How should I wire my 1500 watt speakers?

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#201
punkrokr1701 said:
I'm just throwing up
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Ya, I can relate. 😉

Are we any closer to a resolution than when we started this thread 200 posts ago?

Where do we go from here? We've gone from 15 to 18 from mono to dual and back again, we've tossed in a midbass or two and still haven't reached nirvana. I think Punkr should go and do some listening to different systems himself. Then he would know what can be expected from the different combos.

My suggestion remains at a dual 15 plus a horn. It has worked for thousands of others, can't see why it wouldn't here.
 
#202
I'm gonna do whatever it takes to make these monsters.

And for reference I am learning to play bass and eventually joun a band but I don't want that to have any in fluence on these speaker because I already have a HUGE bass cab
check it out

http://www.bassonsound.com/b810b.htm

this sucker is a beast and if you don't think soread some of the reviews.

It's like the god of bass amps and at $1000 it's the ultimate speaker.

I've played througgh this and personally it scares the **** out of me, even at half way, thing is I can't afford a 2600 watt amp right now so it is sitting at a friends house.

I've experienced some bass with this monster but I want something more, I can't put my finger on it and that's why I'm making this set of speakers.

I don't want to mix to two so I'm not gonna use the bass cab for home or party use ( even though I am VERY tempted) and I'm not gonna use these spaekers for playing.

So you see I want to make something that will hold it's own against my heavy weight ruler of the bass cabs.

And I'm just curious does anyone know what is like the "God" of all speakers in terms of power and bass?
 
#204
Its obvious you need two labhorns....two 12" in fronthorns....and a mid/tweeter horn

Or maybe you only need a tougher driver...which might only be any good when driven hard

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=294-565

But if you are any bit serious, you maybe should do what Cal suggest...he may even advice you further....but as he says....do some listening first

You know...choosing the right drivers are the easy part of designing a very good speaker.....there is much more to it than that....not so simple
 
#205
I have designed you a "hifi" like speaker with 95db sesitivity....which could have been develloped further.....if you need 100db PA speaker....not my kind of thing...wont recommend it ....and as thing stands at the moment.....I dare not recommend anything at all
 
#206
Seriously, Punk... take a break and figure out exactly what you want. A lot of people have offered help, and this thread has stretched to extraordinary length.

One thing I know about engineering design is that a clear definition of the problem is of the utmost importance. If you can't boil it down to a set of requirements, you're never going to get a solution and nobody can help you. I haven't read this whole thread, mostly the first page and the stuff since the Blue project was linked. It really looks like you're giving us a moving target.
 
#207
Ok, well, guys I'm going to sit back and find out exactly what I want and what drivers I'm going to use based on the last 5 or 6 pages of this thread, yes I know it's going on long but after I figure out my drivers and box size all get back to you guys.

Thanx.
 
#208
Finally,

Ok here my choices

dual 18" Madison Dragons
powered by a Kilowatt Dayton plate amp
Eminence 12LTA Mid-range
My mind is made up with these drivers and I've narrowed my tweeter choices down to two possiblities

The powerful Pyle or the Eminence ?

I'm leaning towards the Eminence but the 150 oz Pyle Pro 7" diameter tweeter caught my eye.

I can already predict that pretty much everyone is gonna go with the Eminence so I'm just waiting to make that my final choice when someone replies to this post.
 
#209
Ok, Punk...you are one heck of a stubbern and determined young man

But its clear you need serious help on this....hate to see you waste money like that....and apperently the money is better now

In general project seems fine, but....

First...those Madison Dragon may be ok...but dont think they are a bargain at all....I dont believe they have ever cost nearly what they claim...and specs, well...I honestly think you will be "mildly" cheated with those....not that they are not worth the cost....well, I think you get my point

The 12" middriver.....looks like **** to me....lousy lowend and very ragged top....easy to find better

Tweeter....Variac actually found a nice compression driver which suits this project better...post 192...overlooked ?

We stumpled over parts of "BlueWonders" which was on a VERY tight budget....with about four times that amount, possibilities looks way better....with plateamps and all....I take it you mean two plateamps.....actually I think you could do with some cheaper ones without Eq etc.....and use the money on better drivers

Wonder what "18-Sound" cost ?

Well,...here we go again
 
#212
tinitus said:
The 12" middriver.....looks like **** to me....lousy low end and very ragged top....easy to find better
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There you would be wrong. 😉 Don't worry about that FR chart. This is one GREAT driver. The Beta 12LTA makes a great broad midrange with an 18" bottom. It really gets the midrange right. Not many drivers do. Sounds like real voices, real music. It can be used almost fullrange in more sedate situations, too.

