Hi everyone,
I have some rough looking but functional Celestion Ditton 25s and some quite nice and fiunctional Beovox 5700s.
The 25's cabinets are poor and water damaged and even if mint they'd still be made of chipboard so not that great by modern standards. The 5700's are ok but the driver placement is awful so they don't image as well as they could. I have also read that the cabinet volume is too low for ideal bass performance.
So, I'm thinking of using these speakers as donors for something better.
With these speakers, I have all the drivers for a pair of Ditton 66s and the crossover schematics are available so i could make those too. Or I could refurbish and sell the 25s and rehouse the 5700s in taller cabinets with the drivers aligned. If I did this I would need to know what volume increase to go for. I do not know what is the optimal size for the Philips 10 inch unit and ABR. I am not sure TS info. is available for these drivers so I'd need to rely upon someone else's experimental results.
What are your thoughts? As nice as these old speakers are I can't really see the point of preserving them for the Nation as they are mass market items and somewhat flawed but I believe that a sensible modification of the 5700s or a combination of the both to make a 66 type speaker in 1 Inch thick ply could be quite special.
I have electrical/electronic knowledge and woodworking skills but I have not tackled a project like this before.
My current speakers are Acoustic Research AR55BX 3 way which I refoamed, rebuilt the cross overs and added a magneto dynamic tweeter to replace the blown originals. Amplification is a mid range Marantz receiver and my main sourse is LP via an old Garrard/SME combination.
Yours with thanks,
Jolyon.
I have some rough looking but functional Celestion Ditton 25s and some quite nice and fiunctional Beovox 5700s.
The 25's cabinets are poor and water damaged and even if mint they'd still be made of chipboard so not that great by modern standards. The 5700's are ok but the driver placement is awful so they don't image as well as they could. I have also read that the cabinet volume is too low for ideal bass performance.
So, I'm thinking of using these speakers as donors for something better.
With these speakers, I have all the drivers for a pair of Ditton 66s and the crossover schematics are available so i could make those too. Or I could refurbish and sell the 25s and rehouse the 5700s in taller cabinets with the drivers aligned. If I did this I would need to know what volume increase to go for. I do not know what is the optimal size for the Philips 10 inch unit and ABR. I am not sure TS info. is available for these drivers so I'd need to rely upon someone else's experimental results.
What are your thoughts? As nice as these old speakers are I can't really see the point of preserving them for the Nation as they are mass market items and somewhat flawed but I believe that a sensible modification of the 5700s or a combination of the both to make a 66 type speaker in 1 Inch thick ply could be quite special.
I have electrical/electronic knowledge and woodworking skills but I have not tackled a project like this before.
My current speakers are Acoustic Research AR55BX 3 way which I refoamed, rebuilt the cross overs and added a magneto dynamic tweeter to replace the blown originals. Amplification is a mid range Marantz receiver and my main sourse is LP via an old Garrard/SME combination.
Yours with thanks,
Jolyon.
Links to photos and specifications of these speakers would be of assistance in evaluating the situation.
How many speakers can you use?
A 'new' pair of 66s would be something special, but new boxes for both sets
would be too. You might have to adjust the crossover for the 5700s for the different arrangement, but not much.
ABRs are rather forgiving as to volume, at the same mass you could easily go
20% less to 40% more volume and have good tuning. Make the volume much smaller, you would add weight. Much bigger, take weight.
It's interesting how many people have both Dittons and B&Os in their collections.
A 'new' pair of 66s would be something special, but new boxes for both sets
would be too. You might have to adjust the crossover for the 5700s for the different arrangement, but not much.
ABRs are rather forgiving as to volume, at the same mass you could easily go
20% less to 40% more volume and have good tuning. Make the volume much smaller, you would add weight. Much bigger, take weight.
It's interesting how many people have both Dittons and B&Os in their collections.
Thank you for the replies.
Beovox 5700 spec
DIN power handling capacity 60 watts
Music power handling capacity 100 watts
Impedance 4 ohms
Frequency range 35 - 20,000 Hz
Harmonic distortion < 1 %
Sensitivity 3 watts
Net volume 45 litre
Woofer: 22,5cm and ABR 25cm
Mid-range 6cm Dome
Tweeter 2cm Dome
Crossover frequency 600 - 6000 Hz
Dimensions W x H x D: 36 x 66 x 30 cm
Weight 22.5 kg
woofer: 22.5cm Philips AD 1056 / W8
mid tone: Celestion MF 500
tweeter: Celestion HF 2000
passive radiator 25cm
Celestion Ditton 25
3-way stereo speaker,
Frequency response: 20/40Khz
Sensitivity: 90 dB at 1m
Recommended Amplifier: 10/120 Watts
Impedance: 4-8 ohms
Dimensions: 810 x 360 x 280 mm
Weight: 19.5 Kg
Drivers.
