BudP said:
Its plastic. The most similar material that I expect you to have come across is a drum skin(plastic variety of course). Nothing exotic about it is apparent.
The material used at the edges is a dense type of foam, you can press a finger nail into it and it takes about a minute for the shape to snap back.
Thanks for the suggestions. I'll get a photo and let you cast your eye over it.
Hi Bud - G'day Shin! (Ya know - I lived in Ipswich for a while as a kid - loved it!) 😎
I'm in a bit of a predicament in terms of thinking clearly at present as my physician has had me under the influence of prescription medications for the past week. He seems to believe that pain management is an important aspect of recovering from a five-way heart by-pass operation. I understand that he seemed taken back a bit when I asked him how things went while installing my five-way crossover! My Nurse told me that I made that comment when being shown the wires to the temporary pacemakers sticking out of my chest. BTW - wanna guess the name of the good Doctor that performed my 5-way-xover-by-pass operation? Dr. Pass (Lawrence)
I'm recovering marvelously and am now up and about - thank you. I am weaning myself off the pain meds before they become a bother - although I did find that they helped me with my dear sister-in-laws visit this afternoon. Hmmm - I might be tempted to "stash" a few for future use in that case. BTW - as a bit of a well intended warning - my cholesterol level was only 177 and my blood pressure is 120 /80 and I have the lungs of a 30 year old (says my doc) - it was genetics that got me tossed into the OR - So just a friendly word - get your annual check-up!
Therefore, if you wish the more technical answers regarding Mamboni treatments they will be a couple of days in coming. On the other hand, if you wish for some of the more creative and "fresh" answers ------- feel free to fire away!
I'm in a bit of a predicament in terms of thinking clearly at present as my physician has had me under the influence of prescription medications for the past week. He seems to believe that pain management is an important aspect of recovering from a five-way heart by-pass operation. I understand that he seemed taken back a bit when I asked him how things went while installing my five-way crossover! My Nurse told me that I made that comment when being shown the wires to the temporary pacemakers sticking out of my chest. BTW - wanna guess the name of the good Doctor that performed my 5-way-xover-by-pass operation? Dr. Pass (Lawrence)
I'm recovering marvelously and am now up and about - thank you. I am weaning myself off the pain meds before they become a bother - although I did find that they helped me with my dear sister-in-laws visit this afternoon. Hmmm - I might be tempted to "stash" a few for future use in that case. BTW - as a bit of a well intended warning - my cholesterol level was only 177 and my blood pressure is 120 /80 and I have the lungs of a 30 year old (says my doc) - it was genetics that got me tossed into the OR - So just a friendly word - get your annual check-up!
Therefore, if you wish the more technical answers regarding Mamboni treatments they will be a couple of days in coming. On the other hand, if you wish for some of the more creative and "fresh" answers ------- feel free to fire away!
The end result it the same. Interesting that it looks very similar to the Mamboni treatment.ShinOBIWAN said:
Hi thomas
I'm glad that they didn't replace your sence of humour 🙂
Maybe in the future you should expand the tinfoil coverage to your chest as well. Some people beleive that crossovers should be shielded you know 😉
I hope you get better soon 🙂
Klaus
I'm glad that they didn't replace your sence of humour 🙂
Maybe in the future you should expand the tinfoil coverage to your chest as well. Some people beleive that crossovers should be shielded you know 😉
I hope you get better soon 🙂
Klaus
C2C,
As always, you provide us with information, tin coverings and hope. Do get well and back to your pursuit of happiness, quickly please.
Thanks for sharing with us.
Bud
As always, you provide us with information, tin coverings and hope. Do get well and back to your pursuit of happiness, quickly please.
Thanks for sharing with us.
Bud
Thomas,
All the very best and a speedy recovery. Before long you and "Dancing with Dachshund" will both be dancing along to Abba.🙂
Cilla
All the very best and a speedy recovery. Before long you and "Dancing with Dachshund" will both be dancing along to Abba.🙂
Cilla
Klaus - Shin - BudP -pdan - all,
Thank you so very much for your kind words and thoughts - I do sincerely appreciate them all. If others wish to forward their wishes - nice speakers - amps - precious stones - etc. please feel free to contact me via PM. It has not been my intention to hi-jack BudP's thread epically when it appears to be getting ready to go around the block again for about the fifth time. (Where did we leave the "electron pools" hanging around at anyway?)
