Mounted some Dayton Audio AN25 and RS100 in my F20 BMW where I have the Ground Zero underseat midbass already monted. Went from a Ground Zero car-specific speakers in the doors (mid and tweeter). First impression is that the Dayton sounded more mellow, GZ sounded a bit harsch, but louder. Maybe it has to do with the new drivers beeing brand new. Did a quick measurement and imported measurement from the Ground Zero underseat;
Smoothing is at 1/48 and the crossover on the Ground Zero is just set at 300Hz. Where would you set the crossover on the Dayton and GZ?
And I bought a cheap passive Alixpress crossover (set at 2800Hz) that I just on the Dayton Audio.
Is it okey that the two overlap eachother? In my car I need som extra "umf" in the low mid and bass area otherwise it sound tame.
I will be adding a 10" sub in the boot later.
Smoothing is at 1/48 and the crossover on the Ground Zero is just set at 300Hz. Where would you set the crossover on the Dayton and GZ?
And I bought a cheap passive Alixpress crossover (set at 2800Hz) that I just on the Dayton Audio.
Is it okey that the two overlap eachother? In my car I need som extra "umf" in the low mid and bass area otherwise it sound tame.
I will be adding a 10" sub in the boot later.
Where would you set the crossover on the Dayton and GZ? - depends what do you want from the drivers, how loud you are going to play them, etc.
And I bought a cheap passive Alixpress crossover (set at 2800Hz) that I just on the Dayton Audio. - facepalm, passive crossovers are tailor made per specific driver and needs/wants....you cannot just slap some and expected any result. I would go active, not passive.
Is it okey that the two overlap eachother? - depends on the target curves You want to follow, polarity, phase,x-over points, etc, etc...
And I bought a cheap passive Alixpress crossover (set at 2800Hz) that I just on the Dayton Audio. - facepalm, passive crossovers are tailor made per specific driver and needs/wants....you cannot just slap some and expected any result. I would go active, not passive.
Is it okey that the two overlap eachother? - depends on the target curves You want to follow, polarity, phase,x-over points, etc, etc...
The passive crossover is just to send the right frequency to the tweeter and the midrange. I can adjust the levels in the DSP.
No need for a facepalm comment.
No need for a facepalm comment.
facepalm again....how You are going to set the woofer separately from the tweeter if they are using shared crossover hooked to SINGLE channel ? How would you balance those out ? Do we understand the concept of active vs passive system ? It does not have anything with DSP related.....
Go to some EMMA competition and get some knowledge....folow RAW-cAT and PSsound in youtube please.
What do you think I am trying to?
Here is what I am thinking about the setup, and by all means I most certainly maybe wrong;
If a signal is sent from the amplifier with DSP to a crossover, the crossover splits the signal sending into two; the lower frequency is sent to the midrange and higher to the tweeter. If I then adjust the level with -10 db at let's say 6000 Hz in the DSP, will the midrange be affected by that if the adjustment? Won't the 6000Hz signal that is sent through the crossover to the tweeter be adjusted separatly?
At the time I don't have the possibility to go fully active although I wish I would.
And, I know it is a hard ask on the world wide web, but try show some kind of people-skills and don't just act like I am stupid for not beeing you. Did you start beeing an expert or did you gain experience through trial and error / asking for knowledge from experienced people?
And yes, I follow both thoose channels. Really good channels both of them!
Here is what I am thinking about the setup, and by all means I most certainly maybe wrong;
If a signal is sent from the amplifier with DSP to a crossover, the crossover splits the signal sending into two; the lower frequency is sent to the midrange and higher to the tweeter. If I then adjust the level with -10 db at let's say 6000 Hz in the DSP, will the midrange be affected by that if the adjustment? Won't the 6000Hz signal that is sent through the crossover to the tweeter be adjusted separatly?
At the time I don't have the possibility to go fully active although I wish I would.
And, I know it is a hard ask on the world wide web, but try show some kind of people-skills and don't just act like I am stupid for not beeing you. Did you start beeing an expert or did you gain experience through trial and error / asking for knowledge from experienced people?
And yes, I follow both thoose channels. Really good channels both of them!
Passive crossovers don't work as the digital ones.
If I then adjust the level with -10 db at let's say 6000 Hz in the DSP - first the filer would be affected, then BOTH of the speakers are going to be affected, they both first connect to the filter, not only by the amplitude in respect to the frequency, but i suppose the phase would change too.
And also by adjusting the 6000hz you are adjusting a BAND, depending on the Q factor, not exactly only the 6000hz frequency.
On top of it, crossovers don't cut the frequency below/over the adjustment , they roll it off, hence why you have the SLOPE. And different slopes lead to changes to the phase. Changes in phase lead to change in amplitude-frequency characteristic.
So i'm not sure how i can help thru the web while having so many variables....considering You are EQ-ing from a DSP, to a passive cross which was also not tailor made for the specific speakers and who knows what are the actual crossover points and what happens at the end of it. Crossover components and it's values are derived by the speaker T/S parameters and impedance graph + desired frequency and slope.
Usually good passive crossovers not only divide the band but also try to compensate or correct certain issues in the drivers....
In your case You don't know what contributes to what....it's like having too many unknowns in an equation and asking for a solution. It's impossible to give an definitive answer.
Going fully active eliminates the passive stuff variables and you can actually control the crossover slopes and frequencies, thus measuring the change....having a cause ---> effect link helps incredibly.
