Thanks for Your answers!
It is definitely clear that balanced input on Ncore / UcD side with an adaptor cable is the best solution for a (unfortunately) given RCA source.
What I wanted to know: are there benefits in sq using XLR to XLR connection instead of RCA to XLR. I knew these papers by B. P., but I guess a manufacturer will not say "this RCA-to-XLR connection is a bad one", if this is negative for selling rates.
So I asked You, and Julf answered, that RCA plus adaptor (short cable!)is as good as XLR to XLR. Other opinions, findings?
I simply don´t want to buy several Ncore amps and obtain a subprime solution.
It is definitely clear that balanced input on Ncore / UcD side with an adaptor cable is the best solution for a (unfortunately) given RCA source.
What I wanted to know: are there benefits in sq using XLR to XLR connection instead of RCA to XLR. I knew these papers by B. P., but I guess a manufacturer will not say "this RCA-to-XLR connection is a bad one", if this is negative for selling rates.
So I asked You, and Julf answered, that RCA plus adaptor (short cable!)is as good as XLR to XLR. Other opinions, findings?
I simply don´t want to buy several Ncore amps and obtain a subprime solution.
Just to be clear - pure balanced, all-XLR is of course the best solution, but if you have an unbalanced source, the best solution is a balanced cable with a RCA at the source end (and XLR at the amp end). An unbalanced, all-RCA cable and RCA connector at the amp end is the worst solution.
Use two conductor cable with a shield and terminate the shield via an RC network at the XLR end - just as outlined in sec 4.5 of the paper I referenced. Something like Canare L-46ES is good for the job. If you aren't comfortable messing with the RC network try using a Neutrik EMC series connector as they have a circular cap between shield and connector shell (which will connect to chassis when plugged in) and a ferrite bead between shield and pin 1 (which should also be wired to chassis at the XLR panel jack). Et voila, an RC network for shield to chassis.
These NCore modules have burnt my eyes, especially the smaller one on the round PCB, for certain characteristics on paper which seem to promise i.a. fantastic bass control provided of course the low output resistance is not wasted by the use of non top of the range passive Xover componentry and connections (especially coils with almost 1 ohm ESR 
).
I have not read this thread, which I'm just discovering. And frankly I'm a bit reluctant to go through nearly 1100 pages to get the main message as to whether:
a) there was excessive hipe to this new technique (as often with something new) or
b) the modules are really worth it even in the opinion of those who have had them for quite some time and have made comparisons in good faith ?
I should add that I have no prejudiced views on the type of technique used (whether valve, transistor, class A/AB/D/H etc, chip amps).
Thanks.
).I have not read this thread, which I'm just discovering. And frankly I'm a bit reluctant to go through nearly 1100 pages to get the main message as to whether:
a) there was excessive hipe to this new technique (as often with something new) or
b) the modules are really worth it even in the opinion of those who have had them for quite some time and have made comparisons in good faith ?
I should add that I have no prejudiced views on the type of technique used (whether valve, transistor, class A/AB/D/H etc, chip amps).
Thanks.
Not really - they are very transparent and neutral.
I am very happy with the 8 units I have, but we are talking of amps at a level where differences are pretty small - it won't be a night and day removal of veils that gets your wife running into the room.
...but the dog will wiggle his tail and bark at you because of that "phenomenal" sound quality.
Don't know about you (tail wiggeling etc.) but your wife wants you to replay each and every song you heard before because she realized that everything is much better than ever before
That must be it !
Don't know about you (tail wiggeling etc.
) but your wife wants you to replay each and every song you heard before because she realized that everything is much better than ever before That must be it !
...but the dog will wiggle his tail and bark at you because of that "phenomenal" sound quality.
Don't know about you (tail wiggeling etc.
That must be it !
You should see how happy my pet bat Eric is since I switched to "high-res" digital...
@ burkm: very nice work, especially with that stereo case!
I'm in a similar situation: for active biamping, I'm going for two Ghent stereo cases, with 2 NC400s and 1 SMPS600 for each. As you know, it's pretty tight, especially for the wiring from PS to NC400s. Ghent suggested to lift the NC400s, using 10 mm studs, and route the wires underneath them. That looks like a good suggestion to me, as the studs also open up the ventilation holes in the base plate.
Did you consider that option too? Any drawbacks in your opinion?
