Just a quick note to say goodbye to all. Thank you to all of you who helped and were patient with me when I was making mistakes or spoke nonsense.
As a professional design engineer my working methodology is no longer compatible with the DIY mantra of this site - indeed, the open nature of this forum is wonderful in that it allows all to contribute, unfortunately that means that the vast majority of advice is a regurgitation of a regurgitation. Often people within the DIY speaker building forums (where I have been active) seem to post statements with great authority and no real world experience on the matter. Stop and think about that statement for a moment.
I have consistently been aghast at the 'quality' of advice on offer, which is often just plain wrong. for a while I argued against it, but it's like arguing with a tide coming in - absolute folly.
All that said, there are some users who do there best to give good advice and have stayed active here for many years, massive commendations to you.
I recently posted a 'what's the point' thread in the lounge in an attempt to open discussions about doing some tests and work that would improve the knowledge base available to the DIY speaker builder, but this was hijacked by an absolute idiot spouting paragraph after paragraph of irrelevant information - nothing to do with the opening post, full of erroneous statements. which just highlighted how terrible this forum is for actually doing anything professional or constructive.
This is a condemning post, I know it, and I'm sad to post it. But the truth is DIY audio, at least for speaker building, is not what it should be. Rather than a resource full of useful, factual information, it's a burden of nonsense and disinformation.
With that all in mind, I will be tagging out of this forum now, with the exception of buying and selling a little.
For anyone who stumbles on this forum hoping to build amazing speakers, here's my advice:
If you just want to have amazing speakers for cheap, either go on ebay or buy a kit from an established manufacturer like SB acoustics or Visaton. Trust me it's much more cost effective, both short and long term. Start listening to music and stop trying to make a speaker.
If you want to learn to make speakers, go and find some good quality engineering textbooks and read up on it. Make sure they're factual and from well known and respected publishers. Avoid nonsense on the internet. Be aware that opinions in audio dominate, rather than facts. Even in text books. take everything with a grain of salt.
If you just want a hobby where you can waste time and 'learn' left is right and right is left, welcome to the forum, good luck.
As a professional design engineer my working methodology is no longer compatible with the DIY mantra of this site - indeed, the open nature of this forum is wonderful in that it allows all to contribute, unfortunately that means that the vast majority of advice is a regurgitation of a regurgitation. Often people within the DIY speaker building forums (where I have been active) seem to post statements with great authority and no real world experience on the matter. Stop and think about that statement for a moment.
I have consistently been aghast at the 'quality' of advice on offer, which is often just plain wrong. for a while I argued against it, but it's like arguing with a tide coming in - absolute folly.
All that said, there are some users who do there best to give good advice and have stayed active here for many years, massive commendations to you.
I recently posted a 'what's the point' thread in the lounge in an attempt to open discussions about doing some tests and work that would improve the knowledge base available to the DIY speaker builder, but this was hijacked by an absolute idiot spouting paragraph after paragraph of irrelevant information - nothing to do with the opening post, full of erroneous statements. which just highlighted how terrible this forum is for actually doing anything professional or constructive.
This is a condemning post, I know it, and I'm sad to post it. But the truth is DIY audio, at least for speaker building, is not what it should be. Rather than a resource full of useful, factual information, it's a burden of nonsense and disinformation.
With that all in mind, I will be tagging out of this forum now, with the exception of buying and selling a little.
For anyone who stumbles on this forum hoping to build amazing speakers, here's my advice:
If you just want to have amazing speakers for cheap, either go on ebay or buy a kit from an established manufacturer like SB acoustics or Visaton. Trust me it's much more cost effective, both short and long term. Start listening to music and stop trying to make a speaker.
If you want to learn to make speakers, go and find some good quality engineering textbooks and read up on it. Make sure they're factual and from well known and respected publishers. Avoid nonsense on the internet. Be aware that opinions in audio dominate, rather than facts. Even in text books. take everything with a grain of salt.
If you just want a hobby where you can waste time and 'learn' left is right and right is left, welcome to the forum, good luck.
I didn't follow the thread you refer to, but might (dare) I suggest rather than disappear from the forum, that you just add whoever irritates you to your ignore list ? 🙂
https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/profile.php?do=ignorelist
https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/profile.php?do=ignorelist
I should note the hijacker had only just joined the site this month so should not be considered representative.
