A little question of opinion for the more experienced guys. I designed a compound horn for the Hivi B3N. As it sits the bass is flat down to only about 100hz, but it's pretty small so that isn't so bad. But the pass band of the rear horn models so sensitive that I doubt even a front horn could bring the mids and treble up to match. Now the bass has plenty of excursion left so that max spl is decent down to 55-60hz. My question is this: If I filter the frequencies between about 80hz and 400hz and bring them down to the level of everything else, would this sound good or would a filter have a big negitive effect on the dynamics and speed of the horn design?
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Hello brsanko,
did you listen without front horn?
Your horn throat sims very small?
Is the horn mouth bifurcated?
Better no filter, there is a lot of music,
Kammerton a = 440 Hz,
if you get this SPL why kill it with expensive parts,
may be no front horn helps enough.
nice design,
i made a small bookshelf sat horn for such driver,
i listen to it already with my sub double bass horn,
my experience shows that no bass for such single driver
is better in every way, movement goes down and mids and highs are better.
did you listen without front horn?
Your horn throat sims very small?
Is the horn mouth bifurcated?
Better no filter, there is a lot of music,
Kammerton a = 440 Hz,
if you get this SPL why kill it with expensive parts,
may be no front horn helps enough.
nice design,
i made a small bookshelf sat horn for such driver,
i listen to it already with my sub double bass horn,
my experience shows that no bass for such single driver
is better in every way, movement goes down and mids and highs are better.
I haven't actually built the speaker but I was looking for a design that was small enough for resale without a sub so bass is important. As for the front horn the 100-250hz region would be about 12db louder than everthing above it without it. At least according to the simulation, and they have proven pretty accurate in the builds I've done so far. For my own personal use I would avoid using filters perhaps using an EQ, but for a commercially viable design flat frequency response is pretty important I think. I'm just wondering what the negative affects of a filter would be. and yes it would be pretty expensive for the parts.
actually I've come up wit a better design that gives lower bass without a filter in a similar sized cab so I guess the point is moot.
Hmm. 'I was looking for a design that was small enough for resale' is not a phrase that exactly thrills me.
Don't get me wrong -I have nothing against a bit of capitalism, or small companies for that matter. Quite the reverse in fact. But when somebody comes onto a DIY forum, and asks for help / advice / information, one assumes it's for a DIY project. Where I for one, start to have a problem, is when somebody uses the forum to advertise commercial products, or, even worse, pump people for data they can / will potentially make money from. Assuming I'm not reading something into the above statement that isn't there, which does not appear to be the case, if you are considering selling examples of cabinets, exactly what is in it for us to assist you / advise you in any way with the designs? Are you going to pay us for our consulting time?
Don't get me wrong -I have nothing against a bit of capitalism, or small companies for that matter. Quite the reverse in fact. But when somebody comes onto a DIY forum, and asks for help / advice / information, one assumes it's for a DIY project. Where I for one, start to have a problem, is when somebody uses the forum to advertise commercial products, or, even worse, pump people for data they can / will potentially make money from. Assuming I'm not reading something into the above statement that isn't there, which does not appear to be the case, if you are considering selling examples of cabinets, exactly what is in it for us to assist you / advise you in any way with the designs? Are you going to pay us for our consulting time?
If you gotta ask for design help at a diy forum, the likelihood of successful commercialization is small. So I wouldn't get too bent out of shape about it. Is anyone making any real money off of niche audio these days?
A handful are / do, but I take your point mate -if people don't know the basics, it's a bit of a joke to think they can sell stuff successfully. That said, to my mind, the commercial aspect should still be clearly stated from the off -I for one don't like being made use of. 
Anyway, subject closed as far as I'm concerned. I shall simply add brsanko to my ignore list.
Anyway, subject closed as far as I'm concerned. I shall simply add brsanko to my ignore list.
