Wow I doubt I'd ever be picky enough to look for all the things you mentioned, but it's still very cool that you've researched it so thoroughly. Me, I'm all about one thing: Get rid of whatever it is that hurts my ears without losing speed and resolution.
If that can be accomplished, then all the rest is icing. 😀
If that can be accomplished, then all the rest is icing. 😀
Since there is a thread going on EnABL how-to, I'm bringing this question in here to avoid confusion at one point.
I made a setup of small speakers from Pioneer. I cobbled together an
A/B switch which I can use from the sitting position. One has an EnABL ring and a bit of dustcap treatment and the other is stock-- Zee Row treatments of anything.
More listening to do and my EnABL technique is poor at this point.
But the EnABL one in this setup is not giving any revelations so far as an obviously notable effect.
The Pioneers are spec'ed at 15k rather than 20K Hz. Is this a limitation for the dynamics of the EnABL job?
Does the Puzzlecoat/Modpodge do more than seal the cone for the application? Have there been more results with just the dots?
I'm doing all this before I move on to my FE127es which are well-seasoned.
I made a setup of small speakers from Pioneer. I cobbled together an
A/B switch which I can use from the sitting position. One has an EnABL ring and a bit of dustcap treatment and the other is stock-- Zee Row treatments of anything.
More listening to do and my EnABL technique is poor at this point.
But the EnABL one in this setup is not giving any revelations so far as an obviously notable effect.
The Pioneers are spec'ed at 15k rather than 20K Hz. Is this a limitation for the dynamics of the EnABL job?
Does the Puzzlecoat/Modpodge do more than seal the cone for the application? Have there been more results with just the dots?
I'm doing all this before I move on to my FE127es which are well-seasoned.
Do not be alarmed with the lack of much difference.
I am going to assume that you have both drivers pointed right at you, when you switch. The on axis response is the best sound an untreated driver can provide and except for removing a slight "hot spot" tendency, with the EnABL patterns, there will not be much difference between the two. Better to stand the boxes on their back sides and listen to both from about 45 to 60 degrees off of the then vertical axis. See if you notice anything different about the presentation of instruments in 3D space from this.
This is about all of the obvious change you will get from an outer ring and a center of voice coil cover ring set. That outer ring does usually provide a lateral dispersal of higher frequencies and you should notice this as your ears reach a height that is roughly tangent to the angle of the cone surface.
Dave, who has as much time spent on improving drivers as I do, took many hours of listening before he comprehended the changes. They are not a "better" sound, just more complete and that is not a particularly obvious event. Especially since you are reteaching your expectation threshold, in your threat assessment system and not a lot of people are even aware they have one of those.
Bud
I am going to assume that you have both drivers pointed right at you, when you switch. The on axis response is the best sound an untreated driver can provide and except for removing a slight "hot spot" tendency, with the EnABL patterns, there will not be much difference between the two. Better to stand the boxes on their back sides and listen to both from about 45 to 60 degrees off of the then vertical axis. See if you notice anything different about the presentation of instruments in 3D space from this.
This is about all of the obvious change you will get from an outer ring and a center of voice coil cover ring set. That outer ring does usually provide a lateral dispersal of higher frequencies and you should notice this as your ears reach a height that is roughly tangent to the angle of the cone surface.
Dave, who has as much time spent on improving drivers as I do, took many hours of listening before he comprehended the changes. They are not a "better" sound, just more complete and that is not a particularly obvious event. Especially since you are reteaching your expectation threshold, in your threat assessment system and not a lot of people are even aware they have one of those.
Bud
BudP said:
But now, having lived with them for a couple years, drivers without (Mark Audio Alpair 10 at the moment) seem lacking...
dave
Ok, no hijack intended. I'm doing the EnABL for the experience of getting the work flow and documenting that process.
planet10 said:
some drivers however, may have issues that EnABL or any noble tweak can't sufficiently remedy
FE167E off axis performance
Hi,
It might be sightly off, but interested in FE167E off-axis performance. Other 6.5" full range driver off-axis plots are welcomed as well.
Hi,
It might be sightly off, but interested in FE167E off-axis performance. Other 6.5" full range driver off-axis plots are welcomed as well.
Hi perempe20,
FE167E off-axis is plotted on the factory specs, although it's not too legible. Under the frequency response curve, there are at least two lines consisting of dots / dashes. These are the off-axis curves (not sure what degrees).
The response of this driver looks pretty flat on-axis (i.e., no need to listen off-axis). Is there a particular reason you are interested in the off-axis response?
EDIT: Factory specs: http://fostexinternational.com/docs/speaker_comp/FEAV-Series.shtml
FE167E off-axis is plotted on the factory specs, although it's not too legible. Under the frequency response curve, there are at least two lines consisting of dots / dashes. These are the off-axis curves (not sure what degrees).
The response of this driver looks pretty flat on-axis (i.e., no need to listen off-axis). Is there a particular reason you are interested in the off-axis response?
EDIT: Factory specs: http://fostexinternational.com/docs/speaker_comp/FEAV-Series.shtml
Thanks for the answer, rjbond3rd. I tried Fountek FW168 as a full ranger (without appropriate notch filter), but off axis was very bad. With a tweeter (27tbfc/g) it works very well.
Other 6.5" full range drivers have similar off axis performance?
Other 6.5" full range drivers have similar off axis performance?
Hi perempe20, every driver is different. But in general, a full-ranger will have much more treble (on and off-axis) than the FW168 (midbass).
Dave, can you say how the off-axis response of the FE167eN differs from the FE167E?
Let's not forget that Fostex factory specs have generally been considered "optimistic" - in other words meaningful comparative measures would need to be made of both stock and modded drivers at the same time.
rjbond3rd said:
Nope, And i'm keeping my hunches to myself.
The rest of much better measuring kit is in transit... once we get rolling we may well go on a measure frenzy.
dave
Bob Brines said:
I already have FuzzMeasure & a Beringer Mic. An Edirol FA66 just cleared customs. The S&L stuff only works under Windows (and i'm not into sadism)
dave
Ok I checked out the Alison track. It's incredible. Unfortunately, I only have a low quality youtube copy. I'm scared to think of what this could sound like...
Dave,
you mentioned (07-20):
"I might well have to start thinning it a bit more"
When might you have time to experiment; possibly and/ or with more widely spaced dots??
you mentioned (07-20):
"I might well have to start thinning it a bit more"
When might you have time to experiment; possibly and/ or with more widely spaced dots??
Great looking speakers. Fostex are great. Im new to this forum but it sounds like Bobs a veteran...
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