darkm4n said:I say that because in my house i don't have any HiFi .. only PA stuff ... in my opinion they are best ... true bass that really shake you ... an earthquake in your room ...
PA stuff is build with this idea in mind, I have to agree... only prob would be that the bass that you hear & feel is overemphasized at certain frequencies by the way the cabinets are built. It's not fullrange bass, you have lots of peaks & resonances.
So the PA systems boom, have ear-wax melting highs (horned piezo tweeters I guess) but the midrange & overall quality lacks a lot.
BAH, talk all you want. The fact of the matter is that anything I spend my limited free time building will sound (to me anyway) better than anything I go to the store and buy...
Unless is sounds like crap, but that simply means that I haven't spent enough time on it yet!
In reality I do this stuff because I love doing it. Whether someone else will think my system is better than store bought is up for them to decide.
-Wes
Unless is sounds like crap, but that simply means that I haven't spent enough time on it yet!
In reality I do this stuff because I love doing it. Whether someone else will think my system is better than store bought is up for them to decide.
-Wes
Hmm...
I don't think .. no DIY amp can compare to a Crown one ...
About the speaker's ... JBL and DynaCord rulz.... !!
I know you can do an amp .. but the quality of it is less than a crown one ... it's not that you don't know how to do it .. it's that you don't have the tool's to do it like a PA store amp ... they have huge lab's full of people that test every little part of it ... every little screw and part .. that's why that amp will never fail ..
I know all people like to say that what they do is the best .. i like that too but i have to admit that it dosn't compare to a comany made amp ...
I don't think .. no DIY amp can compare to a Crown one ...
About the speaker's ... JBL and DynaCord rulz.... !!
I know you can do an amp .. but the quality of it is less than a crown one ... it's not that you don't know how to do it .. it's that you don't have the tool's to do it like a PA store amp ... they have huge lab's full of people that test every little part of it ... every little screw and part .. that's why that amp will never fail ..
I know all people like to say that what they do is the best .. i like that too but i have to admit that it dosn't compare to a comany made amp ...
i can confirm that too .. since i was there and i saw how they test the amp's ... they get a scruedriver and insert it in the amp .. make a short ciurcuit and note on a copybook what damage make's ... that's for the service manual's ... if an amp brake because one component fail they read the note from the copy book and they know what done that damage .
Don't mention about the full week's of working at full volume and etc ... they are hamered and droped on concret block's to see if resist and when it fail's ..
That's why comany made amp and the best ...
i was ameased to see a brand new amp and a mad operator with a scruedriver hitting the beauty ...
Don't mention about the full week's of working at full volume and etc ... they are hamered and droped on concret block's to see if resist and when it fail's ..
That's why comany made amp and the best ...
i was ameased to see a brand new amp and a mad operator with a scruedriver hitting the beauty ...
Re: Hmm...
To achieve quality levels like this is actually not all that hard. In a commercial product such quality is expensive for 3 reasons:
1) the time required for development
2) The time required for testing components.
3) Keep a high safety factor (overkill factor) where possible.
Neither of the above mentioned is hard to do....it just takes time, and loads of it. To test a load of different components for a specific application is naturally takes some cash, in the end you are going to end up with parts for 10 amplifiers....and only the perfect parts for 1
I know from personal experience that it takes time and money to do something like that, but in the end of the day you have to keep in mind that a DIY project is based on free labour....thats where we are able to save some cash, plus the fact that we dont have all the marketing expenses and so on.....we just pay for the parts we spend. Not that its not expensive enough. My running project is going to pass the 2.000usd mark for sure, and its only kept that low cause ive made the wast majority of the parts needed myself.
Note that this statement is aimed at audio for home use...not PA equipment for stage use, wich gets a somewhat different physical treatment
Magura
darkm4n said:
To achieve quality levels like this is actually not all that hard. In a commercial product such quality is expensive for 3 reasons:
1) the time required for development
2) The time required for testing components.
3) Keep a high safety factor (overkill factor) where possible.
Neither of the above mentioned is hard to do....it just takes time, and loads of it. To test a load of different components for a specific application is naturally takes some cash, in the end you are going to end up with parts for 10 amplifiers....and only the perfect parts for 1
I know from personal experience that it takes time and money to do something like that, but in the end of the day you have to keep in mind that a DIY project is based on free labour....thats where we are able to save some cash, plus the fact that we dont have all the marketing expenses and so on.....we just pay for the parts we spend. Not that its not expensive enough. My running project is going to pass the 2.000usd mark for sure, and its only kept that low cause ive made the wast majority of the parts needed myself.