What's in it for you to help me if I'm not going to sell it. Sounds to me like you ARE against somebody making a living out of something the love. I live in a $4000 mobile home and made a grand total of $300 last month. If you think I'm a greedy jerk because I found someting I enjoy and would like to make a few dollars at it you've obviously got your thinking off skew somewhere. If you're truely passionate about something you'd think you'd love to see it get as much exposure as possible. I hear people complaining that no one is interested in real hifi anymore, but that's only because they've never heard it, or don't know it exists. I would think making it a commercial venture would make people more excited about it. If I think your knowledge is helpful I just may pay you a consulting fee. Why am I a bad guy because I'd like to earn a living off of what I do so I'm not takng your tax dollars living off of disability. I can't work a normal job and I don't have the resources for an education. And besides really where else is this information available? Nowhere, that's where. If I was just after a quick buck I'd throw together some ported boxes and sell them to the next sucker to come along. I really love this stuff and want to share it with others. When you don't have money to throw around the only way to afford this hobby is to try to make a some money at it. Besides the more people that do this stuff the more resources that are available to everyone else. I'm not just here taking from everyone I'm sharing my knowledge with others as well. I don't see anyone compaining when Nelson Pass posts on here. You can't tell me he's not making a buck. I'm for the same reason as everyone else to share knowledge. I have alot of knowledge to share as well. I'm just not to dogmatic about my opinions because most of my knowledge is theoretical. When I invest money to build a pair of speakers it means I don't get to fix my car for another month, so I can make something of all this knowledge I've gained. And your starting to sound a little selfrightous there implying that I don't know the basics because I'm not quite sure of some of the finer points of horn design. I like to try to keep a humble attitude on the forums here because there are a lot of very knowledgable people here, but I have been studying loudspeaker design for going on 10 years now and I'm not exactly a novice when it comes to understanding concepts. I've just noticed that when ever I have an opinion that differs from someone elses or ask for view point questions everyone seems to clam up and get snooty. I can see that the moderators the forum don't have a problem with people selling there projects there is a special section just for that. I'm not asking anyone to design my speakers for me I just like to hear different opinions of people who've tried different things I'm not sure what your getting all bent out of shape for.
SY said:
So your saying that learning from other's experience and asking opinions means that your ignorant and stupid? I for one am convince that many of the people on this forum have far more knowledge than many a successful manucturer. otherwise why would there be so much crap on the market.
Besides I wasn't really thinking about "making real money" just maybe enough to support further projects.
Do you make a habbit of insulting people you've never met? My question was merely to solicit an opinion. I am well aware of the workings of filters and the fact that 99.999% of speakers on the market have filter circuits. I simply wanted an opinion of those who had extensive experience with horn designs. I have already designed and built several sets of speakers that have far superior sound quality than anything comercially available within 150 miles of where I live. I also work with a professional custom cabinet shop capable of quickly producing finished products far superior to 80% of the amature stuff seen on this site. I'm not trying to knock anybody else down here I will praise anyone who tries. I just don't understand why everyone here has such fragile egos that they have to start insulting people when they ask questions. I'm not sure what your basing your ridiculous insults on but I just made an agreement with a retailer today. So get off your high horse and start showing the spirit of comradship these forums are suposed to be about. You should be ashamed of yourself.
Sorry if I'm being a bit overdefensive here. I'm off my depression meds and I'm exibiting my persecusion complex. I'll try to calm down now.
Nice site Bob. Your cabinets look really nice! I'm gonna try setting some up at some record stores. I figure it's the best place to find audiophiles in small towns(Duluth/Superior area).
Bob Brines said:
NO!?
Bob
I know a high-end custom installer that makes good money. He has a storefront in a high rent area, and is a dealer for some well known upscale brands. He get both a nice markup on hardware and is paid well to install it. A typical job includes custom cabinetry.
He's not a builder of equipment, obviously. But this area is the one place people are making money in audio, as far as I know.
As long as knowledge is being shared i encorage you.
It is really hard to make a real living. Your income is on par with mine (and if it wasn't for my other jobs would be less), and i'll been slogging at this for 8 years. But it is a whole lot more satisfying than sitting behind other people's computers making them work (that still brings in some $$$)
dave
It is really hard to make a real living. Your income is on par with mine (and if it wasn't for my other jobs would be less), and i'll been slogging at this for 8 years. But it is a whole lot more satisfying than sitting behind other people's computers making them work (that still brings in some $$$)
dave
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