If I then adjust the level with -10 db at let's say 6000 Hz in the DSP - first the filer would be affected, then BOTH of the speakers are going to be affected, they both first connect to the filter, not only by the amplitude in respect to the frequency, but i suppose the phase would change too.
And also by adjusting the 6000hz you are adjusting a BAND, depending on the Q factor, not exactly only the 6000hz frequency.
On top of it, crossovers don't cut the frequency below/over the adjustment , they roll it off, hence why you have the SLOPE. And different slopes lead to changes to the phase. Changes in phase lead to change in amplitude-frequency characteristic.
So i'm not sure how i can help thru the web while having so many variables....considering You are EQ-ing from a DSP, to a passive cross which was also not tailor made for the specific speakers and who knows what are the actual crossover points and what happens at the end of it. Crossover components and it's values are derived by the speaker T/S parameters and impedance graph + desired frequency and slope.
Usually good passive crossovers not only divide the band but also try to compensate or correct certain issues in the drivers....
In your case You don't know what contributes to what....it's like having too many unknowns in an equation and asking for a solution. It's impossible to give an definitive answer.
Going fully active eliminates the passive stuff variables and you can actually control the crossover slopes and frequencies, thus measuring the change....having a cause ---> effect link helps incredibly.
Thanks!
The 6000Hz was just an example, just to try to explain my theory and it is a frequency well above the passive crossover point. So let's just say it has a Q of 10 to be fairly pinpoint on the frequency and adjust only that one band. And just for the heck of it say that the crossover give a flat response, I know it is not accurate when I buy an pre-assembled crossover, but there is no point in EQ in the DSP? I can clearly hear a difference when I am in the car adjusting the different bands. In my case I have a some sharp "s" sibiliance that I am trying to get rid of, as I undestand is in the range of 5000-8000Hz range.
The crossover has a slope of 18db on the crossover between the mids and tweeter, and crossover frequency is at 2800Hz by the way.
I did some modelling in Xsim and found that it was a theoretical good crossover point.
I see that I have wandered of the initial question of the crossover point between the frontset and the underseat midbass to now discussing EQ of the frontset wich has the meantioned passive crossover mounted.
Also, I am not going to compete in any competiotions. Just try the get a good sound and learn something new without "selling the kids" and mortgage the house.
The 6000Hz was just an example, just to try to explain my theory and it is a frequency well above the passive crossover point. So let's just say it has a Q of 10 to be fairly pinpoint on the frequency and adjust only that one band. And just for the heck of it say that the crossover give a flat response, I know it is not accurate when I buy an pre-assembled crossover, but there is no point in EQ in the DSP? I can clearly hear a difference when I am in the car adjusting the different bands. In my case I have a some sharp "s" sibiliance that I am trying to get rid of, as I undestand is in the range of 5000-8000Hz range.
The crossover has a slope of 18db on the crossover between the mids and tweeter, and crossover frequency is at 2800Hz by the way.
I did some modelling in Xsim and found that it was a theoretical good crossover point.
I see that I have wandered of the initial question of the crossover point between the frontset and the underseat midbass to now discussing EQ of the frontset wich has the meantioned passive crossover mounted.
Also, I am not going to compete in any competiotions. Just try the get a good sound and learn something new without "selling the kids" and mortgage the house.
There is point doing all of the EQ of course, but what i would is: do first this (before having to brute force any EQ), switching the polarity of the mid or the high or both, just play around and see how that changes the amplitude-frequency curve. Choose the one that gives you the flattest response. Then go for the EQ. Same applies for sub, any speaker. If You go active, again try different Xover points and slopes, with no EQ. Once you are happy then proceed with EQ.
The crossover has a slope of 18db on the crossover between the mids and tweeter, and crossover frequency is at 2800Hz by the way. - this is in theory according to the Z of 4 ohms (Z = impedance). But if you impedance measure your drivers with DATS, as an example, you would see that at 2800hz neither the tweeter or the midbass are 4 ohms exactly....they are different values, that's why it's called a impedance curve, because speakers are reactive components (frequency dependant) not a resistive one as a static 4 ohm resistor which never changes it's resistance no matter the frequency.
So i'm inclined to believe that's not the crossover point at all. How far is it from 2800hz....depends on the impedance curve of your drivers.
This is just a random 4 ohm driver below i've measured in the past....check that at 2800hz it's not a 4ohm....it's almost 7ohms and there is some phase shift....a specific passive filter would be all adjusted for this....generic one would not.
The crossover has a slope of 18db on the crossover between the mids and tweeter, and crossover frequency is at 2800Hz by the way. - this is in theory according to the Z of 4 ohms (Z = impedance). But if you impedance measure your drivers with DATS, as an example, you would see that at 2800hz neither the tweeter or the midbass are 4 ohms exactly....they are different values, that's why it's called a impedance curve, because speakers are reactive components (frequency dependant) not a resistive one as a static 4 ohm resistor which never changes it's resistance no matter the frequency.
So i'm inclined to believe that's not the crossover point at all. How far is it from 2800hz....depends on the impedance curve of your drivers.
This is just a random 4 ohm driver below i've measured in the past....check that at 2800hz it's not a 4ohm....it's almost 7ohms and there is some phase shift....a specific passive filter would be all adjusted for this....generic one would not.