Let's say I'm trying to find a windows 10 or 7 equivalent, "work alike" desktop environment for some older people who literally do not have the time to retrain, due to health issues.
Is there a distro out there that I can install and resolve any hardware issues for them, do a small amount of retraining, and expect they'll be ok? I'm wondering if there's any open source DTE that is very Windows-like?
Is there a distro out there that I can install and resolve any hardware issues for them, do a small amount of retraining, and expect they'll be ok? I'm wondering if there's any open source DTE that is very Windows-like?
Probably not.
All Linux desktop environments are pretty much like Windows, but none of them are Windows.
People will look for the “Start” button everywhere and complain they cannot stop their computer.
Even Microsoft faced that problem now that they decided to do away with it in Windows.
All Linux desktop environments are pretty much like Windows, but none of them are Windows.
People will look for the “Start” button everywhere and complain they cannot stop their computer.
Even Microsoft faced that problem now that they decided to do away with it in Windows.
You mean they didn't include it in Windows 11? If so, what a fail - I cannot see why not to include it, or at least make it optional.
I'm in the same boat as the OP (and a lot of you as well). Screw what MS has done here. I'm an old Unix/Linux dude with tons of CLI experience, but that's just me. I can adapt pretty easily, although I'm so used to Windows that it will be a little painful to start.
I think for my folks I'll buy them the extended security updates for a little while, but at the same time keep looking for a very Windows-like DTE (again, 7 or 10) that runs on Linux. It's going to be more private by far, and likely more secure, maybe at the expense of some hardware and/or software support.
I'm in the same boat as the OP (and a lot of you as well). Screw what MS has done here. I'm an old Unix/Linux dude with tons of CLI experience, but that's just me. I can adapt pretty easily, although I'm so used to Windows that it will be a little painful to start.
I think for my folks I'll buy them the extended security updates for a little while, but at the same time keep looking for a very Windows-like DTE (again, 7 or 10) that runs on Linux. It's going to be more private by far, and likely more secure, maybe at the expense of some hardware and/or software support.
I transitioned my father from Windows to Linux back around 2012-2013. I was nervous that it would be constant questions and problems, so I kept his Windows 7 disk safe while we attempted the transition.
I installed Mint with the default DE, Cinnamon (or was it MATE?). Created some shortcuts to email, browser, etc. on his desktop. It was a massive success! He had no trouble at all adapting to it. He was in his 70s at the time.
The best part? My support requests dropped to nearly zero. Rather than spending hours helping him clean out malware, scan for viruses, troubleshoot driver issues, or whatever, I was able to enjoy the weekend visits with my parents. Once in a while I would ask him if he had any questions or problems, and he’d say “nope, it just works and it never changes, so it’s perfect for me.”
That's awesome (especially the hasn't changed part, haha)!
In my case it just isn't an option, sadly. I'm hopeful that MS prices things fairly - they are doing largely security fixes afaik, and they likely have a large install base that refuses to 'upgrade' to 11, so maybe they will do the pricing right. I do know that if they don't do that and choose to do the opposite, I will be one of the people that choose to help with alternatives - meaning in an active fashion.
In my case it just isn't an option, sadly. I'm hopeful that MS prices things fairly - they are doing largely security fixes afaik, and they likely have a large install base that refuses to 'upgrade' to 11, so maybe they will do the pricing right. I do know that if they don't do that and choose to do the opposite, I will be one of the people that choose to help with alternatives - meaning in an active fashion.
I think your best bet is to choose the hardware based on linux compatibility. That takes a bit of research, unless you can find a vendor that specifies linux capability. The big problem is some hardware does not have a published specification.
Just make sure you defeat the auto update in Linux.
EDIT: Oh, I'm still running a 22 year old Pentium machine at home on Ubuntu ( I forget which version, I upgraded it ten years ago ). It runs my Intranet Apache server. I've been thinking of replacing it with a Raspberry... one of these days... but it works. so....
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I have never done this and never had a problem. I just choose the components I want, build it, and install Linux. It is fairly rare these days to have hardware compatibility issues, with the exception of things like fingerprint readers and some older NICs.
No Linux distro I have ever used had auto update. Which distro(s) are you warning about?
