Dear All,
After hours of reading the posts as guest, I decided to post to request your help.
Here my issue : I want to connect a Sony TVset KDL32EX711 to an Arcam rDac. The TVset has only a Toslink digital output, no coax.onboard
The real issue is the distance between the rDac and the TVset : 13 meters (39 inches).
The attenuation is too high along the cable and the DAC is detecting no source. I tested also with another source. This is the same result. I sent back the cable to the manufacturer for testing and polishing, there was no more results as they changed the cable.
After diging into the Toslink specification, I discovered the audio toslink modules are made for 5 meters or 10 meters transmission (TOTX147 & TOTX177 series). The needed cable is 13 meters ahead of that. The others modules from Toshiba have issues either on bandwidth (<15 Mb/s) or wave length (<> 650 nm)
In order to make this working, I would make one "Toslink extender" which allow higher transmission distance. However, I am not that much qualified in electronics.
The main idea is using the couple IF-E98 and IF-D97 from i-fiberoptics.
Those modules allow 75 meters transmission & up to 50 Mbits/s. This should be enough. One 74ACT08 logic gate between the 2 optic modules would clean the signal.
The overall propagation time between the input and output is 12ns + 10 ns + 7 ns. This means a total of 29ns delay in the optic channel. Do you think it will weak the signal and make the music worse ?
Do you think this would work ? Do you have any other idea ?
Thank you for your help
After hours of reading the posts as guest, I decided to post to request your help.
Here my issue : I want to connect a Sony TVset KDL32EX711 to an Arcam rDac. The TVset has only a Toslink digital output, no coax.onboard
The real issue is the distance between the rDac and the TVset : 13 meters (39 inches).
The attenuation is too high along the cable and the DAC is detecting no source. I tested also with another source. This is the same result. I sent back the cable to the manufacturer for testing and polishing, there was no more results as they changed the cable.
After diging into the Toslink specification, I discovered the audio toslink modules are made for 5 meters or 10 meters transmission (TOTX147 & TOTX177 series). The needed cable is 13 meters ahead of that. The others modules from Toshiba have issues either on bandwidth (<15 Mb/s) or wave length (<> 650 nm)
In order to make this working, I would make one "Toslink extender" which allow higher transmission distance. However, I am not that much qualified in electronics.
The main idea is using the couple IF-E98 and IF-D97 from i-fiberoptics.
Those modules allow 75 meters transmission & up to 50 Mbits/s. This should be enough. One 74ACT08 logic gate between the 2 optic modules would clean the signal.
The overall propagation time between the input and output is 12ns + 10 ns + 7 ns. This means a total of 29ns delay in the optic channel. Do you think it will weak the signal and make the music worse ?
Do you think this would work ? Do you have any other idea ?
Thank you for your help
Toslink cable is usually simple high loss plastic. Literally try stuffing a 62/125 multimode glass fiber into the connectors and see what happens! There will be light loss as the sender expects a bigger surface area, but there is no loss in the receiver as all the light that gets in hit it. (I have tried this and measured the results!)
If that works you can find glass toslink cables that should be fine.
If that works you can find glass toslink cables that should be fine.
This cable might be worth checking into. MyCableMart.com
Or perhaps this booster? http://www.mycablemart.com/store/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=2466
Or perhaps this booster? http://www.mycablemart.com/store/cart.php?m=product_detail&p=2466
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To all of you, thank you for reading and helping.
@ Simon7000
I will look deeper tonight about multimode fibers. After a quick look, i noticed the glass fiber toslink available are not long enough (I need 13 meters - 39 feets (not inches as I said ealier)). The true multimode fibers are delivered with not compliant connectors. The closest is the SC one but to big to fit the toslink plug.
@ C2cthomas
I have a 13 meters Viablue one which seems to be equivalent. ViaBlue™ toslink cable | H-Flex | aluminium plugs
My guess is my source has a 5meters capable transmitter. I am then asking too much to it.
The only toslink cable glass fiber multi strand of 15 meters I found is from Audioquest. But this is really overprices (>1650 €/ea)
@ Simon7000
I will look deeper tonight about multimode fibers. After a quick look, i noticed the glass fiber toslink available are not long enough (I need 13 meters - 39 feets (not inches as I said ealier)). The true multimode fibers are delivered with not compliant connectors. The closest is the SC one but to big to fit the toslink plug.
@ C2cthomas
I have a 13 meters Viablue one which seems to be equivalent. ViaBlue™ toslink cable | H-Flex | aluminium plugs
My guess is my source has a 5meters capable transmitter. I am then asking too much to it.
