Right now I'm running an Infinity 12" which is pretty powerful. But next summer I plan to ditch my DLP for a big on-wall or projector. Along with that, I want to move the AV equipment into an adjacent room. There will be NO A/V furniture by the TV. Speakers will go in the wall.
So what the heck can I do with the subwoofer?!???!?
- In-wall?
- In-ceiling?
- Some custom under- or behind- sofa design?
Let me further explain that, facing the TV wall, a door into a hallway is a couple feet to the left of the TV. The right-hand wall has, right next to the corner, French doors into another room and then a couch. The room is long and extends into a dining room. So there are no out-of-sight corners to mount the sub in, and no, it can't somehow go into the adjacent room. [I know a picture would help, but my SD adaptor is missing, sorry]
Obviously I can put it next to the couch (or the couch on the left-side wall) but the sub is silver and then I think the sound will be very uneven due to proximity.
As an acoustic engineer, I know the wall resonances make it not a great place for subs. There is *some* possibility to rebuild the wall, but not likely. It could be possible to put subs in the ceiling, if I give up using them when anyone is in a bedroom (not a frequent occurrence).
Thoughts?
So what the heck can I do with the subwoofer?!???!?
- In-wall?
- In-ceiling?
- Some custom under- or behind- sofa design?
Let me further explain that, facing the TV wall, a door into a hallway is a couple feet to the left of the TV. The right-hand wall has, right next to the corner, French doors into another room and then a couch. The room is long and extends into a dining room. So there are no out-of-sight corners to mount the sub in, and no, it can't somehow go into the adjacent room. [I know a picture would help, but my SD adaptor is missing, sorry]
Obviously I can put it next to the couch (or the couch on the left-side wall) but the sub is silver and then I think the sound will be very uneven due to proximity.
As an acoustic engineer, I know the wall resonances make it not a great place for subs. There is *some* possibility to rebuild the wall, but not likely. It could be possible to put subs in the ceiling, if I give up using them when anyone is in a bedroom (not a frequent occurrence).
Thoughts?
A lot of folks with dedicated HTs make a false front stage for one or more subs and/or build a sub 'riser' platform to raise the seated height. DSL markets the 'SPUD', a 'riser' TH using a pair of 8" designed to be used in pairs. Then there's the proven end tables sub system.
GM
GM
Could you make the in-wall speakers suitably powerful to avoid needing a subwoofer?
A pair of long-throw 8"ers per side (front L/R) would probably replace the 12" sub comfortably.
MCM Audio Select 8'' High Excursion Woofer - 120W RMS 4ohm | 55-2421 (552421) | MCM Audio Select
Might need some eq to get low.
Chris
A pair of long-throw 8"ers per side (front L/R) would probably replace the 12" sub comfortably.
MCM Audio Select 8'' High Excursion Woofer - 120W RMS 4ohm | 55-2421 (552421) | MCM Audio Select
Might need some eq to get low.
Chris
If your going to move all the AV gear into the next room, why don't you do the same with the subs. If there is a common wall you can 1. use sealed subs and cut a hole in the wall so only the driver of the sub shows in your HT room. 2. built IB subs into the common wall and use the other room as your back chamber. In either case you can cover the openings with the same color cloth as your in wall speakers and it will look like it came that way.
How about a down firing coffee table sub. I've been thinking about that idea for some time.
The only down side is the wires.
🙂
The only down side is the wires.
🙂
Thanks for the ideas so far.
We don't have a coffee table-it would be right in the traffic pattern. End tables could be possible-I know HSU and some others make nice wood veneer subs which could look good enough. I just wonder if the positioning away from corners and right next to a couch would result in very uneven bass for the various listening positions.
Using the other room as an enclosure is an interesting idea. There's not a lot of distance to the French doors, so I'd expect some cancellation, but it would put the cones behind a couch and out of sight. Maybe same uneven sound concern, but if a set of subs maybe ameliorated.
8s or shallow 10s in wall could certainly get up to the cone area of a 12". But today's ported subs have a lot of R&D time to get a lot of output. I'm not sure just sticking a bunch of cone area in-wall will achieve the same. Certainly some EQ would probably be necessary-I do have Audyssey built-in; I wonder if it would suffice to bring up a low-Q low end.
I was rejecting the Danley SPUD, but actually maybe something like that could fit to the right of the TV, where one half of the French door swings open. I suppose I could also fit a long tube sub over there, and use the quasi-corner gain.
