I have made using Dc too...i am uploading dear Mooly
It is 100 Megabytes size.....soon i will post the link...this one have more clues to you...i am confused.
regards,
Carlos
It is 100 Megabytes size.....soon i will post the link...this one have more clues to you...i am confused.
regards,
Carlos
Here you have DC test dear Mooly.
you have observed correctly Mooly, i have tested several amplifiers...this transformer have burned several amplifiers...so, it is not a design mistake...or the mistake is in Aksa, Dx Amplifier, DHR Turbo and Dx Blame ST.
The last one burned, was the old and good standard Dx Amplifier...a very reliable one.
Dx Blame ST is almost the Doctor Self Blameless..... so.... a guarantee design, made by one of our best engineers.
YouTube - DC setup
regards,
Carlos
you have observed correctly Mooly, i have tested several amplifiers...this transformer have burned several amplifiers...so, it is not a design mistake...or the mistake is in Aksa, Dx Amplifier, DHR Turbo and Dx Blame ST.
The last one burned, was the old and good standard Dx Amplifier...a very reliable one.
Dx Blame ST is almost the Doctor Self Blameless..... so.... a guarantee design, made by one of our best engineers.
YouTube - DC setup
regards,
Carlos
A friend told me dear Eva, despite i do not use to read your posts
That you will assemble the amplifier to show flaws (your words...flaws may be defect...i have to translate using google).
So, finally you will build something.... sadly in a wrong way..not to cooperate giving us a good design you are able to do...just to defend yourself pride to say.
"I was rigth"
All amplifiers have some problems of designs, this depends from the point of view..this amplifier was designed by Douglas Self...i think you do not believe he has bad designs..maybe my modifications you want to discuss.
The amplifier is working great..with lovely sonics.
I see i am rigth..you only move to defend pride, because arrogance..not to really help forum folks...only to help yourself.
May this time..moved by angry, as i have not followed your instructions, you will do something positive, to say forum folks that may have errors in my design....interesting that you have never moved before.
What moves you are not kind things.
Have to build Aksa, Dx Amplifier (the standard and first one), the DHR Turbo and the Dx Blame ES and Dx Blame ST...because all these ones was burned by that transformer..so...all them have design flaws.
Interesting..you are also not reading my texts.... these amplifiers are working fine with other transformers..so... obvious things you are not reading..of course the transformer is the problem Eva!
With that transformer several amplifiers burns..without that transformer amplifiers does not burn.... what is the wrong thing Eva?
regards,
Carlos
That you will assemble the amplifier to show flaws (your words...flaws may be defect...i have to translate using google).
So, finally you will build something.... sadly in a wrong way..not to cooperate giving us a good design you are able to do...just to defend yourself pride to say.
"I was rigth"
All amplifiers have some problems of designs, this depends from the point of view..this amplifier was designed by Douglas Self...i think you do not believe he has bad designs..maybe my modifications you want to discuss.
The amplifier is working great..with lovely sonics.
I see i am rigth..you only move to defend pride, because arrogance..not to really help forum folks...only to help yourself.
May this time..moved by angry, as i have not followed your instructions, you will do something positive, to say forum folks that may have errors in my design....interesting that you have never moved before.
What moves you are not kind things.
Have to build Aksa, Dx Amplifier (the standard and first one), the DHR Turbo and the Dx Blame ES and Dx Blame ST...because all these ones was burned by that transformer..so...all them have design flaws.
Interesting..you are also not reading my texts.... these amplifiers are working fine with other transformers..so... obvious things you are not reading..of course the transformer is the problem Eva!
With that transformer several amplifiers burns..without that transformer amplifiers does not burn.... what is the wrong thing Eva?
regards,
Carlos
You want resistors large enough to avoid destroying parts, where do you get those resistors that go up in flames? You also want to keep the audio drive low enough not to overheat them due to normal current flow. I would start with no audio drive or just a small test signal.
Eva is right that if you have no load connected then it has to be cross conduction probably due to oscillation. The Q of any resonant circuit involving the output wiring is a function of the resistive losses in the circuit. A lower PS source impedance can push it over to oscillation.
Eva is right that if you have no load connected then it has to be cross conduction probably due to oscillation. The Q of any resonant circuit involving the output wiring is a function of the resistive losses in the circuit. A lower PS source impedance can push it over to oscillation.
Carlos, the point of Eva is that this transformer has
much less internal resistance, thus it can supply much higher
spikes of currents that may appear when :
There a low impedance load...
A crossconduction occur between the two power devices
of the amp while the output level is high, and this can occur
paritcularly when an amp has a rail sticking, since one device
is in full conduction while th other has already started trying to
bring the output to the other rail potential...
much less internal resistance, thus it can supply much higher
spikes of currents that may appear when :
There a low impedance load...