In a way everything is pointless, but if you think like this you may as well just get a gun and blow your brains out.
sp
sp
If decision is taken, nothing we can do about it but please don't be discouraged by just 1 individual where I don't know where he comes from ...
Very valuable advice from the op I already made mine as loudspeakers designing is not that easy and cheap. All is indeed if you want just to enjoy listening music first or have a hobby where the pleasure is elswhere than the primary listening goal enjoyment than obsessions can waste. The thing that is fascinating is our brain becomes so critic than we cut hairs in 4 hidding the simple listening enjoyment... as if we just hear the cracs on a vynil and not the playbacked music anymore.
I would add to the list, second hand speakers as well are good banks for the buck.
This hobby can be time and monney consuming and I find the upon advices make sense. Anyway a good retirement hobby, but when you have a daily work yopu might consider to save time if your main goal is to enjoy listening music a life is too short to embrass it all !
It asks some auto resets time to time, just hope nanoo will come back after one of these though.
I would add to the list, second hand speakers as well are good banks for the buck.
This hobby can be time and monney consuming and I find the upon advices make sense. Anyway a good retirement hobby, but when you have a daily work yopu might consider to save time if your main goal is to enjoy listening music a life is too short to embrass it all !
It asks some auto resets time to time, just hope nanoo will come back after one of these though.
I read under a quarter if the posts just looking at the select few.
Reading 100 posts about the shape of a getter in a valve/tube is not for me so I will mark it read and move on to something that does interest me.
There is enough for me to come back again.
Reading 100 posts about the shape of a getter in a valve/tube is not for me so I will mark it read and move on to something that does interest me.
There is enough for me to come back again.
I am afraid I understand the thread starter quite well. However, the disappearing act may be done without announcements.
I'm an engineer. I've got everything I listen through by combing the nits out of this site and others. I'm well experienced in Audio forums, going back to ASCII terminal displays of such. I guess I know what to take with a grain of salt.
Dont despair! It's always been like this and I suspect, always will. There was the guy with hearing his right angle RCA connectors...the guy that told me he couldnt hear anything at all due to an op-amp's PSRR - until he injected ridiculous levels of noise on the +/- rails...
So it's always been "all over the spot". Especially if you have a little bit of subscription to engineering first principles. Try to use that not as a source of frustration, but as a filter. Trust your gut feeling about something you read.
If something you read twists your gut into a knot, scroll down to the next - or jump to a new thread. If that's in your own post, ignore it and drive on with your objective.
Dont despair! It's always been like this and I suspect, always will. There was the guy with hearing his right angle RCA connectors...the guy that told me he couldnt hear anything at all due to an op-amp's PSRR - until he injected ridiculous levels of noise on the +/- rails...
So it's always been "all over the spot". Especially if you have a little bit of subscription to engineering first principles. Try to use that not as a source of frustration, but as a filter. Trust your gut feeling about something you read.
If something you read twists your gut into a knot, scroll down to the next - or jump to a new thread. If that's in your own post, ignore it and drive on with your objective.
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Yes, of course, but I guess he´s trying to show a flaw with the hope it may be somehow be corrected.
That said, everybody getting into a public, open, often opinion based Forum, must expect now and then being challenged by one or more not too educated Members, in all meanings of the word (knowledge or manners), but it´s part of the deal.
The old saying "it may be rigged but it´s the only game in town" holds truth, like most old sayings.
Personally I´ve had to roll my eyes more than once (guess same happens to everybody) but hey, on average Forum is GOOD!!!! and that makes it worth staying.
We all need to grow a somewhat thicker skin ,or else 🙂
That said, everybody getting into a public, open, often opinion based Forum, must expect now and then being challenged by one or more not too educated Members, in all meanings of the word (knowledge or manners), but it´s part of the deal.
The old saying "it may be rigged but it´s the only game in town" holds truth, like most old sayings.
Personally I´ve had to roll my eyes more than once (guess same happens to everybody) but hey, on average Forum is GOOD!!!! and that makes it worth staying.
We all need to grow a somewhat thicker skin ,or else 🙂
Be Zen.
Sure there are a couple of obnoxious blokes.
Smart a****, know it all, bad faith one, snake oil vendors.
PCP and book sellers, that capitalize on known and rehashed stuff.
But there are very interesting and pleasant people. This is way more important.
So come back and be Zen.
