I was wondering: I'd like to experiment with the use of a subwoofer. I don't like having speakers all over my room, and most subs are IMHO rightout ugly.
So, I thought, why don't I make a sub which fits underneath the couch? This would make it long, deep but not high.
I know that this does not meet the conventions of speaker design. But since conventions sometimes only are a remembrance to earlier times, perhaps it might actually work.
Any thoughts on possible positive / negative influences of this kind of box?
thanks
So, I thought, why don't I make a sub which fits underneath the couch? This would make it long, deep but not high.
I know that this does not meet the conventions of speaker design. But since conventions sometimes only are a remembrance to earlier times, perhaps it might actually work.
Any thoughts on possible positive / negative influences of this kind of box?
thanks
Attachments
When dealing with low frequencies, box shape is not an issue. The only thing that I would be concerned with is providing adequate ventilation of the pole piece at the back of the driver. I've found that when you mount subs with vented pole pieces into very shallow enclosures, you get some nasty noises when you turn it up.
You may want to consider having the woofers fire down rather than up. When stuff from the couch falls into the woofer cones, you're gonna get some disturbing rattles with your current design...
Peace
Peace
TNT said:
Yeah even better perhaps, but I know of no program to design and optimize the speaker by doing what you propose...
I was thinking to make the spikes re-mountable, so that I could turn the whole sub up-side-down. Just to hear whether there are differences, and to empirically find out what sounds best.
I also wanted to place the amp outside the box, so that I can place it next to the couch and within reach.
TNT said:
Unless your gonna do some type of bass boosting amp, (aka Linkwitz Transform) you would be better off just finding one or maybe 2 large (and probably shallow) subs. Certainly you could get it to go a lot lower.
Something else to keep in mind is all the weight that would be on this box, you would d have to brace the **** out of it for it to not sag or just break the first time you had company over.
Maybe something that just hides about behind the couch would be better?
Like the rump thumper… http://speakerbuilder.net/web_files/Projects/RT3/rt3.htm
*edit*
Or maybe even better then that would be some type of sub box like you see in trucks that fits behind the seat, something like a steep triangle shape the fits behind the couch, with some big ol front firing woofers.
Great!
..many people with similar ideas in this regard....
...was thinking of such a design for my bed, too.
But I have doubts due to the magnetic fields which may impact me
the whole night long...
...up to now "electro smog" and magnetic fields and it's impacts
on human body are not well explored.
All I hear in such discussions sound more religious than scientific, but on the other hand I would be surprised if the human body would not be influenced at all.
Well and a properly magnetic shielded design is really a lot of work.
For a couch I would be less concerned.
Cheers
Markus
..many people with similar ideas in this regard....
...was thinking of such a design for my bed, too.
But I have doubts due to the magnetic fields which may impact me
the whole night long...
...up to now "electro smog" and magnetic fields and it's impacts
on human body are not well explored.
All I hear in such discussions sound more religious than scientific, but on the other hand I would be surprised if the human body would not be influenced at all.
Well and a properly magnetic shielded design is really a lot of work.
For a couch I would be less concerned.
Cheers
Markus
ChocoHolic said:
Why would you want to have a sub in your bedroom? Or do you live an a one-room appartment?
Magnets from woofers aren't that stong. There has been a lot of research on the effect of electromagn. radiation on the human body. Especially in the Magnetic Resonance Imaging area (in German KernSpinnTomografie, I think). They use magnets which are 50.000 to 200.000 times stronger than the earth magnetic field. Up till now: no negative impact found yet.
I could not agree more with you on your comment about blase' audio enclosures. Where is everyones imagination? If you have some skills in woodworking or know someone who does, this could be a very neat project. As a furniture designer myself I think you could build a platform style sofa or love seat and incorporate the sub into the platform base. If you are hip to modern furniture this should be a breeze. You could build a very simple but sturdy torsion style box, constructed to the correct volume with legs on the underside. This style couch requires no springs like a traditional couch. A local upholstery person can build you a very nice cushion to put on top and a few matching cushions for back support. If you can use the sofa against a wall than all you need is the box, no special jazz to support your back cushions. If you have an Ikea near you you can purchase just the cushions on the CHEAP!!!
Check out the link for a simple idea. It may be possible to revamp an existing sofa like this one.
http://www.ikea-usa.com/webapp/wcs/...ductId=30699&langId=-1&parentCats=10114*10294
Check out the link for a simple idea. It may be possible to revamp an existing sofa like this one.
http://www.ikea-usa.com/webapp/wcs/...ductId=30699&langId=-1&parentCats=10114*10294
Let's say that the box becomes 1.7 m wide, then the lowest mode inside tha box will appear at 100Hz. So you probably cannot skip the stuffing as you can with more cubic boxes.
Otherwise it is a nice idea, probably you will *feel* the bass more. The (tactile sensation)/(neighbour disturbance) quotient is probably high. 😀
Otherwise it is a nice idea, probably you will *feel* the bass more. The (tactile sensation)/(neighbour disturbance) quotient is probably high. 😀
Im not so sure about fitting it underneath the couch, but if you want to hide it behind the couch; I think you might be interested in this... http://www.speakerbuilder.net/web_files/Projects/RT3/rt3.htmhotsyflotsy said:
Some of the monster woofers available today require small
sealed boxes, hardly takes up alot of space.
Another thought would be to build a piece of furniture
that is indeed a subwoofer in disguise, ie an end table.
sealed boxes, hardly takes up alot of space.
Another thought would be to build a piece of furniture
that is indeed a subwoofer in disguise, ie an end table.
thylantyr said:Some of the monster woofers available today require small
sealed boxes, hardly takes up alot of space.