Note that this statement is aimed at audio for home use...not PA equipment for stage use, wich gets a somewhat different physical treatment
Magura
This is an amusing an informative thread. But it is like 4 blind
men describing an elephant.
Everything said here has a good deal of truth, but I can tell you
also that everything here has also missed the mark.
I do, however, recommend that you find out for yourselves -
it is generally a rewarding pursuit.
men describing an elephant.
Everything said here has a good deal of truth, but I can tell you
also that everything here has also missed the mark.
I do, however, recommend that you find out for yourselves -
it is generally a rewarding pursuit.
Nelson Pass said:
As stated above.....im working on the case.
To actually answer the question asked "if you can homebrew better than the big boys"....sure you can. You can choose any what so ever narrow angle at this, like making an amp just for your speakers in your listening room, at the loudness you prefer, with the flavour of your preferrence. Any of the big guys would have to design their amps to go with a number of speakers. On top of that youre not limited in time or component expense the same way a commercial designer is.
So the answer must be a sure YES
Somebody else here already gave us the recipe:
Steal the best, invent the rest
Magura
Magura said:
that is likely a disadvantage to DIYers,
Magura said:So the answer must be a sure YES
I think definitively the answer is yes because it was asking for the possibility. As to probability? I think for the majority of us, we cannot outdo the commecial guys in terms of performance, economics, and looks. However, we are into DIY for the most part not for the above, or not for all the above at the same time.
That is, the end results matter less. The journey, the pain and suffering in making the amp, is what we are after. Me at least.
millwood said:
I beg to differ, if i wasnt sure i could make something at least on par (preferably better) with the best visually, and an exact match of my wishes into sound.....i wouldnt have even started
I accept to spend 2 or 3 years building an amp....as long as the end result is perfect, no flaws what so ever, according to the goal set that is...im sure many wouldnt think its the perfect result...but for my wishes....perfect
80% of the reason im into this is that this way i can get something that wouldnt be in my reach othervise.
Several others on this forum are sure very result orientated, much more than 80%
Magura
Any fool with money can buy high-end audio equipment (and any fool often does)
If I had a unlimited finances I would still design and build my own electronics, just with better tools... and a dedicated workshop... and lots of complicated looking equipment that I'd have no idea how to use.... and.. and.. and....
If I had a unlimited finances I would still design and build my own electronics, just with better tools... and a dedicated workshop... and lots of complicated looking equipment that I'd have no idea how to use.... and.. and.. and....
Richard C said:If I had a unlimited finances I would still design and build my own electronics, just with better tools... and a dedicated workshop... and lots of complicated looking equipment that I'd have no idea how to use.... and.. and.. and....
I think financially, it is foolish to do what you are thinking about doing: it is a lot easier and cheaper to buy commercial off-the-shelf amps than to put one together yourself. Just think about the time and tools involved.
However, at least for me, I wouldn't have the same "enjoyment" with commercial amps as I do with the ones I put together myself.
They may not sound as good, or look as pretty, or as safe, but they are made by me.
millwood said:
Thanks, very sensible advice.
You're right, what was I thinking, and the time I'd save by not building things would free up more time to watch TV and go shopping.
And the shops would be filled with enlightened ex-artists who'd realised that buying a nice framed print is a whole lot less hassle than creating their own
we'd all be free from the burden of expensive, time consuming creativity.But if all the artists were out buying nice prints, who would be painting the pictures for poster companies to make nice prints of? My point is that DIY is not just fun, it's a great way (maybe even the best way) to learn about electronic engineering, and can help your career prospects. I started out as a DIYer and I now have a job doing electronic design.
Yes, the cost of building is rather high than a midrange, off-the shelf amp...
I have already spent $700+ on PCBs, parts & heatsinks.... (two monoaural kits)
$100 for two 1KVA toroids
$100 for a cheap soldering station
$100 for a 'good' multimeter....
And I haven't even thought about two monoblock cases... yet
I have already spent $700+ on PCBs, parts & heatsinks.... (two monoaural kits)
$100 for two 1KVA toroids
$100 for a cheap soldering station
$100 for a 'good' multimeter....
And I haven't even thought about two monoblock cases... yet
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