^We had CentOS deployed in a bunch of machines. The tech upgraded them and forgot to disable the auto update. One weekend we had 100 lab machines upgrade themselves and suddenly our nightly regression tests stopped working.
Really useful comment. Good to know. My parents are late 80s and early 90s. I've had them on all OS's over the decades and forcing them to throw out two perfectly good all in one PCs is a step too far. It is either Mint (I use it on a spare machine just for fun) or go Apple (like their iphone/ipad)
For most applications, a Chromebook is what most people need.
Even a nice $200 Android tablet...
I love it when some idiots send me scary threatening email from admin@.....com... meaning my OWN mail server... I mean, I own the mail server, I am the admin...
And then you get those nasty looking http loaded windows in your browser warning you that they have hijacked you machine.. CTRL-ALT-DEL ... I guess most people though believe those jokers.
The best was back in 2000 when I spam begun. I had this a$$ in Canada ( I tracked him ) sending out porno spam email. At the time I connected directly to my Internet mail server from my work machines... so imagine the shock when I opened some personal email one day and suddenly, on my nice 20" Sony Triniton display, I had... a porno picture.. At work.
Anyhow, I tracked the guy. He got put out of business. We lived in a better World then.
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I have been using GNU Linux for the last nineteen years and don't plan switching back to MS Windows although I have to have a running installation of Windows for my USB oscilloscope. My distribution of choice is Debian or Devuan because they let me install whatever I want as a desktop or window manager. Moreover, Debian has a huge repository of packages/software covering a huge range of different software applications.
The freedom from a CPU cycle eating antivirus is what kept me using GNU Linux. Linux does not need it but that depends on what one does with his/her computer.
I remember the days when the graphical environment failed to run and one ended up with only a textual terminal. However, this failure is now history as modern versions of Linux do not fail to run a graphical environment.
For those wanting a short description of the most used desktop graphical environments here it is:
1) XFCE mimics Windows 95 and Windows 98.
This has a "start" button named "Applications". The taskbar can be placed on all four edges of the screen. It also offers the option of customization.
2) LXDE also mimics Windows 95 and Windows 98.
3) GNOME. The current version is much like the OS found on tablets although there are options to use earlier version styles.
4) KDE. This also offers a menu for applications. This a good candidate for those migrating from Windows. KDE likes to have fast hardware with graphics acceleration.
I use XFCE4 as this is lightweight compared to KDE and GNOME. XFCE4 runs efficiently on not-so-new hardware. However, there is a limit to how old hardware can be. Older versions of Linux used to support much older hardware. This is not anymore true.
The freedom from a CPU cycle eating antivirus is what kept me using GNU Linux. Linux does not need it but that depends on what one does with his/her computer.
I remember the days when the graphical environment failed to run and one ended up with only a textual terminal. However, this failure is now history as modern versions of Linux do not fail to run a graphical environment.
For those wanting a short description of the most used desktop graphical environments here it is:
1) XFCE mimics Windows 95 and Windows 98.
This has a "start" button named "Applications". The taskbar can be placed on all four edges of the screen. It also offers the option of customization.
2) LXDE also mimics Windows 95 and Windows 98.
3) GNOME. The current version is much like the OS found on tablets although there are options to use earlier version styles.
4) KDE. This also offers a menu for applications. This a good candidate for those migrating from Windows. KDE likes to have fast hardware with graphics acceleration.
I use XFCE4 as this is lightweight compared to KDE and GNOME. XFCE4 runs efficiently on not-so-new hardware. However, there is a limit to how old hardware can be. Older versions of Linux used to support much older hardware. This is not anymore true.
I started using Linux in '95.... yep... 1995. We migrated some of our work from Solaris to Linux when we used to build our kernels. We were tired of paying for BSD.
Raspbian is good.
And so is pure Android. Meaning if you are a developer and don't need any of those stinking GUI stuff and are happy to run in the kernel....
I run my Linux machines in a headless mode.
From my main PC, or even my main Android, I run putty and mobaTerm (as an x server). Then I connect to the linux machines over my LAN and launch xterms.
So, my main machine, a Win 11 i7 13th gen Dell MFF, runs a 35" widescreen curved, and the windows can be sourced natively from my machine, or from any of the Linux/Raspberries or from remote desktop from the other windows machines ( W10 ) that I run. It's nice.