I love this hobby and I love the music it allows me to listen to at such high levels of performance. The fact that I can actually hear some of the best performances and performers in the world "live" (or in the studio) and then compare the concert to my personal recordings is fantastic. To sit behind a board and listen to someone "get it right", to see someone "in the zone", - to "nail it", damn - that is beauty - that is art - that is creating. I find that it is a wonderful privilege to see the artist set free to shower us with their talents and gifts. I've played with the meters, and scopes, and "effects" - the "pro gear" till the early hours of the morning. But I still can't measure passion, or love, or endless hours (years - decades?) of devotion to practice that results in just the right stroke - or tone - or inflection - being played at just the precise moment.
This is my hobby - I do it for the enjoyment of it - for the love of it. I like this particular hobby of audio recording and reproduction because it does have some complex technical issues that challenge that particular part of my brain. Sometimes it (this hobby - this friend) allows me to sense so far into the skill, talent, and emotion, of a performance that it shows me why it is vital that humans take the time to drink in the beautiful times and toils of life. For me this hobby is more like sampling good food, drink, and friendship. To comment on the merits (or not) of a friends $20 Chardonnay that they found at a little winery in (you fill in the blank_____) and realize that it is not a $4000 bottle of wine. My speakers are not $4000 speakers. But we can sit around and share some bread and wine and music - and comment on their merits - and walk away as friends that have grown a little closer together.
For me - this is what this hobby is about - Cheers.
Pain Meds - or not? Hmmmm - only I really know for sure
Thank you so very much for your kind words and thoughts - I do sincerely appreciate them all. If others wish to forward their wishes - nice speakers - amps - precious stones - etc. please feel free to contact me via PM. It has not been my intention to hi-jack BudP's thread epically when it appears to be getting ready to go around the block again for about the fifth time. (Where did we leave the "electron pools" hanging around at anyway?)
I love this hobby and I love the music it allows me to listen to at such high levels of performance. The fact that I can actually hear some of the best performances and performers in the world "live" (or in the studio) and then compare the concert to my personal recordings is fantastic. To sit behind a board and listen to someone "get it right", to see someone "in the zone", - to "nail it", damn - that is beauty - that is art - that is creating. I find that it is a wonderful privilege to see the artist set free to shower us with their talents and gifts. I've played with the meters, and scopes, and "effects" - the "pro gear" till the early hours of the morning. But I still can't measure passion, or love, or endless hours (years - decades?) of devotion to practice that results in just the right stroke - or tone - or inflection - being played at just the precise moment.
This is my hobby - I do it for the enjoyment of it - for the love of it. I like this particular hobby of audio recording and reproduction because it does have some complex technical issues that challenge that particular part of my brain. Sometimes it (this hobby - this friend) allows me to sense so far into the skill, talent, and emotion, of a performance that it shows me why it is vital that humans take the time to drink in the beautiful times and toils of life. For me this hobby is more like sampling good food, drink, and friendship. To comment on the merits (or not) of a friends $20 Chardonnay that they found at a little winery in (you fill in the blank_____) and realize that it is not a $4000 bottle of wine. My speakers are not $4000 speakers. But we can sit around and share some bread and wine and music - and comment on their merits - and walk away as friends that have grown a little closer together.
For me - this is what this hobby is about - Cheers.
Pain Meds - or not? Hmmmm - only I really know for sure
G'day All,
I'm a new member to this forum but am very excited about EnABL!
I wanted to try EnABL but didn't want to use paint on my drivers.
I have been using heavy duty aluminium kitchen foil and double sided tape (not the foam back stuff) to stick EnABL patterns on my drivers (FE167E's) and baffles. AWESOME!!
Yesterday I EnABL'd two PA speakers - just the horns and baffles NOT drivers (still under warranty). The effect was magical - turned them into something sounding more like hifi than PA. Can't wait to fire them up at full volume on the weekend.
The foil and double sided tape is a FULLY REVERSABLE way to experience the EnABL effect.
I will now be using the paint that Bud recommends from now on.
I do have a couple of questions:
1) Does aluminium foil have similar properties to the paint?
2) How critical is scaling the blocks when you are EnABLing cones?
3) Is there any benefit to EnABLing the INSIDE of a cabinet - maybe along the edges where baffle meets the sides??
4) Could the EnABL pattern be scaled up and used as a room treatment some how?
Cheers,
Alex
I'm a new member to this forum but am very excited about EnABL!
I wanted to try EnABL but didn't want to use paint on my drivers.
I have been using heavy duty aluminium kitchen foil and double sided tape (not the foam back stuff) to stick EnABL patterns on my drivers (FE167E's) and baffles. AWESOME!!
Yesterday I EnABL'd two PA speakers - just the horns and baffles NOT drivers (still under warranty). The effect was magical - turned them into something sounding more like hifi than PA. Can't wait to fire them up at full volume on the weekend.