Look up the "Hammer Dynamics" speaker, it uses a reconed 12LTA. People who have heard both say the difference is minor. A driver like this with a good, rich, clean midrange will do a lot for making the whole system sound better. And it will play loud. The Eminence 8" would be a close second.

Punkrokr. I know what you mean about the Blue Wonders. I look at those and they just don't inspire me. They probably sound great, but they just look like someone else's typical PA box. And that's what they are. (But I don't think I've ever seen a full range box with 18s. That's big!)

I know you want to push things, even if it means a crazy speaker. And why not? If you have the funds, the space, and the dad with woodworking skills, you're golden.

So you need to come up with YOUR speaker. But don't forget. You won't have really designed it yourself. But no worries. We won't tell anyone, nope, no one at all. We just want to see photos when you get them built.

OK, a couple of thoughts:

If you do get one of the Madison drivers, the Executioner looks better to me, looks like it will have more punch. But we should ask around to see what someone who has used them thinks.

To take things away from the direction we've been going (ha!) I still favor 15s. Like Cal who wants dual 15s, mid and tweeter. But I will see Cal's 4 15s and raise him 4. Yep, 4 a side - total 8 15s! How's that grab you?

You could do it, too. If you get a driver like those on sale at Music Supply for $40 a pair. Those are Madisons, too. Worlds best driver? - noooo. But if you have 8 of them, how hard would each one need to work? Talk about your Wall O' Sound! Holy Vibrators, Batman! And because each driver doesn't need to work very hard, you'll move tons of air with little distortion. Big, big, clean bass. Massive sound.

And it would have to be big. If you stack all those 15s, minimum height is going to be over 5 feet. Put a 12 or 8 inch mid in the middle, you're getting up over 6 feet, easy. Just don't let them fall on you. Of course, you don't have to stack them 4 high, do whatever you want.

If you build that, or a bigger, badder Blue Wonder (the Blue Meanie?) you will still have some great advantages sound wise if you go with active filtering. You will be able to adjust the bass the way you want it with the twist of a knob. Can't do that with a passive filter.

Amps won't be hard. Just decide on a speaker first, start building, then worry about amps.
 
#213
It may sound strange....but as things turn out....else who knows where it all ends once again....I am really sorry to say this....but its a kind of "TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT" situation on my part.....have to do it that way......if not I really hope others will help you finish this thing properly.....sorry 😱
 
#214
About that 12LTA....I can see where that musicality is coming from

If you remove that whizzer cone it might be very good....and would have been nice for our "BlueWonder" thing....with 95 db SPL....with a higher crossover point

But now we are aiming higher with two 15"....100db (?)....12LTA will not have enough lowend power for that....and that may well be the same problem with Hammer 8" in "BlueWonder"
 
#216
tinitus said:
If you remove that whizzer cone it might be very good
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No, not really. The whizzer is an important part of the driver. Same for many full range drivers.

12LTA will not have enough low end power for that....and that may well be the same problem with Hammer 8"
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I don't see it as a problem in this application. Perhaps in a more normal rig, yeah. But don't forget what punkrokr wants. LOTS of BASS. So that means not as much midrange. He's going to be giving those woofers a beating. The midrange will be working hard, but not killing it.

Now if he goes with my insane idea of 4 15s per side - well, I don't know what could keep up with that. Maybe 2 of the Hammer 8s per side??

OT for CAL.
A "waveguide" is usually shorter and with a wider mouth than a horn. It is said not to load the driver in the same way. It just works to focus energy within its bandwidth, but does not act as an acoustic transfomer the way a real horn does. That's my understanding of it.
 
#217
I think this actually shows my point....its not that easy to change bits and pieces....just to make everyone happy....it will completely fall apart....too many good ideas that may be nice on their own....but wont work together.....when I select those drivers, I have plans for crossover at the same time...that midbass will with the right inductor be extended and roll off sweetly....but do your thing....I am here only fore Punk....and my offer still stands 😱
 
#218
Ok, now I'm getting confused someone sugested those Madison 18" to me or at least I know there was a link but now that I'm thinking about using them people are being critical of them.

I'm not trying to defend them so I think I need to start this out simple.

In each cabinet I can afford

2 $150 drivers

1 $50-$75 mid range

1 $ 50 tweeter

then I'll add the plate amps later.

I don't know what to do here so I saying what my budget is an maybe someone will find something.

I don't know.

I'm lost right now so, yeh.

and thanx Tinitus.
 
#219
So, $425 in drivers per side, or $425 in parts and drivers per side? A quality three-way crossover is going to run you $100 per side.

The budget is really a huge help. You've got it narrowed down to "I want a huge and crazy PA speaker with a concentration on bass", and a budget to hit. That's a start, and if that doesn't change it's a good foundation for a project.
 
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