So, I'm very agnostic on the presentation manager, when I have to manage a Linux/Raspbian machine, I do it from the CLI.
I am root.
Fear me.
Raspbian is good.
And so is pure Android. Meaning if you are a developer and don't need any of those stinking GUI stuff and are happy to run in the kernel....
I run my Linux machines in a headless mode.
From my main PC, or even my main Android, I run putty and mobaTerm (as an x server). Then I connect to the linux machines over my LAN and launch xterms.
So, my main machine, a Win 11 i7 13th gen Dell MFF, runs a 35" widescreen curved, and the windows can be sourced natively from my machine, or from any of the Linux/Raspberries or from remote desktop from the other windows machines ( W10 ) that I run. It's nice.
So, I'm very agnostic on the presentation manager, when I have to manage a Linux/Raspbian machine, I do it from the CLI.
I am root.
Fear me.
Hi Tony,
I've run Fedora for years. Manual updates, I didn't even know it had an auto update feature. I just check occasionally. Never once had a problem with an update. I've run KDE and Gnome desktops, CLI when I want to do something specific.
I've run Fedora for years. Manual updates, I didn't even know it had an auto update feature. I just check occasionally. Never once had a problem with an update. I've run KDE and Gnome desktops, CLI when I want to do something specific.
I've run *nix basically all my life. Starting in the late 70's on DEC equip. A short interval on VAX/VMS. Never needed windows really. Well I did walk over to a neighbors to use their box to configure my MOTU ultralite. But the ultralite works fine on my pi-4 using camilla. Just wanted to set it up so the master volume adjusted all channels instead of just the 2 main ones. I find windows very unintuitive. But you expect what you know. I always dread when a friend who knows I am a techie thinks I can help them fix a windows issue. I try to help and on occasion have managed to find the issue, but usually it ends with me wanting to throw their machine against a wall.
As to taxes, the IRS provides fill in PDF forms that you can easily do using the evince linux pdf viewer/editor. I use this for my S corp as well as my personal taxes, which are probably on the moderate complexity level. I'd never use an online tool where I am sharing my most sensitive personal financial info with a 3rd party. I'm not interested in TT productizing my personal info for resale.
As to doc's soffice/libreOffice work fine for me. Many years ago I used FrameMaker which was an awesome document generation program, which ironically was originally *nix only. Unfortunately Adobe bought them and ruined them. I use Latex for my company document prep. If you are doing multi-thousand page docs, office is iffy. And with latex it is easy for me to integrate help calls so that the correct doc on the correct page is brought up in a pdf viewer when the user asks for help inside my software. Given my software only runs on Linux now since the demise of Sun, office isn't even an option for document display.
I really don't think I will ever need windows in my lifetime.
As to taxes, the IRS provides fill in PDF forms that you can easily do using the evince linux pdf viewer/editor. I use this for my S corp as well as my personal taxes, which are probably on the moderate complexity level. I'd never use an online tool where I am sharing my most sensitive personal financial info with a 3rd party. I'm not interested in TT productizing my personal info for resale.
As to doc's soffice/libreOffice work fine for me. Many years ago I used FrameMaker which was an awesome document generation program, which ironically was originally *nix only. Unfortunately Adobe bought them and ruined them. I use Latex for my company document prep. If you are doing multi-thousand page docs, office is iffy. And with latex it is easy for me to integrate help calls so that the correct doc on the correct page is brought up in a pdf viewer when the user asks for help inside my software. Given my software only runs on Linux now since the demise of Sun, office isn't even an option for document display.
I really don't think I will ever need windows in my lifetime.
One of the small form factor desktop PCs can be great for that as well. I have a couple of Lenovo Mxx ThinkCentre PCs kicking around. The older Intel Mac mini are great for this too. Dead quiet, low power consumption, pretty to look at, available for something like $50 many times.
Tom
A quote from a friend 40 some years ago "Honestly, have you ever written a program a PDP 11/70 couldnt run?"
"Performing a full shutdown of Windows will allow the drives to be fully mounted by Ubuntu. This can be accomplished by holding the SHIFT key as you press the "Shut down" button on the "Power" menu."
😎
After wondering why I couldnt just slip a text file I saved in Mint, over to my "Downloads" directory on the W10 side...
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