No need for the ignore list to do ignore what is upsetting.
Sure there are a couple of obnoxious blokes.
Smart a****, know it all, bad faith one, snake oil vendors.
PCP and book sellers, that capitalize on known and rehashed stuff.
But there are very interesting and pleasant people. This is way more important.
So come back and be Zen.
No need for the ignore list to do ignore what is upsetting.
Happens in all industries and all forums.
I believe the Ikea effect is at least partially to blame.
As it relates to DIY Audio, Beranek summed it up well way back in 1954.
"It has been remarked that if one selects his own components, builds his own enclosure, and is convinced he has made a wise choice of design, then his own loudspeaker sounds better to him than does anyone else's loudspeaker. In this case, the frequency response of the loudspeaker seems to play only a minor part in forming a person's opinion."
L.L. Beranek, Acoustics (McGraw-Hill, New York, 1954), p.208
I believe the Ikea effect is at least partially to blame.
As it relates to DIY Audio, Beranek summed it up well way back in 1954.
"It has been remarked that if one selects his own components, builds his own enclosure, and is convinced he has made a wise choice of design, then his own loudspeaker sounds better to him than does anyone else's loudspeaker. In this case, the frequency response of the loudspeaker seems to play only a minor part in forming a person's opinion."
L.L. Beranek, Acoustics (McGraw-Hill, New York, 1954), p.208
Although we haven't crossed paths on this forum, you'll be missed. It becomes ever more challenging to find those that will share their (truly expert) knowledge freely on sites such as these. Were it not for people such as yourself, I'd not have had the ready opportunity to learn what I've learned, built what I've built, and enjoy what I've enjoyed.
If you enjoy teaching and sharing, but don't enjoy some of the nonsense of others, perhaps see if the ignore function or some help from the mods to keep your topics "clean" would make it more enjoyable.
If not, thanks for your contributions.
If you enjoy teaching and sharing, but don't enjoy some of the nonsense of others, perhaps see if the ignore function or some help from the mods to keep your topics "clean" would make it more enjoyable.
If not, thanks for your contributions.
Just beat them down with FACTS in ALL CAPS and add 48 exclamationsmarks, just to get the flame war properly started. 😀
There's all kinds of people everywhere, just the way the world is. There'll always be someone to outsmart you, and sometimes to outdumb you.
You're probably very knowledgeable and would very likely be a great asset to the forum, but you do come across as a bit fragile posting like this.
We have a saying: "Lita tue kan velte stort lass." Which translates loosely to: "Small bump can topple big load."
Please remember that everyone is different and that there's a lot of diverse backgrounds, cultures and language backgrounds here. Some are a bit hesitant to post, while other post perhaps a bit much. Some choose their words with care and others blunder about. Just like everywhere else. Very hard to change people's nature.
There's all kinds of people everywhere, just the way the world is. There'll always be someone to outsmart you, and sometimes to outdumb you.
You're probably very knowledgeable and would very likely be a great asset to the forum, but you do come across as a bit fragile posting like this.
We have a saying: "Lita tue kan velte stort lass." Which translates loosely to: "Small bump can topple big load."
Please remember that everyone is different and that there's a lot of diverse backgrounds, cultures and language backgrounds here. Some are a bit hesitant to post, while other post perhaps a bit much. Some choose their words with care and others blunder about. Just like everywhere else. Very hard to change people's nature.
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Psycho acoustics brings in a lot of subjective and experience based elements into individual perception. Even in my workplace I cannot hope to always get a point across and measured data may or may nor matter to others.
Basically in an open forum like this one, one can only make a pitch and then leave it in the wind for others to make something (if anything) out of it. No need to take an offense if someone is advocating for a nebulous position which has little to do with physics and everything to do with making them feel better about themselves. You state yours and off you go, sip a glass of wine and enjoy your hobby. Wow, I just posted in the Lounge (must have too much time, hmm..).
Basically in an open forum like this one, one can only make a pitch and then leave it in the wind for others to make something (if anything) out of it. No need to take an offense if someone is advocating for a nebulous position which has little to do with physics and everything to do with making them feel better about themselves. You state yours and off you go, sip a glass of wine and enjoy your hobby. Wow, I just posted in the Lounge (must have too much time, hmm..).
It's all good here, wine sipping and good food, some contemplation about the universe, weather, and a healthy dose of humour.
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