Hi, I'm in a hunt for a decent stereo amp available to buy as a device or a DIY kit with a budget around 150EUR.
I've spent last 2 days reading the forum and watching reviews. I didn't found a particular highly rated model, thus decided to ask. The usual suspects are the TPA3255 (Aiyima, BRZ) or MA12070 (Topping PA3S) packages but I can't pick a winner. Also "some say" they can't come close to something like Cambridge Audio AXA25.
My needs are very simple - low noise amp, stereo input from a PC and 2x30W output for a 8ohm Mark Audio Alpair 10p drivers.
I have access to soldering stations at my work so I will consider a model which can benefit from better capacitors or some other easy upgrade.
One thing I will greatly appreciate would be a USB audio interface so I could eliminate the need for a quality sound card.
Any recommendations?
I've spent last 2 days reading the forum and watching reviews. I didn't found a particular highly rated model, thus decided to ask. The usual suspects are the TPA3255 (Aiyima, BRZ) or MA12070 (Topping PA3S) packages but I can't pick a winner. Also "some say" they can't come close to something like Cambridge Audio AXA25.
My needs are very simple - low noise amp, stereo input from a PC and 2x30W output for a 8ohm Mark Audio Alpair 10p drivers.
I have access to soldering stations at my work so I will consider a model which can benefit from better capacitors or some other easy upgrade.
One thing I will greatly appreciate would be a USB audio interface so I could eliminate the need for a quality sound card.
Any recommendations?
150EUR, should get you a reputable TPA3255 board from well-known DIYers here, like JlesterP, no? The MA12070 chip is still relatively unexplored, but "some folks" claims it can express the mids and highs somewhat better than TPAs.
You should check out the main 3255 thread, as well as the 3251 modding thread. They will give you a general idea of what boards to avoid/buy and possible upgrades. For example, with most these boards you have the option to upgrade the opamps (a small sum, for "better" SQ) or bypass them entirely 🙂
BRZ - Aiyima goods can be pretty hit or miss in terms of quality, especially the former. And I absolutely detest the cheap potentiometers these manufacturers tend to use. I have the revered Aiyima A07 (TPA3255-based amp) and in less than a year it's become annoyingly scratchy.
About comparisons to the Cambridge Audio, ehhhhhh, I don't know, I would like to avoid a full-blown war over Class AB or Class D superiority. It's safe to say though, by going Cambridge you're not going to be DIYing too much.
P/s: For lower-power usage, a 3255 might be a tad overkill. You should look at TPA3221 too, with a much more reasonable 2x50WPC. I found this very interesting Aiyima amp a while back: Power Amplifier | Aiyima A1501 | Amplificador | Subwoofer | Tpa3221 - Audio A1501 Tpa3221 100w - Aliexpress It's supposed to be driving a subwoofer, but whoever needs tube coloring for a subwoofer, beats me. Technically you could use 2 of them as monoblocks.
And this seriously deluxe-looking TPA3221 board: Audiophile Digital Amplifier Board Tpa3221 Amplifier Board Hifi Amplifier Mono High Power Class D Amplifier - Switches - AliExpress
You should check out the main 3255 thread, as well as the 3251 modding thread. They will give you a general idea of what boards to avoid/buy and possible upgrades. For example, with most these boards you have the option to upgrade the opamps (a small sum, for "better" SQ) or bypass them entirely 🙂
BRZ - Aiyima goods can be pretty hit or miss in terms of quality, especially the former. And I absolutely detest the cheap potentiometers these manufacturers tend to use. I have the revered Aiyima A07 (TPA3255-based amp) and in less than a year it's become annoyingly scratchy.
About comparisons to the Cambridge Audio, ehhhhhh, I don't know, I would like to avoid a full-blown war over Class AB or Class D superiority. It's safe to say though, by going Cambridge you're not going to be DIYing too much.
P/s: For lower-power usage, a 3255 might be a tad overkill. You should look at TPA3221 too, with a much more reasonable 2x50WPC. I found this very interesting Aiyima amp a while back: Power Amplifier | Aiyima A1501 | Amplificador | Subwoofer | Tpa3221 - Audio A1501 Tpa3221 100w - Aliexpress It's supposed to be driving a subwoofer, but whoever needs tube coloring for a subwoofer, beats me. Technically you could use 2 of them as monoblocks.
