rjbond3rd said:
From the limited number i have measures (a dozen FE207 and 20 FE206), FE207 is 41-42 Hz, FE206 is 47 Hz.
dave
planet10 said:
Was that before or after a proper break-in period?
Just curious if you have any #'s, what is the typical extension of the 206 in the Sachiko with room gain?
chops said:
Everything gets 100-300 hrs on the break-in bench before i do anything to them (not specifically to break them in, but to weed out any rejects before i void the factory waranty).
dave
planet10 said:
Did I forget to mention that?
😀 planet10 said:
They certainly have their uses... 😉 ahem.
chops said:
Oh yes. Easy. There's actually some output down to the high 20s, but 40Hz = doddle. That's 1/2 space BTW. Call it useable to 40Hz in practice & I'm being conservative. Depends on how much gain you get from the room, but you'll probably be OK to the mid 30s.
rjbond3rd said:
As Dave mentioned, the factory claims are a trifle 'optimistic', shall we say. That aside, FYI, the Fs of a driver in a bass-horn is really neither here nor there. If it produces pressure at the throat, that's all that is required. The horn does the rest. Over-simplified, but in essense, largely true.
Scottmoose said:
That's good news then. That means I may not have to go so big on the stereo woofer line-arrays. Then again, I always do tend to overdo everything, so who knows. 😉
Oh no. No, no. I heartily encourage you to go large on the stereo woofer line arrays. Bigger the better. In fact, make them bigger than you had originally intended. There's no such thing as overkill. What is it GM & Ron keep saying? 'If enough is sufficient, then too much is just right.'
Couldn't agree more. 🙂
Couldn't agree more. 🙂
Scottmoose said:
Precisely my way of thinking. Just ask my wallet sometime. LOL
I just have to find out what size enclosure and tuning I need to get those Dayton Classic 6.5" drivers to in order to get me down to or below 20Hz, preferably below. 😀
Scottmoose said:
With the corollary being: 'anything worth doing is worth doing to excess'. 😀
GM
any efficiency gain?
REC1 said:
will a waveguide of this size have a fh effect to increase the efficency and approx. how much above the fe87e 89db spec.?GM said:
The object of FLH loading a 'FR' driver is to cause enough gain over a narrower arc to offset baffle step loss, so if the driver is 89 dB eff. on axis down to 500 Hz and the horn loads to 100 Hz, then 89 dB is what it should be down to the 100 Hz corner frequency, ergo for a HE 'FR' system you must use a HE driver and to maximize efficiency it needs to also have a strong rising on axis response like Lowthers, FE206E, etc.. The former may need a super tweeter depending on how big the horn or WG is while the latter must have one if a decent power response (doesn't beam excessively) to 20 kHz is required.
GM
GM
BTW all, I never did say exactly what has been going on lately...
After a couple more emails with Dave, I have decided on a pair of his FE206eN drivers with the full works! I have also decided on the Sachiko horns.
I have already put in a request for a specific color scheme on the drivers, and they are already at the end of their break-in period. So now comes all of the various tweaks and mods that Dave does.
Hopefully in a few weeks, I'll have them in my hot little hands!
Also, I spoke with one of the guys I work with (which is a very well appointed wood worker), and he has agreed to build the Sachiko's for me. I emailed him the plans last night and he said they should be easy to build. All I said to that was... "Easy for you to say". LOL
So it looks like the next couple of months are going to be some fun times around here for me! 😀
After a couple more emails with Dave, I have decided on a pair of his FE206eN drivers with the full works! I have also decided on the Sachiko horns.
I have already put in a request for a specific color scheme on the drivers, and they are already at the end of their break-in period. So now comes all of the various tweaks and mods that Dave does.
Hopefully in a few weeks, I'll have them in my hot little hands!