The foil and double sided tape is a FULLY REVERSABLE way to experience the EnABL effect.
I will now be using the paint that Bud recommends from now on.
I do have a couple of questions:
1) Does aluminium foil have similar properties to the paint?
2) How critical is scaling the blocks when you are EnABLing cones?
3) Is there any benefit to EnABLing the INSIDE of a cabinet - maybe along the edges where baffle meets the sides??
4) Could the EnABL pattern be scaled up and used as a room treatment some how?
Cheers,
Alex
Alex,
A very interesting approach.
I've been happily messing around with masking tape used by home decorators. The tape is low-tack, very fine and translucent. Your success with foil interests me as I fancied to use gold leaf when I'd finalized the pattern.
Would be fascinating to experiment with room treatment. Perhaps a Calder/EnABL type mobile would be effective?
Cilla
A very interesting approach.
I've been happily messing around with masking tape used by home decorators. The tape is low-tack, very fine and translucent. Your success with foil interests me as I fancied to use gold leaf when I'd finalized the pattern.
Would be fascinating to experiment with room treatment. Perhaps a Calder/EnABL type mobile would be effective?
Cilla
They do have recreational benefits that are under-appreciated, nor are they sactioned, but who's keeping score?
Mongo was so moved, he'd like to sing you a lullaby. (...my achy-breaky heart...) This offer may be redeemed in full over a few brews @ the first annual diyNashville.
Heal well and strongly...then kick a$$.
There's nothing to expose. There's nothing happening other than that of added mass. Period.
The mass hysteria is the belief in the unproven, ignoring the fact that since there is proven frequency response alteration, no one can say that there is anything other than FR change causing the change in perception.
I have seen this before, I built some Gainclones years ago when they were just coming into fashion.
The detractors were just as passionate about the GCs as the detractors are in here about EnABL, yet they had never heard one.
dir, please define Proof? I need a set of requirements and the necessary suggested test parameters that is to end this debate.
I am getting close to ending the major questions at work, i just want to prepare my techs and round up the equipment to finalize this question.
Thanks
ron
The mass hysteria
I truly doubt that.
The mass hysteria is the belief in the unproven, ignoring the fact that since there is proven frequency response alteration, no one can say that there is anything other than FR change causing the change in perception.
I have seen this before, I built some Gainclones years ago when they were just coming into fashion.
The detractors were just as passionate about the GCs as the detractors are in here about EnABL, yet they had never heard one.
dir, please define Proof? I need a set of requirements and the necessary suggested test parameters that is to end this debate.
I am getting close to ending the major questions at work, i just want to prepare my techs and round up the equipment to finalize this question.
Thanks
ron
The mass hysteria
I truly doubt that.
Alex from Oz,
You are on untested ground, right now.
We still have not come to any firm decision about just what is most effective for EnABL patterns.
1.) The paint, on a non porous surface, provides about a 0.0015 ridge above that surface and a drastically different mass in comparison to the adjacent boundary layer/diaphragm surface, mix zone. You are also providing these two factors. In a while, there will be cones that just have cone material as the protruding event, with slightly less density than the underlying cone, but still a drastic difference to the adjacent boundary layer. This will be pretty expensive to do, as a restrike cone mandrel for screened slurry cones, and it is on someone else's nickel.
2.) Absolutely critical in block length, less critical in width and appears to not be critical for height, but, no one that I know of has exceeded about 0.070 inch, yet.
3.) Never tried it, but I can see where it would be useful if there are protruding stiffening ribs. An EnABL pattern between a driver and a vertical wall, like they used to put on "book shelf" speaker baffles, does reduce the detrimental sonic effects of that wall to inaudibility. Tallest I have ever worked with was from a pair of AR 3 speakers. If you are going to EnABL both sides of a cone or dome or flat diaphragm driver it may be something ot look into, if damping material is not a possibility or is unwanted.
4.) I scaled it up and used it on a band shell in a concert hall one time. Helped dispersion and clarity for acoustic instruments, especially spoken word or singing, but made no audible difference with amplified instruments. This was a small venue with curved shell depth maximum of about 12 feet, height of 10 feet, and width of 22 feet. The patterns were at the periphery of the shell, on both shell and floor and on the floor adjacent to the floor/shell join. We used 1/16 inch thick door skinning plywood material, mahogany I think, and glued it in place with 3M 77 contact spray adhesive, through a template that we replaced often.
If the tape and foil works, why change? The more experiments carried out with different materials, the better. The only real recipe to follow, pretty closely, is the number of blocks used for a given circumference or it's equivalent length in a straight line. Even there, you can vary a small amount without an audible difference, or vary them more, for good reason.
Bud
You are on untested ground, right now.
