How does this look?

[DaveCan]

I think I may stick with these and order across the border anyways..
Eminence EMI-1550 15" High Efficiency Sub from Madisound Kind of along the lines of what I"m wanting.. Any thoughts on these?

 

[bjorno]

I think I may stick with these and order across the border anyways..
Eminence EMI-1550 15" High Efficiency Sub from Madisound Kind of along the lines of what I"m wanting.. Any thoughts on these?

Hi,

FYI, The data given at -isound for EMI-1550 is inconsistent?

b

 

[Cokewithlime]

That solen kit and the woofer mentioned is alu coned.. I had thought surely there must be a really good sq closed alignment design using a paper coned based woofer still? And no I didn't mean Shirley lol.. Thanks for all the help and ideas...

I don't know where you got the info that the 830845 cone in Al - that is completely incorrect, the cone for that driver is Nomex

BTW - the Eminence EMI-1550 does not model very well as a sealed sub - this driver is targeted and more suited to PA type work or bass bin horn.

If you are looking for a 15" home sub - consider the Dayton DVC385-88 15" DVC Series Subwoofer from Parts Express - I've done many orders from PE and even with surface postal delivery it is usually less than a week to receive the package.

 

[DaveCan]

Oops, I think I confused it with a Dayton driver I was looking at or something that had the other cone.. I may be in need of a good nights sleep lol, or just burnin out etc..

Thanks for the link on that DVC sub.... I'm not heart set on a 15'' just want a really good buy with the best sq etc...

 

[Cokewithlime]

If what you are looking for is a sub mainly for music and something that will probably integrate very well with your existing mains then I would still recommend the Peerless 12" over the 15" DVC sub.

I have had the Peerless 830500 + matching 830548 passive radiator in a 2ft^3 (35l) enclosure driven with a 500W plate amp for many years - all the the Peerless XLS and XXLS drivers have very low distortion plus have excellent transient response(compared to most 15" subs)

If you would really like to actually hear what a live drum kit, acoustic bass and the lower registers of a concert piano sounds like then you will not find many better choices. (and you can buy it in Canada )

 

[DaveCan]

Thanks for all your help Coke. I think I may go for that Peerless 830845 sub you linked. I already have a sub amp that I think is better than the solen kit so I can save money there etc.. I tried a calculator and entered these calculations, wondering if I did it right and what you may think?

Peerless 830845

Sealed Box
Qts - 0.45
Vas- 5.7 ft3
Fs- 21.5 hz
Qtc- 0.707
Vb- 3.882ft3
F3- 33.78 Hz

Thinking maybe I could just build a 4ft3 internal volume sealed enclosure?

 

[Cokewithlime]

DaveCan - I just did a quick model in WinISD - 4 ft^3 looks pretty good, if you add about +3db of EQ @ 28hz and then a HPF @ 20Hz you should get about 108db with an F3 of 34Hz and a F10 of 22Hz and still stay within xmax limits

On the other hand, Solen's kit enclosure of 2.6 cubic feet (74L) actually looks like the best trade off size for power handling + LF extension with control of xmax limits

 

[DaveCan]

Sounds good (well hopefully lol).. I saw with the solen kit they add 60% of fill I think, and I thought I'd try to just go bigger with no stuffing, and shoot for a 0.707 box for best sq alternative? I have the space to build up to a 10-15 ft3 box so size isn't an issue, but I guess there is good reason that they went with the 2.6 box as you pointed out..

 

[Cokewithlime]

For most subs that I build, I rarely stuff them - stuffing just tends to muffle the attack(transients) which is OK in a HT type configuration but for music it doesn't really work out.

The one thing I would suggest is to get some eggcrate bed topper foam from WalMart and spray glue it on to the back wall opposite of the driver. You can add more to the other internal surfaces but I find just that one piece at that location is all that is needed to tame internal cabinet harmonics.

 

[bjorno]

..I have the space to build up to a 10-15 ft3 box so size isn't an issue,..

Hi,

FYI, A 6.1 cu ft T-TQWT using the Peerless 830845 is too within the volume range.

b

 

[DaveCan]

Thanks for the tips and ideas guys

bjorno that idea would be interesting for sure but beyond my build skills unless it was already a plan I could follow with a cut list etc.. Would it sound better on music for sq over the sealed box? I'm only wanting the sub for a music only 2 channel stereo system and want the best detail and accuracy I can shoot for etc..

