fredex said:
All of us must include ourselves,but we all must agree that "can be fooled" might as well mean "cannot be fooled" right? 🙂
fredex said:
N😵thers can be fooled,others not.About hearing or,not hearing differences.The brain of those who claim/say they don't/can't hear differences is not necessarily correct or more "healthy".
Or is it: "My brain is correct and your's is not" ?Tell me this for your brain and I will immidiately admit I'm fooled by my brain.
You're a human. Your brain can fool itself quite easily. The sentence "I'm fooled by my brain" is one that is very curious- who are "you" but an artifact of the brain's organization? I've suggested before and I'll try again- read something about neuroscience. Brain and consciousness are fascinating ares. "The Blank Slate" by Pinker is a particularly good treatment for nonspecialists.
I saw a wonderful film last night, a documentary of Penn and Teller visiting several countries to learn about their history of conjuring. The Egyptian part dealt with one of the most classic and ancient of tricks, Cups and Balls. The conjurer they were visiting put on a demo for Teller; typically, in this trick, the "victim" is shown that there is one ball under each of three cups. Then when he is asked how many balls are under each cup, he will invariably point to each cup and say, "One, one, and one." The conjurer then does the reveal, and all three balls are under one cup.
Teller, being an expert in conjuring and the cups and balls trick in particular, tried to be the polite "victim" and, despite knowing better, dutifully answered, "One, one, and one." When the reveal was done, it actually WAS one, one, and one! The conjurer, knowing whom he was performing for, faked all the sleights, and did it well enough to totally fool Teller. The expression on Teller's face was priceless.
The take-away lesson was that Teller fooled himself. His expectations completely convinced him that he saw things that weren't there. And this is a guy who is perhaps the world's greatest manipulator of human perception and expectation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qQX-jayixQ
Panicos K said:
I am fooled by my brain and I know it. 🙂
But what about motivation? What motive does the person who says he can't hear a difference have? I think the person who claims he can hear something has more motivation, there is a pay off.
SY said:
Tell us that your brain does not fool you when you say/claim you don't/cannot hear cable differences and I will immidiately admit that I am fooled by my brain.It seems to me that your coins are all one sided SY.I have bought from a trick shop something similar with the three balls when I was 12,same with some cards etc....I could and still can burn the card you will pick in front of your eyes and then pull it from your ear and show it to you.
Yes, it's absolutely possible that my expectations prevent me from hearing things I otherwise could.
And given 30 years of null results from people who claim differences beyond simple frequency response or stability...😀
And given 30 years of null results from people who claim differences beyond simple frequency response or stability...😀
SY said:
I have asked you in another post about how many cases you have witnessed during all these 30 years and you haven't told us.Can you now?
As for your comment about the balls,it makes me feel that you are half a step away of believing in magic,just to prove that others believe in magic😀
SY said:
This is not what one concludes when members here call other members "idiots" because they spent $xxxxx on cables.
Panicos K said:
Well they are idiots if they only buy expensive cables because they think they sound better than cheap cables. When I win lotto I am going to buy some expensive cables because they look cool ... I don't mind if I pick the wrong ones either as my brain will tell me they sound fabulous. 😀
Andre Visser said:
Andre,
We have absolutely no idea how our brain constructs the perception we eventually 'hear'. We know it takes in account many factors that have nothing to do with the air vibrations that impinge on our eardrums, but not how, in what measure or what proportion.
Furthermore, how hard we try, that perception process in our brains is NOT accessibe to us.
So, how on earth can you assume that because you 'want to learn' or whatever, you can suppress that process so that it only uses those air vibrations? Hint: you can't.
jd
fredex said:
You say "they think they hear",they say "they hear".I haven't seen anyone to call those who say "they don't hear"an idiot.And I don't think that what you have just said is either polite or a scientific proof of any kind.Or is it?
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