This thread split off from here http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=114948
Here're opinions of some expert DIYers over at PE Tech Board:
http://www.pesupport.com/cgi-bin/config.pl?read=393330
Particularly, I'd listen to dlr (Dave L Ralph). He has done quite a few speaker driver mods. It appears that there is no objective measurement of the real effect yet.
If you're going to use these speakers on a computer desk, close to walls, or in some similar situation that causes a significant boundary gain, you'll need a bit less baffle step compensation. Concerning this, take a look at my page:
http://www.geocities.com/woove99/Spkrbldg/ER18RNX_2Way.htm
drproton said:
Here're opinions of some expert DIYers over at PE Tech Board:
http://www.pesupport.com/cgi-bin/config.pl?read=393330
Particularly, I'd listen to dlr (Dave L Ralph). He has done quite a few speaker driver mods. It appears that there is no objective measurement of the real effect yet.
If you're going to use these speakers on a computer desk, close to walls, or in some similar situation that causes a significant boundary gain, you'll need a bit less baffle step compensation. Concerning this, take a look at my page:
http://www.geocities.com/woove99/Spkrbldg/ER18RNX_2Way.htm
planet10 said:
Achieve anything in what ways? I wholeheartedly agree with dlr in saying:
"The problem here is that any kind of valid tests need to be run on the same driver before, then after any mods. That's the one and only way to quantify the changes."
"If the FR doesn't show much change if any at all then it is likely in the area of altering the distortion characteristics. Still measurable."
And I remember you used this "some 30+ years" talk somewhere else before. You still do this? Please... This doesn't tell anything. I'd believe in good measurements and logical conclusions provided by a person with one year experience rather than subjective evaluation given by one with 50+ yrs experience. Experience alone doesn't much tell why people with experience of some 30+ years can still have different opinions. AFAIK, people who joined the discussion at PE have also spent quite a few years in speaker building and tweaking.
Re: First pair of DIY speakers
Hi Jay,
You are wasting your breath. Enabl has reached cult status among the faithful and they won't be swayed.
Amusing to follow though.
Hi,
This is not a kit, but a very nice speaker to build. Not complicated either.
It's a Seas coax driver that's $150.00 at Solen. Crossover as detailed by Tony is very simple to construct and not at all expensive. The box is also easy to build.
You can expect great performance from this one.
Hi Jay,
You are wasting your breath. Enabl has reached cult status among the faithful and they won't be swayed.
Amusing to follow though.
drproton said:
Hi,
This is not a kit, but a very nice speaker to build. Not complicated either.
It's a Seas coax driver that's $150.00 at Solen. Crossover as detailed by Tony is very simple to construct and not at all expensive. The box is also easy to build.
You can expect great performance from this one.
Re: Re: Re: First pair of DIY speakers
In a way John is right... but i think the analogy is more akin to people who had experienced colour TV in the day when most people had black & white TVs.
I have said enuff... any on-going discussion should be restricted to the EnABL threads, drproton now knows of its existance and he can look at it at his own discretion.
I started out simply described an event that had direct relevance to his question.
dave
Jay_WJ said:Don't worry. That's not what I attempt. I'm not concerned at all with those who've already become the faithful
In a way John is right... but i think the analogy is more akin to people who had experienced colour TV in the day when most people had black & white TVs.
I have said enuff... any on-going discussion should be restricted to the EnABL threads, drproton now knows of its existance and he can look at it at his own discretion.
I started out simply described an event that had direct relevance to his question.
dave
Re: Re: Re: First pair of DIY speakers
Months ago I got into that thread asking those same questions, stirring up the same stink and made no difference. Of course, it was just me at the time.
The sheep are going to follow the shepherd anyway.
Jay_WJ said:
Don't worry. That's not what I attempt. I'm not concerned at all with those who've already become the faithful
Months ago I got into that thread asking those same questions, stirring up the same stink and made no difference. Of course, it was just me at the time.
The sheep are going to follow the shepherd anyway.
Re: Re: Re: Re: First pair of DIY speakers
I really hate to nitpick but I want to ask. Are you serious? You really want to compare this auditory perception (not just auditory, but very subtle perception) to color vs b/w perception? This isn't analogy at all!
I agree that this isn't a right thread to talk about it. But there isn't anything more to say than I did above.
planet10 said:
I really hate to nitpick but I want to ask. Are you serious? You really want to compare this auditory perception (not just auditory, but very subtle perception) to color vs b/w perception? This isn't analogy at all!