Those high efficient EMI 1550 drivers I linked, the plan was to load them isobaric with one driver seeing 5ft3.. I wonder if they may produce a touch better sq and detail for music over the Peerless driver, but just not play as loud ? I could always add another Iso pair later on for stereo subs etc..

 

[DaveCan]

Any last thoughts on the potential SQ difference between the Peerless 830845 in a closed box up to 4ft3, and a pair of EMI 1550 loaded isobaric in a 5ft3 closed box? Which box would most likely have the best sq for a music only system, and low to moderate loud listening levels?.. Any last advice before I make an order? Many thanks

 

[Cokewithlime]

As I mentioned previously, the Eminence EMI-1550 does not model very well as a sealed sub even in an isobaric alignment - this driver is targeted and more suited to PA type work or horn configuration to get the lower octaves extension as suggested by bjorno.

BTW - 15" drivers generally have poorer transient(fast bass) response than 12" drivers from a LF SQ point of view. On a drum kit for example the accuracy (compared to a live performance) of say the toms or kick to me sounds a little less crisp and realistic with a 15", particularly at moderate to low listening levels, compared to a 12" sealed config.

IMHO, if you don't have the build skills at this point to go with bjorno's horn design you should just go with the Peerless sealed design from the Solen plans. If at some point in the future you want to re purpose this driver into a larger tapped or folded horn enclosure it should still work fine for that purpose.

 

[DaveCan]

Thanks so much Coke.. Just wanted to do that last check before I hit the order button lol.. Really glad to have had the help and advice from all you guys, much appreciated!! I am going to get the Peerless sub and go as planned, and perhaps a few months down the road I'll build another one too.. As a last annoying question (I'm good at that lol ) I was wanting to go for the 0.707 size box , so going around 3.8-4ft3 internal volume should be about right and bigger than the solen design etc.. As I won't be playing at high volumes, I'm wondering if the trade off of the proposed bigger box would be more beneficial in the end for sq over the 2.6ft3 solen design ?

 

[MJS]

Perhaps it´s late but

Peerless SLS315 ( the same as the first post )

85 liters in a closed box with heavy damping 75% aprox.

The Graph is with Likwitz EQ

Regards

 

[Cokewithlime]

As a last annoying question (I'm good at that lol ) I was wanting to go for the 0.707 size box , so going around 3.8-4ft3 internal volume should be about right and bigger than the solen design etc.. As I won't be playing at high volumes, I'm wondering if the trade off of the proposed bigger box would be more beneficial in the end for sq over the 2.6ft3 solen design ?

Just so you understand I have attached a couple of screen caps from WinISD with the two enclosure sizes - both plots are with the same power applied and same amount of stuffing (approx 75%) and no EQ of any type.

As you can see, the larger 4 ft^3 enclosure doesn't really get you a much lower or much of a different slope.

What the benefit of the smaller 2.6 ft^3 enclosure gets you is that you will never exceed xmax and don't really have to employ a HPF which means that from a SQ perspective you end up getting more usable power as well as not introducing any further phase shift or group delay due to filter/eq electronics.

Sometimes a couple of pics are worth a lot of words

 

[BP1Fanatic]

bjorno that idea would be interesting for sure but beyond my build skills unless it was already a plan I could follow with a cut list etc...

Bjorno usually provides a pic of the enclosure without folds and with dimensions! They're really simple if you follow his plans.

 

[DaveCan]

Thanks again Coke, 2.6 it is then!!

BP1, I was hoping Bjorno may have elaborated further on his reply, is there a place to see plans ? If his idea may provide a bit better sq over the sealed box ,I'd be interested in seeing if I could build it etc... Anyhow you guys have been awesome, much appreciated!!!

 

[bjorno]

Thanks again Coke, 2.6 it is then!!

BP1, I was hoping Bjorno may have elaborated further on his reply, is there a place to see plans ? If his idea may provide a bit better sq over the sealed box ,I'd be interested in seeing if I could build it etc... Anyhow you guys have been awesome, much appreciated!!!

Hi Dave,

I will have more time to 'elaborate' on the T-TQWT matter when the holidays are over, i.e. after New Year. For the moment: take a look at this picture:

b

 

[jwmbro]

Hi, DaveCan,

I just wanted to say thank you for this thread, it's come at a very useful time for me, as I'm also looking into building a musical sub, perhaps even with the Reckhorn amp. However the difference for me is I don't have unlimited space for a large sub.

Please be sure to report back with building and listening impressions once you decide on and build your sub! Cheers!