My next-door neighbors covered their rear yard with brick pavers a few years ago because they wanted it to be low maintenance. When they first did the work, I thought to myself that instead of having a yard that will absorb fresh rain water and make its way to the lake, the rain will now be diverted to the sewer system which will not only create more work for the waste water treatment plant, but will also render the fresh water useless for human consumption.
Today is pretty hot here in the city so thinking about my neighbors yard, I walked out back and took some temperature readings with a laser thermometer. The narrow concrete path to my garage reads 130 degrees F, but the lawn is 20 degrees cooler. Just something to think about.
Today is pretty hot here in the city so thinking about my neighbors yard, I walked out back and took some temperature readings with a laser thermometer. The narrow concrete path to my garage reads 130 degrees F, but the lawn is 20 degrees cooler. Just something to think about.
I don't really see a big difference. Even if you neighbor didn't cover their yard with brick pavers, once the ground becomes saturated from the rainfall the extra water is going to run off into the street. The only real difference is the amount of water it takes to saturate the lawn to begin with and that it is not very much relative to the total amount that hits the ground in a normal rain event.
I don't know what kind of rain is normal in your area, but some Dutch people I know who are involved in water management would much prefer it if people would stop paving their entire gardens.
This doesn't explain what the real issue is.
It seems to me that paving your garden actually reduces water usage, which most environmentalists think is a good thing.
It seems to me that paving your garden actually reduces water usage, which most environmentalists think is a good thing.
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I'm not the expert here; I'm just a stupid electronics engineer, so I don't know much about things that actually matter. That said:
From an environmental point of view, there are many aspects. When people spray their gardens too often causing a lack of water elsewhere, that's of course undesirable. Then again, all the plants in a green garden store carbon in their bodies, like any organism does, and any carbon stored in a plant can't float around in the air as CO2 that causes climate change or that dissolves in the ocean causing ocean acidification. Trees and bushes are the most effective, as they are heavy and are also there in the winter.
On top of that, gardens and particularly ecological/half-wild green gardens can help to maintain biodiversity. For example, insects often have a hard time surviving in rural areas because of the pesticide usage in agriculture, but have less of a problem in cities with green gardens (although flee collars and decorative plants treated with insecticides can still do damage). The same then holds for animals that depend on those insects.
Regarding water, green gardens help to keep the peak demands on the sewers low. Some of the rain goes to the groundwater, some eventually ends up in the sewer, but less abruptly than when all gardens are paved. It's basically the hydrological equivalent of a bypass capacitor. Here in the Netherlands, the main short-term effects of climate change are that rain tends to fall more irregularly than it used to, and that we almost never have an Elfstedentocht (traditional Frisian speed skating event) anymore.
From an environmental point of view, there are many aspects. When people spray their gardens too often causing a lack of water elsewhere, that's of course undesirable. Then again, all the plants in a green garden store carbon in their bodies, like any organism does, and any carbon stored in a plant can't float around in the air as CO2 that causes climate change or that dissolves in the ocean causing ocean acidification. Trees and bushes are the most effective, as they are heavy and are also there in the winter.
On top of that, gardens and particularly ecological/half-wild green gardens can help to maintain biodiversity. For example, insects often have a hard time surviving in rural areas because of the pesticide usage in agriculture, but have less of a problem in cities with green gardens (although flee collars and decorative plants treated with insecticides can still do damage). The same then holds for animals that depend on those insects.
Regarding water, green gardens help to keep the peak demands on the sewers low. Some of the rain goes to the groundwater, some eventually ends up in the sewer, but less abruptly than when all gardens are paved. It's basically the hydrological equivalent of a bypass capacitor. Here in the Netherlands, the main short-term effects of climate change are that rain tends to fall more irregularly than it used to, and that we almost never have an Elfstedentocht (traditional Frisian speed skating event) anymore.
If paving is such a terrible thing and causing major changes in the climate then we should probably start tearing up all the roads, streets, sidewalks, and parking lots that have now become a problem.
Exactly. This is being done here in vienna. More trees and unsealed surfaces to reduce extreme temperature during hot summer days and reduce sewage swells from heavy rain.
Heat in the cities is a health issue, mostly for elderly people.
Great. It's going to be fun driving over muddy roads instead of nicely paved ones. Brings back old times just like it was a hundred years ago. Real progress.
OK. So, they are not really tearing up the roads in Vienna as you said they were. That seems like good news.
But I still don't understand what it is they have done to reduce sewage swells from heavy rains.
But I still don't understand what it is they have done to reduce sewage swells from heavy rains.
If I dig two feet down in my yard, I hit sand which absorbs the rain. We've been here 15 years and our yard has never flooded but the paved street out front is sometimes overwhelmed but the sewer system manages it pretty quickly.
No one is going to tear up the streets but that got me thinking, the sewer grates are in the gutter between the road and the sidewalk. If the gutter was permeable, it could absorb some of the rain water back into the ground so as not to overwhelm the sewer system.
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Here its the opposite, water is supposed to soak into the ground to resupply the water table pushing it out to the sea via pipeline is not natural.
Getting back to the original post that started this thread, bedrock602 claimed that by installing brick pavers in the back yard his neighbor has diverted rain run-off into the sewer system instead of into the lake. But that really depends on where the lake is. Back yards are usually sloped so that water runs away from the house and if the lake is behind the house, then the water will go into it and not into the sewer system.
The lake is a couple of miles away but your point is well taken. I don't know if they installed an area drain that is connected to the sewer system or if the water simply runs off to any available patch of unpaved ground.
What prompted my original post was the temperature difference between the concrete sidewalk and the lawn. The air temperature that day was 90F, the concrete walk was 130F and the lawn was 110F. The following day it was still 90F, the walk still 130F but for some reason the lawn was 100F, a full 30 degrees cooler than the concrete. Since most of my yard is mostly lawn and garden, I wouldn't be able to compare the difference lounging in a chair on the grass vs lounging on the concrete but I imagine doing so in my neighbors yard would be considerably warmer than on the grass.
What prompted my original post was the temperature difference between the concrete sidewalk and the lawn. The air temperature that day was 90F, the concrete walk was 130F and the lawn was 110F. The following day it was still 90F, the walk still 130F but for some reason the lawn was 100F, a full 30 degrees cooler than the concrete. Since most of my yard is mostly lawn and garden, I wouldn't be able to compare the difference lounging in a chair on the grass vs lounging on the concrete but I imagine doing so in my neighbors yard would be considerably warmer than on the grass.
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