And this seriously deluxe-looking TPA3221 board: Audiophile Digital Amplifier Board Tpa3221 Amplifier Board Hifi Amplifier Mono High Power Class D Amplifier - Switches - AliExpress
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well, that Cambridge Audio AXA25 seems to incorporate something like a LM 3886. The choice of 300 W transformers I usually see in here, it's not adopted by Cambridge! For 200 € I'd expect...no more, nor less
Pico,
According to "Audio Appraisal",
The AXA35 like the AM10 predecessor is essentially a commercial ‘Gainclone’ implementation. The LM3886 output devices can theoretically deliver 68W per channel into a 4Ω load and 38W per channel into an 8Ω load with a symmetrical power supply delivering +/-28V. Cambridge’s specification of 35W into an 8Ω load is therefore a sensible one. The AXA35 will actually deliver the 38W into 8Ω before clipping...You can drive a 4Ω load with the AXA35, and you’ll get just shy of 60W per channel before clipping starts to occur. Expect about 50W into a 4Ω load at more reasonable distortion levels.
After taking a quick look at the internals, it really makes me ponder if DIYers can do a better job...
K.
According to "Audio Appraisal",
The AXA35 like the AM10 predecessor is essentially a commercial ‘Gainclone’ implementation. The LM3886 output devices can theoretically deliver 68W per channel into a 4Ω load and 38W per channel into an 8Ω load with a symmetrical power supply delivering +/-28V. Cambridge’s specification of 35W into an 8Ω load is therefore a sensible one. The AXA35 will actually deliver the 38W into 8Ω before clipping...You can drive a 4Ω load with the AXA35, and you’ll get just shy of 60W per channel before clipping starts to occur. Expect about 50W into a 4Ω load at more reasonable distortion levels.
After taking a quick look at the internals, it really makes me ponder if DIYers can do a better job...
K.
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I agree. With my Mark Audio A7.3 speakers I was disappointed with the two or three different TPA325x amp boards I tried.
But with a (dual mono) TPA3221 amplifier, my Mark Audio speakers sing. I posted more details here -
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/dual-mono-tpa3221-pictures-inside.371307/#post-6696775
The TPA3221 seems to me a direct upgrade of the well renowned TPA3116, having the same warmth and musicality, with more finesse and control.
Yes, that's the same board as contained in my amplifier - although my amp has two of those boards, each configured for mono.
Linuxfan,
Thank you for sharing your experience. Your conversion of the TPA boards to use balanced inputs looks awesome, not to mention the little addition of the FXaudio tube preamp at the end. Do you still use this amplifier?
K.
Thank you for sharing your experience. Your conversion of the TPA boards to use balanced inputs looks awesome, not to mention the little addition of the FXaudio tube preamp at the end. Do you still use this amplifier?
K.
Yes, the TPA3221 amplifier and Planet 10-designed speakers are still my main system. My source is Twisted Pear's BeagleBone Black-based music server, via Quanghao ES9018 DAC.
I converted the TPA3221 amplifier to balanced input, assuming this would be best ... but it turned out it sounds better using the unbalanced outputs of my DAC.
I tried the tube preamp in this system, but didn't like it.
I converted the TPA3221 amplifier to balanced input, assuming this would be best ... but it turned out it sounds better using the unbalanced outputs of my DAC.
I tried the tube preamp in this system, but didn't like it.
Zek,
I have no clue, aside from the fact it's OPA. Maybe linuxfan will know more, seeing as he's using them 🙂 My guess it's an OPA 16xx. Another product seemingly from the same manufacturer/workshop claims to use OPA1652.
K.
P/s: Yet another amplifier, with the TPA3251 chipset. Has 2 Opamp stages for some reasons. OPA1612 + OPA1632, goes for a low low $150.
I have no clue, aside from the fact it's OPA. Maybe linuxfan will know more, seeing as he's using them 🙂 My guess it's an OPA 16xx. Another product seemingly from the same manufacturer/workshop claims to use OPA1652.
K.
P/s: Yet another amplifier, with the TPA3251 chipset. Has 2 Opamp stages for some reasons. OPA1612 + OPA1632, goes for a low low $150.
Huh, fascinating. Most of the improvements you outlined in the original post were reversed. Perhaps these boards are designed really well or just right 😉
K.
An LM3886 based amp is a good choice for this, and many are arround like the infamous gainclone models. Some kits are availeble from Neurochrome and so. If you want a finished (or mostly finished) product, an Ayima A07 is quiet decent and cheap (75€)
Sorry flatmo, we got a bit sidetracked.
Forum member mamocel says this MA5332 board on AliExpress is extremely good -
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005005188618567.html
But I have a suggestion - there's a fully cased MA12070 amplifier on AliExpress which is quite well regarded (BRZHiFi) -
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003760799139.html
So instead of laying out significant money for the Topping PA3s, you could get a "taste" of the MA12070 and how it works with your speakers, for a cheap price.
Well I've heard from others that the TPA325x amps are particularly good with multi-way speakers, but for full range speakers I think there's a particular magic with TPA3116/TPA3221 ... and although I can't confirm it myself, many others on this forum say that the MA12070/MA5332 are one step better again, particularly with full range speakers. It's somewhat unfortunate that high end amp board designers such as JL Electronics and 3e-audio don't do MA12070/MA5332.