I'm in a similar situation: for active biamping, I'm going for two Ghent stereo cases, with 2 NC400s and 1 SMPS600 for each. As you know, it's pretty tight, especially for the wiring from PS to NC400s. Ghent suggested to lift the NC400s, using 10 mm studs, and route the wires underneath them. That looks like a good suggestion to me, as the studs also open up the ventilation holes in the base plate.
Did you consider that option too? Any drawbacks in your opinion?
My only concern is that that brings the wires pretty close to (and potentially parallel with) some of the high-power switching circuitry, but if it is only the power wiring, it should be OK.
My main concern would be, that those NC400 amp modules might be heating up even further, because the round heatsink it is mounted on no longer are in intimate contact with the enclosure anymore because of those studs. I routed those cables therefore "over the top" through the middle, because that stereo distribution kit from Hypex with its smallish PCB in the middle couldn't get anywhere else symmetrically.
That "SE" stereo enclosure kit from Ghentaudio is - as far as i know - not available anymore right now, because a new (and larger) case is been prepared (stereo version) for release "in the near future" by Mr. Ghent due to that really tight fit and its accompanying problems with the original case. The new case is wider and deeper, as far as i can remember.
That "SE" stereo enclosure kit from Ghentaudio is - as far as i know - not available anymore right now, because a new (and larger) case is been prepared (stereo version) for release "in the near future" by Mr. Ghent due to that really tight fit and its accompanying problems with the original case. The new case is wider and deeper, as far as i can remember.
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I have the SE cases already. Too bad...
As for the heatsinking: I could use some conductive paste between heatsinks and enclosure, but that might be messy (never tried it) and then I lose the ventilation holes again...
I did use thermal paste in between heatsinks and casing because it lowers the thermal resistance and improves heat transfer to the enclosure to some extend. Just apply only a very thin coating of it.
I don't know what you mean by "losing ventilation holes again...". There are no ventilation holes / slots underneath the amp modules, because those are only underneath the power supply. Unfortunately, those slots around the outer edge of the back plate, which the mono version has, are missing on the SE version too. I therefore drilled a row of additional ventilation holes right behind the rear and front plate as an afterthought just to get some "cold" air into the enclosure from the bottom side because Mr. Ghent never responded to my messages in this respect. The SMPS1200A400, which i used, blocks those remaining ventilation slots underneath the power supply area (almost) completely.
Note: The Ghentaudio mono cases are been used by Hypex as "their" enclosure offering with a minimaly different design.
Those additional holes / slots are sorely missing right from the beginning, because the case will heat up quite a bit otherwise (> ~45°C). I contacted Mr. Ghent about this but didn't get any answer from him except that a new version of the stereo case is in development which is supposed to be somewhat wider and larger.
I have fans on top now blowing across both cases to get rid of some of the heat caused by the power dissipation of those amp modules and PSU.
I don't know what you mean by "losing ventilation holes again...". There are no ventilation holes / slots underneath the amp modules, because those are only underneath the power supply. Unfortunately, those slots around the outer edge of the back plate, which the mono version has, are missing on the SE version too. I therefore drilled a row of additional ventilation holes right behind the rear and front plate as an afterthought just to get some "cold" air into the enclosure from the bottom side because Mr. Ghent never responded to my messages in this respect. The SMPS1200A400, which i used, blocks those remaining ventilation slots underneath the power supply area (almost) completely.
Note: The Ghentaudio mono cases are been used by Hypex as "their" enclosure offering with a minimaly different design.
Those additional holes / slots are sorely missing right from the beginning, because the case will heat up quite a bit otherwise (> ~45°C). I contacted Mr. Ghent about this but didn't get any answer from him except that a new version of the stereo case is in development which is supposed to be somewhat wider and larger.
I have fans on top now blowing across both cases to get rid of some of the heat caused by the power dissipation of those amp modules and PSU.
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My thought was to fill the 10 mm gap between heatsink and case -- goes to show how little I know about this . It's my first DIY-light project I go for...
The 'ventilation holes' I mention are the predrilled holes I don't use in this configuration. When putting the amp modules on studs, I could drill some more holes underneath them, I guess. Should allow for some sort of chimney effect!
. It's my first DIY-light project I go for...The 'ventilation holes' I mention are the predrilled holes I don't use in this configuration. When putting the amp modules on studs, I could drill some more holes underneath them, I guess. Should allow for some sort of chimney effect!
The enclosure is part of the amp module's heat sink. You want them pressed together, maximum contact, with the thinnest of heat sink compound film. Heat sink compound has a much lower thermal conductivity than metal on metal. Think of it as the thinnest of gap fillers only. Do not blob it and hope clamping pressure spreads it. Spread it thinly as possible over the entire area.
