So, you have changed your conclusions after this AB blind test ?
(You wrote: "I would just like to say that I'm so sad that DPS-500 can not run on higher powers, because sound with this SMPS is just perfect. "
and, when first testing Connex: "Cristi, your second SMPS2000R is just WOOOW, driving both channels. This is the one packed with Rubycons on primary and secondary side, set to +/-63 V, no hum, dead quiet silence, rock stable imaging, resolution is at the top notch, no sign of sibilants on vocals, liquid like sound, bass is simply awsome, like a day and night different from first one tried, also much better than SMPS1200. ")
I'm very interested if you could reach a more general conclusion, regulated VS non regulated, single stereo VS two mono blocs.
BTW, did the First ones used for this test were all burned out the same and enough ?
(You wrote: "I would just like to say that I'm so sad that DPS-500 can not run on higher powers, because sound with this SMPS is just perfect. "
and, when first testing Connex: "Cristi, your second SMPS2000R is just WOOOW, driving both channels. This is the one packed with Rubycons on primary and secondary side, set to +/-63 V, no hum, dead quiet silence, rock stable imaging, resolution is at the top notch, no sign of sibilants on vocals, liquid like sound, bass is simply awsome, like a day and night different from first one tried, also much better than SMPS1200. ")
I'm very interested if you could reach a more general conclusion, regulated VS non regulated, single stereo VS two mono blocs.
BTW, did the First ones used for this test were all burned out the same and enough ?
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I hope you mean "burned in" here
Very surprised here as well on this new conclusion ! Please explain .
Cheers ,
Rens
That just proves how easily one can be fooled on longer past sound impressions. Real AB simultaneous listening tests shows much more objective picture. Consensus over the results among persons present at the test clearly contributes to objectiveness, such as we can confirm here.
So far I can only confirm the unregulated SMPS in dual mono version is a clear winner. Many recent local Hi-Fi shows visitors share the same opinion, as all First One amps had this configuration.
So far I can only confirm the unregulated SMPS in dual mono version is a clear winner. Many recent local Hi-Fi shows visitors share the same opinion, as all First One amps had this configuration.
I can join-you on the regulated Vs unregulated challenge. Did a lot of tries and had this (temporary) feeling (on linear psu). While a simple cap multiplier was the winner against unregulated (same freedom, less noise). An effect of the reaction time of the regulation (feedback loop) ?
For single VS dual, you'll need to can parallel the 2 same supplies to be fair.
Easy to do with linear, not so easy with SMPS.
or, at least, to can compare two 1200W VS single 2400W and the double of out lytics.
(you have a PM ;-)
Ps: Yes, "burned in" (it was half a joke).
For single VS dual, you'll need to can parallel the 2 same supplies to be fair.
Easy to do with linear, not so easy with SMPS.
or, at least, to can compare two 1200W VS single 2400W and the double of out lytics.
(you have a PM ;-)
Ps: Yes, "burned in" (it was half a joke).
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I'm surprised too and questions rumble in head, but wont ask because of respect for already used time consume. Just little more words this post, it's possible for different reasons to setup devices with neutral and hot phase from live power turned around by accident and can some times cause a certain huge difference in soundstage. Thanks to LC and team.
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Hi,
Absolute nothing to say, on your test.
just I do not understand well, one.
as you can carry out an assessment, if you have informed me, via PM, the first day received smps, (independant of hot, When push to power), That One DPS-500-DA, has a serious problem on voltage regulation. ( maybe on trasport ,so I not know)
as You wrote: If I adj the trim, the smps switch off with blink
You have not respected my advice via pm, "do not use please", becouse I not know, what kind of problem have, and can be dangerous.
Luckily I have the pm. in case of problems caused to loudspeaker or other devices.
I'm happy that you switch to unregulated at end.
Very small logic-deduction , Appear on my brain, sorry.
One sound well but is full of EMI, other Seem fantastic but produce hot, and I do not want to send you the new couple...
I understand is not simple for you.
Regards
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Hi GB members
As promised few days ago, just before deliveries started, me and two competent audio friends performed First One SMPS's AB testing today.
Three First One amplifiers on the test, each one equipped with different power supply: first with Hypex SMPS1200A400, second with Audio Power DPS-500/63 and third with Connex SMPS2000R.
Variety of music material selection from classical music, blues, rock, to electronic. We picked five diverse tracks for testing.
AB comparison started between two regulated SMPS-s: Connex and Audio Power. It was not really hard to recognize better, since bass was really on a weak side of Connex, probably the reason lies in a single SMPS2000R for both amp's channels, nevertheless the soundstage was narrow, instruments weakly presented, thin bodies, no real feeling of involvement into the music. DPS-500/63 were in dual mono configuration, meaning one per channel. Transparancy and details resolution was very similar but the bass was one step ahead over the Connex. Still no real musical involvement presentation here, sound more or less sticked to the speakers, instruments with weak bodies, sounstage not well formed. From both regulated SMPS we got an impression that the problem lies in voltage regulation principle, too much interfering in audio signal is probably the worst thing it could happen from amp's power supply.
After half an hour of mental pause, test continued between Hypex SMPS1200A400 and Audio Power DSP-500/63. First we listened to DPS-500/63, musical impression stayed very much the same as it was in the first session. Weak presentation left us more or less cold, music is simply too thin, uninvolving.