I calculate about 3 cubic fit within a stud, excluding additional bracing. So that's a fair amount of cubic footage to get bass out of. I guess with enough cone area and amplification the SPL should be fine, and it becomes a question of
- Finding the right (shallow) drivers
- EQ
We don't have a coffee table-it would be right in the traffic pattern. End tables could be possible-I know HSU and some others make nice wood veneer subs which could look good enough. I just wonder if the positioning away from corners and right next to a couch would result in very uneven bass for the various listening positions.
Using the other room as an enclosure is an interesting idea. There's not a lot of distance to the French doors, so I'd expect some cancellation, but it would put the cones behind a couch and out of sight. Maybe same uneven sound concern, but if a set of subs maybe ameliorated.
8s or shallow 10s in wall could certainly get up to the cone area of a 12". But today's ported subs have a lot of R&D time to get a lot of output. I'm not sure just sticking a bunch of cone area in-wall will achieve the same. Certainly some EQ would probably be necessary-I do have Audyssey built-in; I wonder if it would suffice to bring up a low-Q low end.
I was rejecting the Danley SPUD, but actually maybe something like that could fit to the right of the TV, where one half of the French door swings open. I suppose I could also fit a long tube sub over there, and use the quasi-corner gain.
I calculate about 3 cubic fit within a stud, excluding additional bracing. So that's a fair amount of cubic footage to get bass out of. I guess with enough cone area and amplification the SPL should be fine, and it becomes a question of
- Finding the right (shallow) drivers
- EQ
do you have a basement or attic? Those are both good places for IB subs. If you spread them out around the room, that will smooth the signal and the sub bass will be even anywhere in the room.
More seriously, I'm now wondering if I couldn't mount a sub box up in the attic, firing down through A/C vents. Maybe the woofer vertical (to avoid the coil sagging out of the gap over time), into a slot load which would then fire through a rectangular A/C vent. Could even have a shelf port firing out in the same manner. Gets HOT up in the attic, though...
What feels hot to humans is not such a problem with subs.
Can I use your picture as my avatar please?, it's hilarious! 😀
Can I use your picture as my avatar please?, it's hilarious! 😀
Sure, enjoy! I forget now what I Googled to stumble on that. Might be the biggest single driver I've seen.
If you have an attic, you should google "infinite baffle" sub woofers. They turn your attic into the back chamber of the sub.
Edit. Better yet, just go here. Lots of good information and helpful people. If you register on the site, you can see all the pictures of project in the first thread.
http://www.hometheatershack.com/for...inished-ib-projects-photos.html#axzz2GXlR2Y1N
Edit. Better yet, just go here. Lots of good information and helpful people. If you register on the site, you can see all the pictures of project in the first thread.
http://www.hometheatershack.com/for...inished-ib-projects-photos.html#axzz2GXlR2Y1N
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Nice link! For the 'last word' on IBs though: "Cult of the Infinitely Baffled"Hear The Bass, Not The Box The definitive online resource for Infinite Baffle subwoofer designEstablished 1999 - Home
GM
GM
I thought about IB as well, pro and con:
- Simpler than a box in the attic!
- Loses the SPL advantage of the port-need more power and woofers.
- Then might need a manifold in the attic (instead of a whole box) to feed multiple woofers through an air vent (so the whole ceiling doesn't look like an air vent.
Big disadvantage: the bass will boom all through the house!
?I don't know if that's a big problem. We only occasionally have a movie running with someone asleep in another room, so maybe it's OK? On those occasions, though, it would be really inconvenient-now if someone's asleep or watching TV in another room we just keep the volume down, but there IS bass. Who wants to watch a movie with NO bass.
- Simpler than a box in the attic!
- Loses the SPL advantage of the port-need more power and woofers.
- Then might need a manifold in the attic (instead of a whole box) to feed multiple woofers through an air vent (so the whole ceiling doesn't look like an air vent.
Big disadvantage: the bass will boom all through the house!
?I don't know if that's a big problem. We only occasionally have a movie running with someone asleep in another room, so maybe it's OK? On those occasions, though, it would be really inconvenient-now if someone's asleep or watching TV in another room we just keep the volume down, but there IS bass. Who wants to watch a movie with NO bass.
You're welcome!
Read through the design, positioning of these woofers for a bit of insight: The Ariel and the ME2
GM
I have a sneaking suspicion that it's shopped..that driver would be well over 2000 lbs, I doubt two people would be able to roll it around.
Mmmm, the picture looks to predate photoshop. Of course, it still could be. Some of those big drivers are not really so heavy-I once saw a 70?" Mitsubishi??? and it was mostly cone. The magnet was not huger than some car audio stuff of today, with some kind of a cover to look beefier.
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