it processes and streams ....
OS
 

MEMS actually, they have some recent stuff on their web site. Interesting though there is little acoustic theory (at least in that patent) and I would think there is a problem in simply moving air at 30 or so Hz. for a serious larger application. They are talking wafer scale MEMS and there is no starting material at less than the $100's of dollars range.
 
Who thinks light is made from particles and who thinks light is from waves?

My Alma Mater, LLNL, sent this to me: New proof that Einstein was correct, again -- the first photograph of light -->

The first photo of light as both particle and wave | Technologist

:cool:

THx- RNMarsh

I haven't read the original research, but the write-up you posted has a huge technical hole in it. The assumption that the e beam hits or doesn't needs significant work.. The article makes conclusions that are not supported by physics. A guy here had the same "problem" with near misses and hits between e's and ions. "Bremsstrahlung" comes to mind.

I do agree that the false color images are really cool. Thanks for the link.

Ok. That is the end of this discussion, then. I certainly am not going back to CD nor LP for the highest potential in my system.

Might even help with greening of the planet without all those plastic disks..... kinda offset things for my high gas usage. Pos points to cancel the demerits.


THx-RNMarsh

Been looking at cars recently. First time I saw the CO2 production per mile numbers on the vehicle paper. A guy here used to bring in a pound of charcoal for the public speaking tours, and show that this is roughly the amount of weight in CO2 that they put into the air during the drive here.

It is also interesting that they state that the number does not reflect the CO2 created while building the car.

JC and I just talked briefly today about SE's shabby behaviour but the good news is that we thought to try a differential comparator (subtraction) between a pure analog sine wave(s) and its digital R/P in parallel path. Look to see what differences there are at various levels. Could even compare different types of converter architecture etc. But then there ought not be any differences by some accounts.

Who is up for that?


THx-RNMarsh
He does make some good points however, despite delivery.

As to your differential test, how will you account for the brick artifacts at both ends of the D stream?

And even more difficult, how would you accommodate ITD issues?

I have a distinct memory of coming across this idea at some stage, fanciful though it seems; variations on having truly "digital" speakers have popped up at times, though extremely unlikely to ever get anywhere ...
I also recall reading something about this. However, since the bit actuators are not physically in the same location, the resultant wavefront will be directional and word value dependent.

I suspect it will never be useful for actual hi fidelity reproduction.

jn
 
ASUS Xonar Essence ST/STX soundcards Measurements | Stereophile.com

Tell me what is wrong with that? Ground loops can happen with anything.

They seem to happen more often with PC's (which have to be grounded).

Two DIY creations (amp and DAC) , that I will soon have .. won't have
problems. My CD and TV are double insulated - no problem there , either.

That pacific DAC has an "Anal" Analog supply , it better ....for 15K$.
(highly doubt that would have issues).
OS
 
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I also recall reading something about this. However, since the bit actuators are not physically in the same location, the resultant wavefront will be directional and word value dependent.

A few years ago a guy had a demo at an AES convention of a 128 small speaker driver array (1 inch drivers IIRC) digitally driven. Sounded actually like music but thin and beaming, just as you would expect.

Jan
 
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