A crossconduction occur between the two power devices
of the amp while the output level is high, and this can occur
paritcularly when an amp has a rail sticking, since one device
is in full conduction while th other has already started trying to
bring the output to the other rail potential...
Every time you witness a fire, a burning house, you see the fire brigade right next to the scene.
What can we conclude from that observation?
Of course:
The fire brigade causes the fires, because it is there everytime there is a fire.
From the observation this is a valid conclusion, but it may not be the only one.
Of course we all know that the above conclusion is flawed. But we only know that, because we all know what is really going on (, don't we 😉 ).
But it might not always be this obvious. And in these cases a conclusion that sounds perfectly fine, can be just as wrong as in the above example.
And noone knows that it is wrong until the theory is testet and falsified. (you can't verify a theory - proove that it's right - you can only proove that it is wrong)
So what do we have so far? (please comment on this question)
Carlos has proposed the theory/observation:
"This toroidal transformer causes the amplifiers Carlos built to burn" (am I right so far? please append if I missed something)
This is kind of a destilate (by me) of observations (that I took from Carlos posts) (what observations do we actually have?) and maybe assumptions and conclusions - who knows.
Now, what tests can we think of, what tests does the theory provide, to falsify it? (please comment your ideas)
Well I don't think we can.
I think at the moment we are more discussing the following implicit statement:
"This toroidal transformer causes all amplifiers to burn"
(please comment on, what we are actually discussing)
And of course we don't like the "all" in that statement.
To test this seems simple: "just" find one amplifier setup that doesn't burn with it. 🙄
Can we do that?
Well this might become complicated, because the transformer is located in Carlos' lab, and Carlos might not have an amp at hand, that wouldn't burn - that is, if he was willing to conduct further tests himself.
And the transformer cannot be used by someone else for testing, as long as it is at Carlos' place and the "someone else" isn't located anywhere near his neighbourhood.
I could go on, but this would mean that I had to fork on my assumptions, so I better stop here to let the facts make up to where this post ends.
regards,
krachkiste
What can we conclude from that observation?
Of course:
The fire brigade causes the fires, because it is there everytime there is a fire.
From the observation this is a valid conclusion, but it may not be the only one.
Of course we all know that the above conclusion is flawed. But we only know that, because we all know what is really going on (, don't we 😉 ).
But it might not always be this obvious. And in these cases a conclusion that sounds perfectly fine, can be just as wrong as in the above example.
And noone knows that it is wrong until the theory is testet and falsified. (you can't verify a theory - proove that it's right - you can only proove that it is wrong)
So what do we have so far? (please comment on this question)
Carlos has proposed the theory/observation:
"This toroidal transformer causes the amplifiers Carlos built to burn" (am I right so far? please append if I missed something)
This is kind of a destilate (by me) of observations (that I took from Carlos posts) (what observations do we actually have?) and maybe assumptions and conclusions - who knows.
Now, what tests can we think of, what tests does the theory provide, to falsify it? (please comment your ideas)
Well I don't think we can.
I think at the moment we are more discussing the following implicit statement:
"This toroidal transformer causes all amplifiers to burn"
(please comment on, what we are actually discussing)
And of course we don't like the "all" in that statement.
To test this seems simple: "just" find one amplifier setup that doesn't burn with it. 🙄
Can we do that?
Well this might become complicated, because the transformer is located in Carlos' lab, and Carlos might not have an amp at hand, that wouldn't burn - that is, if he was willing to conduct further tests himself.
And the transformer cannot be used by someone else for testing, as long as it is at Carlos' place and the "someone else" isn't located anywhere near his neighbourhood.
I could go on, but this would mean that I had to fork on my assumptions, so I better stop here to let the facts make up to where this post ends.
regards,
krachkiste
Hi Carlos,
I have watched the new videos... and I don't understand how the transformer can cause these problems. There doesn't look anything strange in the waveforms as you are using the transistor across AC. Maybe things go wrong when high currents are drawn... some odd coupling effect, core saturation etc... I don't know.
You take two transformers, the toroid and any of your others that is OK.
Once you have wired these up to a bridge and smoothing caps, then where is the difference... DC is DC.
All those banks of electroylitics would remove any ripple (or signal modulation caused by the amp) that appeared on those rails to levels where it shoudn't be an issue. So I am not understanding the mechanism of why the amp is destroyed. Any such ripple would have to be huge to "overcome" the effect of all those caps.
The only explanation I can think of is in the way the windings are wound... maybe at high currents (when supplying the amp and low impedance load) something really weird begins to happen.
Is it worth one more set of outputs and to try shorting the vbe multiplier out (to give zero iq) and see what happens.
I have watched the new videos... and I don't understand how the transformer can cause these problems. There doesn't look anything strange in the waveforms as you are using the transistor across AC. Maybe things go wrong when high currents are drawn... some odd coupling effect, core saturation etc... I don't know.