Another thought would be to build a piece of furniture
that is indeed a subwoofer in disguise, ie an end table.
A huge sturdy box, maybe even two drivers, as the base of the couch, then just add a back and some cushions and you have a sofa-sub. Talk about tactile!
(make sure the drivers aren't facing forward, they might take a heel)
If you use this flat box idea, you might want to consider a MLTL enclosure, since it should be possible for it to be rather tall, and still not make much of a footprint in your living room.
As to the use of small drivers... have you considered using something like the Fostex 31" woofer instead? It's shallow enough that you might get good results, although it's hardly cheap...
As to the use of small drivers... have you considered using something like the Fostex 31" woofer instead? It's shallow enough that you might get good results, although it's hardly cheap...
Just give them drivers some breathing space fore and aft else, the result will be little bass, unless you apply some guide technology though, for simplicity, just give 'em some room.
Svante said:
Can you perhaps tell how did you did that calculation? I think one could easily design a box which is 90-100liters which fits underneath a couch.
Yes, bass-*feel* is one of the aims for a Subwoofer, IMHO (if you have decent stereo speakers)
angel said:
I'm pretty new, so forgive my perhaps stupid question, but what is "MLTL" enclosure?
Bose(o) said:
Could you quantify "some" breathing space?
I was also thinking: I need to brace the speaker on the inside, so if i'm gonna do that, why not design a bass-tunnel inside. Like so:
Attachments
hotsyflotsy said:
I was not thinking at all about what box volume that was required, I just assumed that you would want to use the entire space under the couch. In that case a width of 1.7 metres would not be unlikely, given the normal size of a couch. The first mode of a box of that size would be c/(2*L) = 340 / (2*1.7) = 100 Hz. Of course if you make the box smaller, there is less problem with this, if it is a problem at all. Sufficient stuffing would take care of the standing waves anyway.
...funny thread, getting more and motivation 🙂
But I think there are some critical points:
-Furniture typically changed more often than a subwoofer.
-A subwoofer couch may end up in a very heavy design,
I hate moving anyway, but with such a couch??!!!!
May be a combination of three single seats which could
be combined as a couch in "timeless" design could satisfy
these concerns.
I would prefer most to have the speakers in the backrest,
directed to the front. But this would make the design
of the backrest bulky.
Additional the cushions will damp the output and
might cause undesirable noise due to the moved air.
Well, I will have to think more sophisticated about this.
@hotsyflotsy:
You may be right that even massive magnetic fields do
not immediately hurt us if they are applied for a reasonable
short time....
But already leakage fields of loudspeakers definitely
cause a magnetic field that is higher than the natural
field of TERRA III. And our bodies have been optimized
for our natural environment. Of course (lucky we) humans
are not so thin skinned as often told. Otherwise we would not have
overpopulation....
I feel I am already living a heavily changed environment (air, noise, 50Hz magnetic fields, 50Hz electrical fields, electromagnetic fields at
27MHz, 100MHz, 900MHz, 1.8GHz and 2.4 GHz), and now adding a
heavy 0Hz magnetic field? Well, would probably not change much anymore...
😉
But I think there are some critical points:
-Furniture typically changed more often than a subwoofer.
-A subwoofer couch may end up in a very heavy design,
I hate moving anyway, but with such a couch??!!!!
May be a combination of three single seats which could
be combined as a couch in "timeless" design could satisfy
these concerns.
I would prefer most to have the speakers in the backrest,
directed to the front. But this would make the design
of the backrest bulky.
Additional the cushions will damp the output and
might cause undesirable noise due to the moved air.
Well, I will have to think more sophisticated about this.
@hotsyflotsy:
You may be right that even massive magnetic fields do
not immediately hurt us if they are applied for a reasonable
short time....
But already leakage fields of loudspeakers definitely
cause a magnetic field that is higher than the natural
field of TERRA III. And our bodies have been optimized
for our natural environment. Of course (lucky we) humans
are not so thin skinned as often told. Otherwise we would not have
overpopulation....
I feel I am already living a heavily changed environment (air, noise, 50Hz magnetic fields, 50Hz electrical fields, electromagnetic fields at
27MHz, 100MHz, 900MHz, 1.8GHz and 2.4 GHz), and now adding a
heavy 0Hz magnetic field? Well, would probably not change much anymore...
😉
Another positive effect if you use your seat for the sub woofer:
All normal listening rooms show resonances and unfortunately
typically the first modes in all three axes fall in the frequency range
between 20Hz and 80Hz as a result of normal room sizes....
Up to now I took me typically 6 months after each moving to find
a proper positipon for the subwoofwer and my listening position.
Most arrangements end up in heavy resonances with the antinodes
at the walls and even worse the nodal points where you are sitting...
If you sit at the point where the speaker is, you will definitely not sit
at a full nodal point 😀
Also with such sub-seat/couch you can easily avoid to have the signal source directly at the walls or in a corner, which would easily enforce the modes to an inconvinient level...
....seeing a new project coming, as my couch is on my black list anyway...
All normal listening rooms show resonances and unfortunately
typically the first modes in all three axes fall in the frequency range
between 20Hz and 80Hz as a result of normal room sizes....
Up to now I took me typically 6 months after each moving to find
a proper positipon for the subwoofwer and my listening position.
Most arrangements end up in heavy resonances with the antinodes
at the walls and even worse the nodal points where you are sitting...
If you sit at the point where the speaker is, you will definitely not sit
at a full nodal point 😀
Also with such sub-seat/couch you can easily avoid to have the signal source directly at the walls or in a corner, which would easily enforce the modes to an inconvinient level...
....seeing a new project coming, as my couch is on my black list anyway...
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