I agree that this isn't a right thread to talk about it. But there isn't anything more to say than I did above.
Dave,
You will probably remove this post and ban me, but this absoultely reeks of conflict of interest. You are a moderator shilling a product that you have for sale (Yes, I saw the price of your drivers prior to your edit, which does not show up probably because you are a mod). What happened to global moderation here?
This is ridiculous.
Cheers to my last post,
AJ
You will probably remove this post and ban me, but this absoultely reeks of conflict of interest. You are a moderator shilling a product that you have for sale (Yes, I saw the price of your drivers prior to your edit, which does not show up probably because you are a mod). What happened to global moderation here?
This is ridiculous.
Cheers to my last post,
AJ
Conflicts.. soon to be banned
It is curious how certain members of privilege seem to get away with inuendo if not outright violations of board policies that other non-privileged members are chastized/banned/castigated for...
But then, compensation for all the work done needs to be addressed, eh?
It is curious how certain members of privilege seem to get away with inuendo if not outright violations of board policies that other non-privileged members are chastized/banned/castigated for...
But then, compensation for all the work done needs to be addressed, eh?
John, as policy, moderators do NOT edit member's posts except by request and to remove profanity, links to Bad Stuff, and the like. Post can and do get moved when threads are split, so my guess is that it's just hanging out elsewhere.
(NB: We sometimes do trash posts which are patently offensive, which I sincerely doubt yours was, but never, never, ever edit posts to change their content except as above. I did that once, as a new moderator, and was slapped around pretty thoroughly for doing so)
Hi,
FWIW I'm extremely bored with the lack of science applied to "EnABL".
The original article is a complete travesty of rational methodology and
is in its entirety complete BS. The guy has no idea what he is talking
about and completely no understanding of what is going on.
Note that for a patent the only thing you patent is how you do it.
Whether is does what you say it does, or works the way you claim,
is completely irrelevant and ignored in the patent application.
Which is why some BS's love quoting their patent as though its fact ........
Note that I am not saying the process does not work or do something
useful. What I am saying is the adherents have no idea of the real
issues involved, how to optimise the process for a particular driver
or predict under what circumstances it is a complete waste of time.
What one can say is the worse the driver the more likely it is to
improve it and for full range drivers it is likely to make them better.
The more fanciful claims of ubiquitous perfection of any driver,
(rapidly contradicted), elimination of cabinet diffraction effects
and such like are exactly that, fantasy.
I don't mind it too much if it sticks to the FR forum, cannot do that
much harm and most of the time will do some good, or is suggested
for messing about with cheaper paper drivers used in speakers
with minimal crossovers.
But if some zealots start suggesting its applicable to all speakers
regardless of quality or design then I'm going to get stroppy.
Sadly the main problem with "EnABL" is its deluded originator.
Rationalisation of the process, what it actually does and why, and
therefore under what circumstances would it be useful and to what
extent it should be applied is sadly not on the cards .....
/sreten.
FWIW I'm extremely bored with the lack of science applied to "EnABL".
The original article is a complete travesty of rational methodology and
is in its entirety complete BS. The guy has no idea what he is talking
about and completely no understanding of what is going on.
Note that for a patent the only thing you patent is how you do it.
Whether is does what you say it does, or works the way you claim,
is completely irrelevant and ignored in the patent application.
Which is why some BS's love quoting their patent as though its fact ........
Note that I am not saying the process does not work or do something
useful. What I am saying is the adherents have no idea of the real
issues involved, how to optimise the process for a particular driver
or predict under what circumstances it is a complete waste of time.
What one can say is the worse the driver the more likely it is to
improve it and for full range drivers it is likely to make them better.
The more fanciful claims of ubiquitous perfection of any driver,
(rapidly contradicted), elimination of cabinet diffraction effects
and such like are exactly that, fantasy.
I don't mind it too much if it sticks to the FR forum, cannot do that
much harm and most of the time will do some good, or is suggested
for messing about with cheaper paper drivers used in speakers
with minimal crossovers.
But if some zealots start suggesting its applicable to all speakers
regardless of quality or design then I'm going to get stroppy.
Sadly the main problem with "EnABL" is its deluded originator.
Rationalisation of the process, what it actually does and why, and
therefore under what circumstances would it be useful and to what
extent it should be applied is sadly not on the cards .....
/sreten.- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.