Hi all -
I know guitar leads aren't exactly a technical item, but I'm having issues. I've made a ton of jack to jack guitar leads ranging in length from patch leads to a 6m stage lead, as I've just bought a loop switcher and want to set it up really well. So I bought some high quality canare cable and neutrik connectors and went to town. I'm pretty good with a soldering iron, and I was being REALLY particular about every joint - i want these to last.
But at least half of my super leads kill my tone.
I did a bit of googling, and found what I thought was the problem - when you strip off the outer insulation and separate the screen, the inner core appears to have two layers of insulation over it - a thin black layer, and a thick clear layer. Turns out the thin black layer is not insulation at all, it's conductive rubber, and as I'd left it over the inner core, half of them had the black sheath touching the solder, creating a 4kohm "short" between tip and sleeve.
So I pulled apart every single lead, de-soldered the tip wire, stripped the black sheath off, and re-soldered them. But they're STILL killing my tone!
My thoughts so far - could the solder I'm using be unsuitable for audio? It's a really old roll of resin cored 60/40 Sn/Pb (and when i say "old", i mean it could actually be from the 70's...)
Or maybe - does de-soldering and re-soldering a couple of times affect things too much? Should I have cut them all off and started from scratch?
If anyone has any ideas...I'd love to hear them, cos I'm all out 🙂
Thanks!
I know guitar leads aren't exactly a technical item, but I'm having issues. I've made a ton of jack to jack guitar leads ranging in length from patch leads to a 6m stage lead, as I've just bought a loop switcher and want to set it up really well. So I bought some high quality canare cable and neutrik connectors and went to town. I'm pretty good with a soldering iron, and I was being REALLY particular about every joint - i want these to last.
But at least half of my super leads kill my tone.
I did a bit of googling, and found what I thought was the problem - when you strip off the outer insulation and separate the screen, the inner core appears to have two layers of insulation over it - a thin black layer, and a thick clear layer. Turns out the thin black layer is not insulation at all, it's conductive rubber, and as I'd left it over the inner core, half of them had the black sheath touching the solder, creating a 4kohm "short" between tip and sleeve.
So I pulled apart every single lead, de-soldered the tip wire, stripped the black sheath off, and re-soldered them. But they're STILL killing my tone!
My thoughts so far - could the solder I'm using be unsuitable for audio? It's a really old roll of resin cored 60/40 Sn/Pb (and when i say "old", i mean it could actually be from the 70's...)
Or maybe - does de-soldering and re-soldering a couple of times affect things too much? Should I have cut them all off and started from scratch?
If anyone has any ideas...I'd love to hear them, cos I'm all out 🙂
Thanks!
Any decent electronic solder is suitable for audio. Redoing a joint can sometimes create problems; better to remove solder and start again. However, the main issue with soldering is operator skill.
A long cable may have too much capacitance, which can reduce higher frequencies. Was the cable sold as being appropriate for this application? I assume the black sheath was meant to reduce cable microphonics when used with microphones i.e. very small signals. am not a guitarist so I don't know precisely what you mean by "killing tone".
A long cable may have too much capacitance, which can reduce higher frequencies. Was the cable sold as being appropriate for this application? I assume the black sheath was meant to reduce cable microphonics when used with microphones i.e. very small signals. am not a guitarist so I don't know precisely what you mean by "killing tone".
6 meters of cable feeding a high impedance input,usually 1 Mega ohm will result in a reduction of high frequency output from your guitar due to excessive cable capacitance creating a dull sound lacking attack.You could reduce your cable length from your instrument or use a low capacitance cable of same length at this critical stage.Cables from effects pedal outputs will be less prone to this 'dulling' as the source impedance provided by the pedal electronics will be considerbly lower.
What type/make of plugs are you using?
I also make up mic and guitar leads, and have standardized on Neutrik connectors for XLR and jack plugs (both TS as well as TRS jack plugs).
Neutrik connectors have got DECENT strain relief for cables on all their connectors resulting in cables staying put inside the enclosed plug/connector, and well soldered connections ensure that your signal is not killed by some inferior "el cheapo" connector. The solder tabs are also decent compared to the other stuff around, resulting in sturdy connections and high quality all round.
Just beware of Chinese lookalikes, but with junk "insides".
I refuse to use any other make of plug/connector.
I also make up mic and guitar leads, and have standardized on Neutrik connectors for XLR and jack plugs (both TS as well as TRS jack plugs).
Neutrik connectors have got DECENT strain relief for cables on all their connectors resulting in cables staying put inside the enclosed plug/connector, and well soldered connections ensure that your signal is not killed by some inferior "el cheapo" connector. The solder tabs are also decent compared to the other stuff around, resulting in sturdy connections and high quality all round.
Just beware of Chinese lookalikes, but with junk "insides".
I refuse to use any other make of plug/connector.
SO pick one cord to fix. You already discovered the conductive black stuff. But what resistance do you measure between the shield and the tip now? Should measure open of course, does it?
Just to make sure you did it right, use a piece of plain old ordinary shielded cable and make up a cord with your connectors. Does that work? WE can at least isolate the problem to the connectors, or the solder on them, or to the cable itself.
Just to make sure you did it right, use a piece of plain old ordinary shielded cable and make up a cord with your connectors. Does that work? WE can at least isolate the problem to the connectors, or the solder on them, or to the cable itself.
Hi guys,
Thanks for the tips so far. I'm comparing the lead I made with an off-the-shelf lead of the same length, so they should be identical as far as signal loss due to length? Also, switching the effects loops in and out gives a noticeable drop in volume, even with no active effects - just the loop cables. All the loop cables are as short as possible - like under 8 inches tip to tip - so that's not a capacitance issue.
Yes, I'm using genuine Neutrik connectors 🙂
I'm waiting on the arrival of some more test gear, and then Ill try some of the things listed here and report my findings 🙂
cheers guys!
Thanks for the tips so far. I'm comparing the lead I made with an off-the-shelf lead of the same length, so they should be identical as far as signal loss due to length? Also, switching the effects loops in and out gives a noticeable drop in volume, even with no active effects - just the loop cables. All the loop cables are as short as possible - like under 8 inches tip to tip - so that's not a capacitance issue.
Yes, I'm using genuine Neutrik connectors 🙂
I'm waiting on the arrival of some more test gear, and then Ill try some of the things listed here and report my findings 🙂
cheers guys!
Faulty Technician ?...
That shielded cable with black conductive layer under the shield is good stuff, except that you have to be sure that it is not contacting the active (inner) conductor whatsoever....the active clear insulation should be fully exposed all the way to the tip connection.
Use any old ohm meter and confirm that the cables measure open circuit between tip and sleeve.
In my experience this cable causes a nice very slight 'smoothing' in the sound, but there should be no large signal drop.
Eric.
That shielded cable with black conductive layer under the shield is good stuff, except that you have to be sure that it is not contacting the active (inner) conductor whatsoever....the active clear insulation should be fully exposed all the way to the tip connection.
Use any old ohm meter and confirm that the cables measure open circuit between tip and sleeve.
In my experience this cable causes a nice very slight 'smoothing' in the sound, but there should be no large signal drop.
Eric.
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