The only toslink cable glass fiber multi strand of 15 meters I found is from Audioquest. But this is really overprices (>1650 €/ea)
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@c2cthomas About the booster, I am not sure that device will enhance the transmission distance as the optic modules used are unknown. That's why I was thinking doing it myself
That repeater looks like just the thing - designed to do exactly what you want. At the price it's worth a try. Or maybe you can find something like this: Convertisseur Toslink optique vers coaxial at la FNAC. It may be able to push the signal thru 10 meters or more of coax. Use a high quality coax and it should be no problem.
Thank you for the reply (and for the effort of the french link)
What I keep in mind from that thread :
- not trying to build my own repeater with the parts described earlier. This may be waste of time
- Changing the cable Viablue with another brand at the same quality may be an waste of money
- Testing a ready to use repeater is almost priceless : it worths the deal (althought not recommanded over 10 meters)
- Testing with a multimode glass fiber 62.5/125 can be a good option at relatively low cost (below 50 EUR)
- Switching from optical to coax is an expensive option as the box + the cable is almost 200 EUR.
I was maybe looking for a too complicated solution. I would try option 3 then 4. Thank you for your help.
Just to get your opinion, the circuit with the i-fiberoptics parts was imagined too simple ?
What I keep in mind from that thread :
- not trying to build my own repeater with the parts described earlier. This may be waste of time
- Changing the cable Viablue with another brand at the same quality may be an waste of money
- Testing a ready to use repeater is almost priceless : it worths the deal (althought not recommanded over 10 meters)
- Testing with a multimode glass fiber 62.5/125 can be a good option at relatively low cost (below 50 EUR)
- Switching from optical to coax is an expensive option as the box + the cable is almost 200 EUR.
I was maybe looking for a too complicated solution. I would try option 3 then 4. Thank you for your help.
Just to get your opinion, the circuit with the i-fiberoptics parts was imagined too simple ?
No, not too simple. But I think you'll have better success with the coax cable. 13 metres is not too far. I use Canare L-5CFW coax for runs of 15-30 metres everyday with no problem. A cable like that with good RCA ends would cost me about $50. (35 EUR)
What can you find in Paris?
Also have a look here: http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/digital-audio/
They can build it cheaper than I can.
What can you find in Paris?
Also have a look here: http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/digital-audio/
They can build it cheaper than I can.
I can find a lot of things
- Medium quality cables at high rates in mall like shops (Fnac for example)
- High quality cables like Audioquest products
Between the 2, there is a large number of options. I think I should go in town having a quick look in dedicated shops. It is maybe the better think. About the converter Optical to Coax I remember the Real Cable CNUG2 device. I said 200€ to go coax as I counted this box plus a ready to use cable.
But, after checking a DIY cable can be around 80€ for good quality (double shielded). Less if I am choosing a cable single shielded.
Last but not least, going coax means wasting the optical cable I had.
- Medium quality cables at high rates in mall like shops (Fnac for example)
- High quality cables like Audioquest products
Between the 2, there is a large number of options. I think I should go in town having a quick look in dedicated shops. It is maybe the better think. About the converter Optical to Coax I remember the Real Cable CNUG2 device. I said 200€ to go coax as I counted this box plus a ready to use cable.
But, after checking a DIY cable can be around 80€ for good quality (double shielded). Less if I am choosing a cable single shielded.
Last but not least, going coax means wasting the optical cable I had.
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A 40ft Belden 1694A cable from bluejeanscable will cost $96.75 + postage. You can buy a similar 40ft 1694A cable on ebay for $42 shipped.....
Belden 1694A Digital Interconnect Audio Cable,40 Ft. | eBay
Then a set of converters on ebay (one of each tos/coax coax/tos) is $30 shipped.
Belden 1694A Digital Interconnect Audio Cable,40 Ft. | eBay
Then a set of converters on ebay (one of each tos/coax coax/tos) is $30 shipped.
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Right. If you can't find what you need, then think about Blue Jeans cables. It is exactly what you need. I would go with the converter and coax, but a 13M good optical "might" work.
Good pro video coax like the Canare or Belden is the best choice for runs over a few meters.
Good pro video coax like the Canare or Belden is the best choice for runs over a few meters.
You're welcome!
A1. I see 45 feet as $45.75 on the page I linked to. I can't buy it an make it that cheaply from my usual suppliers. (Unless I'm buying long spools).
A1. I see 45 feet as $45.75 on the page I linked to. I can't buy it an make it that cheaply from my usual suppliers. (Unless I'm buying long spools).
Just found this one Câbles Numérique Audio & Vidéo - SOMMERCABLE FOCUSLINE PUR Câble Coaxial Audio/Video 75Ω
One OFC copper cable, single shielded OFC less than 50 USD for 40 ft
One OFC copper cable, single shielded OFC less than 50 USD for 40 ft
T509 that cable looks fine. But you will need it terminated with good connectors. This is VERY important.
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