Forum member mamocel says this MA5332 board on AliExpress is extremely good -
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005005188618567.html
But I have a suggestion - there's a fully cased MA12070 amplifier on AliExpress which is quite well regarded (BRZHiFi) -
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003760799139.html
So instead of laying out significant money for the Topping PA3s, you could get a "taste" of the MA12070 and how it works with your speakers, for a cheap price.
linuxfan,
I would advise caution when buying the latter. I know a guy whose new BRZHifi MA12070 amplifier suddenly died after a 20-30 min long first run. On the other hand, I like the way that MA5532 looks.
K.
I would advise caution when buying the latter. I know a guy whose new BRZHifi MA12070 amplifier suddenly died after a 20-30 min long first run. On the other hand, I like the way that MA5532 looks.
K.
Thank you all for the sum-up. There is a lot of info about this devices but this also means that it is too much to process at once.
I wasn't aware that full range drivers work better with TPA3221 and MA12070.
It looks like my baseline is PA3s (2 x MA12070) which is 149$ for full package.
2 x "Audiophile digital amplifier board TPA3221" will be way cheaper at 81$ inc. shipping which leaves headroom for power brick, housing, connectors and other small parts. It also brings the satisfaction (or failure) of DIY.
This also leaves space for USB DAC board. This is gray area for me.
There are several XMOS U208 usb to I2S boards for less than 40$ and then i will need a ES9028Q2M I2S to analog.
Any recommendations on this aspect?
I wasn't aware that full range drivers work better with TPA3221 and MA12070.
It looks like my baseline is PA3s (2 x MA12070) which is 149$ for full package.
2 x "Audiophile digital amplifier board TPA3221" will be way cheaper at 81$ inc. shipping which leaves headroom for power brick, housing, connectors and other small parts. It also brings the satisfaction (or failure) of DIY.
This also leaves space for USB DAC board. This is gray area for me.
There are several XMOS U208 usb to I2S boards for less than 40$ and then i will need a ES9028Q2M I2S to analog.
Any recommendations on this aspect?
Both good options.
Regarding a power supply, I like Connex, but they're not cheap -
https://connexelectronic.com/produc...ies/switched-mode-power-supply/?orderby=price
Forum member daniboun recommends this -
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000523247624.html
I did DIY DAC's ten years ago. But today Topping and SMSL DAC's are so cheap and so good that going DIY hardly seems worthwhile, unless you want something "exotic" like Miro's AD1862 DAC, or Signalyst DSC2.
The current price champions are SMSL C100 and M300 SE, and Topping D10s and E30 II.
If you really wish to go DIY, maybe make a separate post in the Digital Line Level sub-forum.
Yes, those are the risks of buying super-cheap products on AliExpress - but if you want to audition a particular type of technology, in this case MA12070 - the financial risk is low, and you can treat the amplifier as expendable! If you like the sound, you can invest in a better quality alternative amp, and just enjoy the BRZHiFi if it continues to work in the meantime!
I stiull have a $20 Breeze TPA3116 which is still going strong after several years, in spite of me expecting it to die.
linuxfan,
You know, the exclamation marks strongly remind me of the Aliexpress descriptions of these products, though I doubt they're 1/10 as honest as you are 😳
Speaking about MA12070, here's yet another weird kit from China, a tube-infused MA amp: SUCA AUDIO TUBE T3C BT 5.1 Power Amplifier 6*4N Tube QCC5125 MA12070 HIFI Digital Power Amplifier APT X LCAD 80W×2 Headset AMP| | - AliExpress
Obligatory tear-down video: Aoshida A6 amplifier teardown - what's inside? - YouTube
K.
You know, the exclamation marks strongly remind me of the Aliexpress descriptions of these products, though I doubt they're 1/10 as honest as you are 😳
Speaking about MA12070, here's yet another weird kit from China, a tube-infused MA amp: SUCA AUDIO TUBE T3C BT 5.1 Power Amplifier 6*4N Tube QCC5125 MA12070 HIFI Digital Power Amplifier APT X LCAD 80W×2 Headset AMP| | - AliExpress
Obligatory tear-down video: Aoshida A6 amplifier teardown - what's inside? - YouTube
K.
@flatmo , Just shy of your 30w requirement, but very affordable, especially if you want to get your hands dirty with DIY:
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/transformer-fed-tda8932-25w-8r-mono-amp-kits.359193/
Speaking of… I need to get off my rear and order such a kit from Richard because I have a use case for them and have been interested in his designs.
https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/transformer-fed-tda8932-25w-8r-mono-amp-kits.359193/
Speaking of… I need to get off my rear and order such a kit from Richard because I have a use case for them and have been interested in his designs.