We still have not come to any firm decision about just what is most effective for EnABL patterns.
1.) The paint, on a non porous surface, provides about a 0.0015 ridge above that surface and a drastically different mass in comparison to the adjacent boundary layer/diaphragm surface, mix zone. You are also providing these two factors. In a while, there will be cones that just have cone material as the protruding event, with slightly less density than the underlying cone, but still a drastic difference to the adjacent boundary layer. This will be pretty expensive to do, as a restrike cone mandrel for screened slurry cones, and it is on someone else's nickel.
2.) Absolutely critical in block length, less critical in width and appears to not be critical for height, but, no one that I know of has exceeded about 0.070 inch, yet.
3.) Never tried it, but I can see where it would be useful if there are protruding stiffening ribs. An EnABL pattern between a driver and a vertical wall, like they used to put on "book shelf" speaker baffles, does reduce the detrimental sonic effects of that wall to inaudibility. Tallest I have ever worked with was from a pair of AR 3 speakers. If you are going to EnABL both sides of a cone or dome or flat diaphragm driver it may be something ot look into, if damping material is not a possibility or is unwanted.
4.) I scaled it up and used it on a band shell in a concert hall one time. Helped dispersion and clarity for acoustic instruments, especially spoken word or singing, but made no audible difference with amplified instruments. This was a small venue with curved shell depth maximum of about 12 feet, height of 10 feet, and width of 22 feet. The patterns were at the periphery of the shell, on both shell and floor and on the floor adjacent to the floor/shell join. We used 1/16 inch thick door skinning plywood material, mahogany I think, and glued it in place with 3M 77 contact spray adhesive, through a template that we replaced often.
If the tape and foil works, why change? The more experiments carried out with different materials, the better. The only real recipe to follow, pretty closely, is the number of blocks used for a given circumference or it's equivalent length in a straight line. Even there, you can vary a small amount without an audible difference, or vary them more, for good reason.
Bud
The driver tweak web page is up
As I said I'd do, I've added a page of tests of tweaks to a driver that are based on the surround itself with a lot of tests of various configurations of added mass. There's nothing in adding any mass, EnABL mass or other, that is not to be expected in the changes made in the frequency/CSD responses. The best result was a combination of the surround tweak coupled with an unusual placement of "dots".
I haven't updated my main page with a link, but the direct link to it is:
Driver resonant tweaks
I will be testing a similarly sized hard cone driver as well testing the "dots" on the second Celestion/KEF driver without the surround mod to better isolate the effects of the dots alone.
Dave
As I said I'd do, I've added a page of tests of tweaks to a driver that are based on the surround itself with a lot of tests of various configurations of added mass. There's nothing in adding any mass, EnABL mass or other, that is not to be expected in the changes made in the frequency/CSD responses. The best result was a combination of the surround tweak coupled with an unusual placement of "dots".
I haven't updated my main page with a link, but the direct link to it is:
Driver resonant tweaks
I will be testing a similarly sized hard cone driver as well testing the "dots" on the second Celestion/KEF driver without the surround mod to better isolate the effects of the dots alone.
Dave
BudP said:
Oh, please, Bud, please don't go so far off the deep end! This statement and the later ones are so outlandish that I actually can't believe I'm reading it. Restraint is just no longer possible with statements such as these.
Dave
Dave,
All this has been posted before...if you simply can't stand to read it, don't. Just quit the whining, eh? BTW, if it is such drivel, why are you so drawn to this thread?
t
All this has been posted before...if you simply can't stand to read it, don't. Just quit the whining, eh? BTW, if it is such drivel, why are you so drawn to this thread?
t
t-head said:
Why? Because I'm into the DIY aspect and to help others who want to DIY, but the information has to be factual to be truly helpful, not fantasy. Bud is into fantasy at this point. I don't like seeing others mislead, and that's putting it mildly when he goes beyond treating drivers. He cannot show one iota of objective evidence on baffles and horns because it is an impossibility. Period.
Dave
He cannot show one iota of objective evidence on baffles and horns because it is an impossibility.
Plese define what iota of evidence you require? I have been asking this question and had no response.
Please define what you want? Its my job( and i do it very well) to seperate the BS from the actual. So either state what you want , in the form of an actual controlled test, and the parameters of the test or please find another subject to condem.
Thanks
ron
(I have no time to deal with ego)
Plese define what iota of evidence you require? I have been asking this question and had no response.
Please define what you want? Its my job( and i do it very well) to seperate the BS from the actual. So either state what you want , in the form of an actual controlled test, and the parameters of the test or please find another subject to condem.
Thanks
ron
(I have no time to deal with ego)
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