If you "cross over" (bridge-like) those amp modules with the cables just in the middle between both amps modules you should be fine, because most of the heat is been generated by that inductor on top of the amp PCB. This way your are at least as far away from the power cord as in the mono version. Just twist and bundle them tightly. Calbe ties are your "friend" there.
Main "problem" (and attention needed) might arise from the wiring harness, because of length concern and the need to split those cables coming from the SMPS600.
That stereo adapter kit from Hypex for the combination of 2x NC400 and 1x SMPS1200A400 was quite helpful in this respect for my setup at least.
You might eventually contact Hypex sales if there is something similar available for the combination using 1x SMPS600 instead.
Main "problem" (and attention needed) might arise from the wiring harness, because of length concern and the need to split those cables coming from the SMPS600.
That stereo adapter kit from Hypex for the combination of 2x NC400 and 1x SMPS1200A400 was quite helpful in this respect for my setup at least.
You might eventually contact Hypex sales if there is something similar available for the combination using 1x SMPS600 instead.
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I sent Hypex an email, asking for a '2 x NC400 - to - SMPS600' adapter kit. Let's see what they say...
If that kit doesn't exist, and I just solder the wires together, couldn't this (see picture) be an alternative routing? I keep the mains-to-SMPS as far as possible from anything, and the balanced inputs cross the 'power wires' (or how do I call those?) perpendicularly. The speaker wires (not on the photo) can be routed upwards first, as to stay away from the 'power wires', and cross perpendicularly too. [I haven't fixed anything for the photo - as you can see - but I hope it's good enough for my question to be clear...]
PS: that picture comes out weird... I hope it's understandable nonetheless.
If that kit doesn't exist, and I just solder the wires together, couldn't this (see picture) be an alternative routing? I keep the mains-to-SMPS as far as possible from anything, and the balanced inputs cross the 'power wires' (or how do I call those?) perpendicularly. The speaker wires (not on the photo) can be routed upwards first, as to stay away from the 'power wires', and cross perpendicularly too. [I haven't fixed anything for the photo - as you can see - but I hope it's good enough for my question to be clear...
]PS: that picture comes out weird... I hope it's understandable nonetheless.
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I sent Hypex an email, asking for a '2 x NC400 - to - SMPS600' adapter kit. Let's see what they say...
If that kit doesn't exist, and I just solder the wires together, couldn't this (see picture) be an alternative routing? I keep the mains-to-SMPS as far as possible from anything, and the balanced inputs cross the 'power wires' (or how do I call those?) perpendicularly. The speaker wires (not on the photo) can be routed upwards first, as to stay away from the 'power wires', and cross perpendicularly too. [I haven't fixed anything for the photo - as you can see - but I hope it's good enough for my question to be clear...
PS: that picture comes out weird... I hope it's understandable nonetheless.
Looks good to me. The missing distance between one of the amp boards and power cables don't matter that much I would asume. I have moved the power cables upwards and afixed them to the casing to increase the distance there somewhat.
Some effort (and care) is needed to splice the PSU to the two amp boards.
I got a reply from Hypex about the NC400 - SMPS600 adapter kit. Yes, it's in the pipeline. But it might stay in that pipeline for quite a little longer, as they seem to be very busy with other matters.
So they advise me not to wait for it, and splice the PSU. For future builders it'll be very worthwhile checking the website though.
So they advise me not to wait for it, and splice the PSU. For future builders it'll be very worthwhile checking the website though.
Wow, I've read through the last 200 pages of this thread lately and was starting to think I had wasted my time. Then all the sudden the last 10 pages were packed with info.
I've pretty much decided to order four NC400 modules to power the mids and tweeters in my 3-way active project. And I'm hoping to save $400 by only using one SMPS600 per two NC400 modules, as Erik Ghijsels is apparently planning to do.
Does anyone see a problem with two modules on the same power supply if I'm just powering mids and tweeters? Both should be well above 100 DB at 100 watts so I don't need anywhere near the 400 watts the modules can provide.
Thanks,
Chris
I've pretty much decided to order four NC400 modules to power the mids and tweeters in my 3-way active project. And I'm hoping to save $400 by only using one SMPS600 per two NC400 modules, as Erik Ghijsels is apparently planning to do.
Does anyone see a problem with two modules on the same power supply if I'm just powering mids and tweeters? Both should be well above 100 DB at 100 watts so I don't need anywhere near the 400 watts the modules can provide.
Thanks,
Chris
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