Celestion 12 inch Bass /ABR
Mid/Treble units HF2000 and 2 x HF1300
Crossover points unknown.
What I do know is thhat the 25s used the same bass driver and ABR as the Ditton 66 and the Beovox used the same mid and treble units as the Ditton 66 hence my desire to possibly clone a ^^ in modern cabinet materials.
I cannot find any data on the Philips 10 inch unit used by the Beovox but I have read that the cabinet volume could be increased for better performance. I cpuld do that as the drive units need repositioning anyway.
Do I clone 66s or do I re-house the 5700s in a bigger cabinet is my question really.
Yrs,
J.
Beovox 5700 spec
DIN power handling capacity 60 watts
Music power handling capacity 100 watts
Impedance 4 ohms
Frequency range 35 - 20,000 Hz
Harmonic distortion < 1 %
Sensitivity 3 watts
Net volume 45 litre
Woofer: 22,5cm and ABR 25cm
Mid-range 6cm Dome
Tweeter 2cm Dome
Crossover frequency 600 - 6000 Hz
Dimensions W x H x D: 36 x 66 x 30 cm
Weight 22.5 kg
woofer: 22.5cm Philips AD 1056 / W8
mid tone: Celestion MF 500
tweeter: Celestion HF 2000
passive radiator 25cm
Celestion Ditton 25
3-way stereo speaker,
Frequency response: 20/40Khz
Sensitivity: 90 dB at 1m
Recommended Amplifier: 10/120 Watts
Impedance: 4-8 ohms
Dimensions: 810 x 360 x 280 mm
Weight: 19.5 Kg
Drivers.
Celestion 12 inch Bass /ABR
Mid/Treble units HF2000 and 2 x HF1300
Crossover points unknown.
What I do know is thhat the 25s used the same bass driver and ABR as the Ditton 66 and the Beovox used the same mid and treble units as the Ditton 66 hence my desire to possibly clone a ^^ in modern cabinet materials.
I cannot find any data on the Philips 10 inch unit used by the Beovox but I have read that the cabinet volume could be increased for better performance. I cpuld do that as the drive units need repositioning anyway.
Do I clone 66s or do I re-house the 5700s in a bigger cabinet is my question really.
Yrs,
J.
You know, the 5700 drivers are positioned fine, for horizontal use.
The first ones I heard were on bookshelves, flush with my friend's record collection, imaging was excellent.(it was a large room)
For vertical use, how about mid on top at one edge, tweeter below, woofer and ABR on other side, ABR at bottom. You could make a trial baffle,(remove the old,) put it on the outside.
You would have only 10% or so larger volume, but an easy way to play with layouts.
The first ones I heard were on bookshelves, flush with my friend's record collection, imaging was excellent.(it was a large room)
For vertical use, how about mid on top at one edge, tweeter below, woofer and ABR on other side, ABR at bottom. You could make a trial baffle,(remove the old,) put it on the outside.
You would have only 10% or so larger volume, but an easy way to play with layouts.
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The prospect of cloning a pair of Ditton 66s like these YouTube would be tempting!
The pair shown is currently available for around £1,500.
Good question ! I only want one decent pair of speakers really as that is all I have room for. Interesting what you said about ABR loading being quite forgiving of volume. That makes me think that I could design new enclosures for the 5700 to line up the drivers and increase the volume (maybe up to 40%) to deal with the reported poorish bass performance. However, no contemporary tests of the 5700 that I have seen complained about the bass but it would be silly not to deal with the problem if I am making new boxes should that problem actually exist,
I cannot find TS data for the 10 Inch Philips unit so I am in the dark.
Then I would restore the 25s separately.
Where will you put them?
Time to consider use and placement, and if you are willing to adjust the crossover (or equalise), or not.
Time to consider use and placement, and if you are willing to adjust the crossover (or equalise), or not.
They will go in my sitting room a a little out from the back wall as required. I do not have the space to position them horizontally.
I have an ADC sound shaper for any room or recording anomolies.
The box dimension change affects low end roll off more than roll off and cross over to the mid doesn't it or will more of the bass amplitude and frequency response be changed by making the box bigger ?
I have an ADC sound shaper for any room or recording anomolies.
The box dimension change affects low end roll off more than roll off and cross over to the mid doesn't it or will more of the bass amplitude and frequency response be changed by making the box bigger ?
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Thank you. I've found some data on the Woofer but no Theile Small and I don't know if anyone's measured it.