Full range driver as a wide range tweeter.

[xrk971]

Not at all. The other speakers listened to suffered none of that. The VIFA isn't bad, it is just not near up to the level of cheerleading coming from you.



And an inability to reproduce low-level detail.It has poor DDR.



No pointin listening to you low budget measure mic...

dave

The clips are not recorded with the measurement mic which just because it costs $80 you fail to give it any credibility. The sound is recorded with a Zoom H4 digital recorder with built in XY mic. True, it's not expensive either but had a pretty nice 96kHz 24bit ADC that I use for the sound recording.

 

[xrk971]

So. Many things in audio are yet to be measurable.

And as we speak, Pano is working on a way to measure this.

Hard to believe that you would put any credibility into XRK's effort.

dave

P10,
You seem to be the only one getting all worked up over my measurements and sound clips. I now have an A7.3 in my hands, a driver which you claim has more DDR than a TC9FD. They do add sparkle to the sound and is what I believe you feel makes the sound appear to have more "DDR" from supposedly 40dB down low. It sounds interesting and lively at first but gets tiresome as it is not playing what is really there but generating its additional detail through the additional peaks at 10kHz and 13kHz. They ring and in doing so, make the perception of soft trabsients appear more audible. Simple as that. You know how this can be measured and proven? If I apply EQ to flatten the offending peaks, the sound becomes more natural and less "lively". I will post a comparison for folks to listen and judge for themselves. Coming soon to a new thread. I don't want to muck up this thread anymore with this topic.

Here is the response of the A7.3 measured new and after 36hrs of break in. There is a 12dB peak at 10kHz - which is the same as a very large amplitude ringing with 100uSec period of oscillation. That is the "DDR" - it exists purely because of a temporal anomaly in the impulse response, that should otherwise be brief and clean. I back up my claims with data, whereas all I see is more opinion, anecdotes, unprovable claims, and when all else fails, you will bury this post in an obscure thread somewhere in the Lounge. Sort of like the emperor imposing revisionist history.

 

[Pano]

Doesn't all this arguing belong in another thread? You know the one...

 

[larryldspkr]

Please give it a rest guys, this bickering is getting really tiresome! Certainly isn't doing this hobby any good.

Larry

 

[gazzagazza]

Thank you all for your responses. The plan is simply for a passive crossover in the 600-700 Hz region. Possibly first order to start with. I wanted the variable bsc (if that is what I achieve) so that I do not have to guess the amount required.

The BMR route looks the most interesting to me, and one I would not have thought of. I cannot find a source for Tectonic Elements in this country. Has anyone tried shipping from Parts Express to England?

Have a look at the speaker offerings from Rs Components. I have a BMR here from them.

 

[Studio Au]

re: BMR.

Contact Derek, "Overkill Audio" I think he still has stock of the 4.5" rubber ones.

Thread below about his BMR's. Trully hands down the best system I have heard. Near Cambridge, well worth a listen if you can...

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/191853-near-full-range-bmr-balanced-mode-radiator-30.html

 

[gazzagazza]

Here is a Tectonic Elements (HiWave) driver from RS Components at quite reasonable price...

HIBM65C20F-8 | HiWave Speaker Driver HIBM65C20F-8, 10W, 8Ω, 160W | HiWave

 

[gazzagazza]

HiWave?s 90mm round BMR speaker driver delivers full-range, room filling sound dispersion from compact housings | Tectonic Elements

 

[gazzagazza]

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...de-range-driver-measurements-impressions.html

 

[ScottG]

They do add sparkle to the sound and is what I believe you feel makes the sound appear to have more "DDR" from supposedly 40dB down low. It sounds interesting and lively at first but gets tiresome as it is not playing what is really there but generating its additional detail through the additional peaks at 10kHz and 13kHz. They ring and in doing so, make the perception of soft trabsients appear more audible. Simple as that.

Not Dave, but I believe he is talking about hall sound and how apparent it is for a given recording (that has it). It provides a certain clarity to the sound, but sometimes at the expense of a more vivid or present "image".

This is not a freq. response aberration.

It has everything to do with the property of the diaphragm (mass and size/shape) in relation to the surround. Basically it's a matter of damping (..not electrical damping nor spider damping).

What most people don't know is that for most freq.s from the midrange up that the *edge* of the cone provides the greatest spl (..it's a pressure "hot spot" with respect to the entire diaphragm). The surround both damps this behavior and physically masks it (..to an extent).

Inverted surrounds (usually with thinner material), foam surrounds, etc.. tend to have this low level detail/low damping behavior to a greater degree. Whizers are particularly notable for this behavior - despite being "peaky" in their freq. response.

Ex. I can't stand this singer's style.. but her vocals (which hit a highest note of around 900 Hz) tend to highlight this on this fostex fe 206:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXpRwRi1f2E