Hypex's turn then settled the things where they should belong, suddenly real music in the room. It was imediately clear to all of us who's having magic stick in its sleeve. SMPS1200A400 shocked us with music so real that others two seemed like that there was something broken in them. Hypex presented bass so low and strong that our jaws just dropped for a while, dense wall of air moved with lowest possible frequencies we could still hear, still with ease. Soundstage completely another story from previous contenders, no speakers in the room only musicians and instruments, this time with fully developed bodies, atmosphere of a recording stage, whether real or artificial, presented in full scale. SMPS1200A400 puts the First One amplifier in the first league of power amplifiers no matter the price level.
My suggestion to all GB members would be, of course if you want to get the most out of the First One amplifier, buy Hypex SMPS1200A400 power supply, normally one SMPS per First One module.
Have fun building the First One amplifiers.
What about the SMPS3kA400 from Hypex for two channels?
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http://www.hypex.nl/docs/SMPS1200_datasheet.pdf
See revision history at end.
reg. page 61 jumping? works ok here with google chrome, maybe clearing browser history solves problem??
Explanation in my next post.
Now as we pick the winner, next weekend we'll test SMPS1200A400 single vs. dual.
I know the effect of mains phase reversal, it is nowhere near of the soundstage differences we noticed by different SMPS. Also weaker bass presentation was so obvious from both regulated SMPS that mains phase reversal couldn't affect it in such degree.
Agreed.
It is completely regular V7 version from 2014 production, ordering one will bring you exactly the same SMPS1200A400 unit as on picture.
In your's profile setting put to show 50 posts per page, works normally.
Next weekend we'll test single vs. dual SMPS1200A400. Results will definitely help you to decide whether to buy SMPS3kA400.
Thanks.
Just to the datasheet that you put,and my sympathy for you.
It starts with the description as:
The smps1200 is optimezed from the first phase of design to final implementation to realize the lowest possible EMI signature required of the most demanding Audio application.
well, It's ready a version for Audio then?
Logo "CE" correct for sure, is everything else, that is not correct, incluse the "class 2", safety pcb develop and "CE" in real fact applied.
W... the transparency.
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Just to make the things clear, and without any ulterior motives (i'm not at all a blind ABX fanatic) can-you precise, L.C. the exact conditions where your listening comparison session was done ?
Was-it blind ?
Did the amplifiers+SMPS were broken-in and how long ? (Sometimes, it takes several days for lytics to show their best).
Did the speakers plugged the same way (phase).
Did-you tried the two AC phases combinations for each amp ?
Did-you had concordant results of all the participating people ?
Were the sound differences between each SMPS very easy to discriminate from each other's ?
How long were each music samples and time between commutation between two amps ?
Did-you made several sessions, each with a different enclosures pair and witch ones ?
I'm sorry to bore-you with those questions, Andrej, -feel free to ignore them- just this subject passionate-me and i try to can correlate personal thoughts.
I don't know about the other participants, but i'm sure of one thing: you know what and how to listen ;-)
Was-it blind ?
Did the amplifiers+SMPS were broken-in and how long ? (Sometimes, it takes several days for lytics to show their best).
Did the speakers plugged the same way (phase).
Did-you tried the two AC phases combinations for each amp ?
Did-you had concordant results of all the participating people ?
Were the sound differences between each SMPS very easy to discriminate from each other's ?
How long were each music samples and time between commutation between two amps ?
Did-you made several sessions, each with a different enclosures pair and witch ones ?
I'm sorry to bore-you with those questions, Andrej, -feel free to ignore them- just this subject passionate-me and i try to can correlate personal thoughts.
I don't know about the other participants, but i'm sure of one thing: you know what and how to listen ;-)
To Esperado:
We have another type of problem, and places you stupid questions?
How you can make a "abx" test with a smps broken, right in the section, "regulator", which is "everything" in the DPS-500? also considered, which has very small capacitors.?
what is the answer to the missing measure, on the one that works perfectly, even if we know the heat problem?
Do you think that these questions are just me ask you?
My interest is out of the question for sale. but we can not accept this absurd way.
The result is not valid, please, explain it to LC, do not seem to fully understand my English.
To Irribeo:
For sure, this is not my way, right just my response to your "cip...cip..." on my thread. seem that you know well the "graphics" CE logo, but not what it is.
-------
To LC:
I'm out of competition, not to mention the "DPS-500" in this thread.
and...with "chickens" is easy to do business, convinces me, what should I use smps. certainly, not with words,if you are able.
We have another type of problem, and places you stupid questions?
How you can make a "abx" test with a smps broken, right in the section, "regulator", which is "everything" in the DPS-500? also considered, which has very small capacitors.?
what is the answer to the missing measure, on the one that works perfectly, even if we know the heat problem?
Do you think that these questions are just me ask you?
My interest is out of the question for sale. but we can not accept this absurd way.
The result is not valid, please, explain it to LC, do not seem to fully understand my English.
To Irribeo:
For sure, this is not my way, right just my response to your "cip...cip..." on my thread. seem that you know well the "graphics" CE logo, but not what it is.
-------
To LC:
I'm out of competition, not to mention the "DPS-500" in this thread.
and...with "chickens" is easy to do business, convinces me, what should I use smps. certainly, not with words,if you are able.
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Payment just sent for 2 modules