Full Range Build... Where to Start???

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69Jazzmaster

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Joined 2020
#1
I am looking to build up some Full Range, Single Driver, Speakers. I have been wanting to get a second pair of speakers to offer something different from my '77 La Scala's. I have made some changes to the La Scala's that have resulted in excellent sound... Upgraded Tweeters, ALK crossovers, etc. Very happy with them but have longed for a more relaxed set of speakers that offer beautiful midrange detail, softer highs for mainly classical and acoustic recordings. Would like a natural and musical bass section, doesn't have to dig too deep. Single speakers set ups just seems to fit the bill... if done right.

After looking at many discussions on DIYA and others, I am very unsure of where to start... with the driver, or with the enclosure? I have looked at drivers and I've looked at enclosures... but I haven't seen exactly what I would like to do. I was hoping to get some plans for a larger driver, like 10" or 12". But I am not finding much in the way of plans for these sized drivers. So maybe that is because anything larger than 8" perhaps isn't well suited for this type of speaker design? I have a pair of Altec 417H drivers that are sitting around doing nothing... They are an instrument driver, not hifi, but they sound excellent in a Fender Twin!

I have done some basic calculations with some online calculators for a Bass Reflex enclosure. but I would like to hear from you all if I am starting out all wrong with the wrong driver. I have looked into some 8" drivers from Fostex, Seas and Mark Audio, but zero experience with these brands to even know what the house sound might offer. Also, all the plans available seem to be small bookshelf boxes. Is there a plan for a larger box and wider baffle for an 8" driver? I have the room, but would like to keep the footprint equal to or less than my La Scala's.

Totally fresh to this topic so all information is welcome.
 
#2
If you really want to go for something different, try Open Baffle (OB). There, you'll have a full range (FR) driver, but typically assisted on the bass by another larger driver.

As a two-way with a low xover point, the FR driver is relieved from the cone excursions necessary to make bass and therefore it wont have the intermodulation of bass frequencies onto the rest of the audio band it's presenting.

There's a bazillion designs to choose from. Look around, read what people have to say about a particular driver pairing. If you find yourself convinced by "reviews and experiences" with a particular design, by all means buy the parts and build it. I have two such systems and each suits my music and listening style just fine!
 
#3
Thanks JJ, I did end up looking into OB designs for a minute as it seemed intriguing... but it was the prevalence of a second driver that kind of turned me off. I like the stark simplicity of a single driver. Are there OB designs that can rely on a single driver... as long as it can realistically play an oboe or cello then that's all the bass I need. by the way, I do listen at lower volumes... around 70 to 80db on average.
 
#4
Man’s often inherent “mine is bigger than yours” often seems to lead to the desire for larger drivers.

A FR has a very hard job to do.And a single speaker as large as you are looking for cannot do the job. Particulariliy the
for a more relaxed set of speakers that offer beautiful midrange detail, softer highs for mainly classical and acoustic recordings. Would like a natural and musical bass section, doesn't have to dig too deep. Single speakers set ups just seems to fit the bill...
Click to expand...
bit. I have yet to see a big FR that doesn’t have a significant ripple train of resonances (as the cone size increases keeping these suppressed becomes really really difficult). Big is ususally to get bass, but at the sacrifice of midTop. And many are actually hard to get to go low.

The speker that appeared in my mind right after your description would be Alpair 10p in Frugel-Horn Xl. Since A10p seems to be really hard to source, Alpair 12p or CHN-110 in Joan.

From my experience the FR sweet-spot is 4-6” or so.

Larger, SEAS FA22, but it soes need phase plugs. Visaton B200 (alos with phase plugs) are in the same league but harder to work with.

dave
 
#6
Thanks Planet 10... I have been on your site more than a few times recently also when looking into the Frugel Horn... thanks for the feedback! You nailed it on the head, I usually fall prey to the bigger is better theory when it comes to speakers. I love vintage, and vintage is usually a lot bigger than modern. However, as I already have big vintage speakers and going for something different, I have looked into the Frugel Horn. But, as I have the horn loaded speakers, kind of went off look into BR enclosures. But the Frugel Horn keeps coming up in my research. I did request the Monolith Demetri plans from Frugal-phile as they "looked" good to me. But the drivers for the demetri seemed a bit hard to source at reasonable prices.

so I am back to the first plans I looked at... the Frugal Horn XL. Can you compare the Frugal Horn with the Super Pencil with the A12P?
 
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#7
Demetri is a folded ML-Voigt designed originally for the FE207 and then tweaked to support FF225wk (which really needs help up top).

Similar designs are very likely doable for drivers that have already been fitted to a TL of some sort. The Voigt a big box designed to work towards maximizing bottom.

Related, i have a set of Mileva (smaller Demetri) cabinets for give-away (you have to come pick them up) and was starting to look at available drivers that could work in it.

dave
 
#9
ok... I think I'm thinking the A10p now based on Dave's recommendation. This would either be in the Frugal Horn XL or Pencil 10.2 box. I have a Rel sub that can fill in the low end so really want to nail the mids and highs.

How do these two enclosures compare for the A10p?
 
#12
Step One: Realize there is no such thing. Only "wide range"
Step Two: Realistically look at the frequency response of available drivers. Pay attention to breakup
Step Three: Then decide if a full range is really such a good idea.

Up to you.
 
#18
planet10 said:
Man’s often inherent “mine is bigger than yours” often seems to lead to the desire for larger drivers.

A FR has a very hard job to do.And a single speaker as large as you are looking for cannot do the job. Particulariliy the

bit. I have yet to see a big FR that doesn’t have a significant ripple train of resonances (as the cone size increases keeping these suppressed becomes really really difficult). Big is ususally to get bass, but at the sacrifice of midTop. And many are actually hard to get to go low.

The speker that appeared in my mind right after your description would be Alpair 10p in Frugel-Horn Xl. Since A10p seems to be really hard to source, Alpair 12p or CHN-110 in Joan.

From my experience the FR sweet-spot is 4-6” or so.

Larger, SEAS FA22, but it soes need phase plugs. Visaton B200 (alos with phase plugs) are in the same league but harder to work with.

dave
Click to expand...
Hi Dave,

Between MOAP 10 and MOAP 11, which is the better one with Frugel-Horn Xl and has lower bass? Thank you!
 
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