Also, I spoke with one of the guys I work with (which is a very well appointed wood worker), and he has agreed to build the Sachiko's for me. I emailed him the plans last night and he said they should be easy to build. All I said to that was... "Easy for you to say". LOL
So it looks like the next couple of months are going to be some fun times around here for me! 😀
I do believe I just came to my senses...
I was reading the thread " My Sachiko Build Process ", and once I got down to the bottom of the first page, I read Scott's post that says this...
"All the double horns, irrespective of type are best placed at least 3ft from side-walls in my experience. The huge reflection off said wall did unpleasent things to the lower midrange (roughly from 200Hz - 500Hz) in all the the test boxes I've built thus far. You could hang something to damp the reflection, though this will have other effects that I can't really predict from here.
The long-path cabinets are high-gain designs, and are intended to be pulled out from the rear wall. 2ft - 4ft was roughly what I had in mind. Moving them closer to the rear wall will increase gain further, but risk thickening up the midband too, as you'd expect. They will require a minimum listening distance of 8ft to get the full benefits, preferably more if you can. 12ft - 15ft or so would be ideal. One thing any cabinet of this layout shares is placement sensitivity: move it an inch & you'll hear the difference."
Well that pretty much blows the idea of building the Sachiko out of the water for me. All I have to work with is a very small 11' x 12' room (3.35m x 3.65m). In other words, not much at all, especially for large horns such as the Sachiko.
I'm not going to spend all the money on materials and waste my friend's time building a pair of horns that simply are not going to work right in the very limited amount of space I have. So it's back to the ole' drawing board.
Any thoughts?...
I was reading the thread " My Sachiko Build Process ", and once I got down to the bottom of the first page, I read Scott's post that says this...
"All the double horns, irrespective of type are best placed at least 3ft from side-walls in my experience. The huge reflection off said wall did unpleasent things to the lower midrange (roughly from 200Hz - 500Hz) in all the the test boxes I've built thus far. You could hang something to damp the reflection, though this will have other effects that I can't really predict from here.
The long-path cabinets are high-gain designs, and are intended to be pulled out from the rear wall. 2ft - 4ft was roughly what I had in mind. Moving them closer to the rear wall will increase gain further, but risk thickening up the midband too, as you'd expect. They will require a minimum listening distance of 8ft to get the full benefits, preferably more if you can. 12ft - 15ft or so would be ideal. One thing any cabinet of this layout shares is placement sensitivity: move it an inch & you'll hear the difference."
Well that pretty much blows the idea of building the Sachiko out of the water for me. All I have to work with is a very small 11' x 12' room (3.35m x 3.65m). In other words, not much at all, especially for large horns such as the Sachiko.
I'm not going to spend all the money on materials and waste my friend's time building a pair of horns that simply are not going to work right in the very limited amount of space I have. So it's back to the ole' drawing board.
Any thoughts?...
Just the other day i caught that you room was not much bigger than a closet and was going to comment, looks like Scott (& some dilligent research on your part) already covered that off... probably as big as you want to go is Fonken167.
dave
dave
Hey Dave,
Well it's a little bigger than a closet, but not much. Sad but true. LOL
I imagine you received my email then?
Yeah, I was thinking something in the lines of a Fonken or a kind of MLTL. I don't know...
Well it's a little bigger than a closet, but not much. Sad but true. LOL
I imagine you received my email then?
Yeah, I was thinking something in the lines of a Fonken or a kind of MLTL. I don't know...
chops said:
Not yet. (did see your AC post after posting above so we seem to be on the same wavelength) Mail machine is downstairs, i'm babysitting ATM so am on my internet applicance (wireless iBook).
When we introed the Fonken167 at this years diyFest, 2 different Bob Brines FT1600 (ML-TL) owners said it was the best they had heard the driver.
dave
planet10 said:
"Internet appliance"... I like that. LOL
If the Fonken167 is that good, then I think I should build those. I desire the best I can possibly get my hands on within my budget.
I imagine the Fonken167's were using your modified drivers?
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