You take two transformers, the toroid and any of your others that is OK.
Once you have wired these up to a bridge and smoothing caps, then where is the difference... DC is DC.
All those banks of electroylitics would remove any ripple (or signal modulation caused by the amp) that appeared on those rails to levels where it shoudn't be an issue. So I am not understanding the mechanism of why the amp is destroyed. Any such ripple would have to be huge to "overcome" the effect of all those caps.
The only explanation I can think of is in the way the windings are wound... maybe at high currents (when supplying the amp and low impedance load) something really weird begins to happen.
Is it worth one more set of outputs and to try shorting the vbe multiplier out (to give zero iq) and see what happens.
Carlos... the video in post 82... have you tried that with another "good" transformer to compare ?
My dear old friend Mooly...not only will not eat cow beef this week
but also have made these tests thinking on you.
You are one, between several guys, that i like the best.
I will unsubscribe from the thread, as i do not want to waste more time about this transformer..will seach for other and will test once again,with all amplifiers.
But this will happens in the future...distant future...will wait another transformer arrive as a gift from United States or some local friend...i cannot afford to buy electronics those days...all my activity, last years, was because people contribution, gifts or parts and instruments.....good friends i have.
I have burned several parts because these tests, and these parts are precious, because when finished, my audio electronics learning and activities will also finish together...you know...i feel bad..people gave me precious matched power transistors..highly selected ones..and i have burned so many because my stupidity in not believe the transformer could be the problem.
I paid a lot because my stupidity..... and i am continuing to be stupid..i continue not to believe, entirelly, the transformer can do that...even before it did that continuously several times.
By my dear... i will miss you.
Krachkiste, i think i was wrong about you...sorry that i have published that text about you..i regret a lot..i was wrong.
regards,
Carlos
but also have made these tests thinking on you.
You are one, between several guys, that i like the best.
I will unsubscribe from the thread, as i do not want to waste more time about this transformer..will seach for other and will test once again,with all amplifiers.
But this will happens in the future...distant future...will wait another transformer arrive as a gift from United States or some local friend...i cannot afford to buy electronics those days...all my activity, last years, was because people contribution, gifts or parts and instruments.....good friends i have.
I have burned several parts because these tests, and these parts are precious, because when finished, my audio electronics learning and activities will also finish together...you know...i feel bad..people gave me precious matched power transistors..highly selected ones..and i have burned so many because my stupidity in not believe the transformer could be the problem.
I paid a lot because my stupidity..... and i am continuing to be stupid..i continue not to believe, entirelly, the transformer can do that...even before it did that continuously several times.
By my dear... i will miss you.
Krachkiste, i think i was wrong about you...sorry that i have published that text about you..i regret a lot..i was wrong.
regards,
Carlos
So that is the end of this thread for now... a pity no real definite reason could be found.
I keep trying to think of other tests... but is it worth it as you will never use this transformer for an amplifier, it is too much of a one off.
A silly test... transformer and bridge rectifier and caps... no amp. Load the two rails heavily, perhaps use some old wire from a "fire element" and really pull some current from the rails... a couple of amps maybe... see if anything happens, and compare results with other transformer.
All the best Carlos... keep up the good work 🙂
I keep trying to think of other tests... but is it worth it as you will never use this transformer for an amplifier, it is too much of a one off.
A silly test... transformer and bridge rectifier and caps... no amp. Load the two rails heavily, perhaps use some old wire from a "fire element" and really pull some current from the rails... a couple of amps maybe... see if anything happens, and compare results with other transformer.
All the best Carlos... keep up the good work 🙂
One final word from your brother in Africa.
I look at the transformer and wire size in your picture and I conclude that the transformer must have good regulation. Normall we design our amplifiers using the peak voltage (unloded voltage) in mind and calculate that the transistors will operate inside SOA.
But when the amplifier is pushed it passes more current and we expect that the power supply voltage will sag toward a lot. Now a well designed transformer with good regulation, or revealing very low tempereture even at high current will maintain a high voltage and current, will the transistor still survive this value.
ould there be more energy available on the power supply than what is required?
For a transistor to glow means it is in the process of turning on (or off). The slope is not infinate and during that time a lot of energy is dissipated, if there is no limit to this energy what will happen.
Am I of the mark?
I look at the transformer and wire size in your picture and I conclude that the transformer must have good regulation. Normall we design our amplifiers using the peak voltage (unloded voltage) in mind and calculate that the transistors will operate inside SOA.
But when the amplifier is pushed it passes more current and we expect that the power supply voltage will sag toward a lot. Now a well designed transformer with good regulation, or revealing very low tempereture even at high current will maintain a high voltage and current, will the transistor still survive this value.
ould there be more energy available on the power supply than what is required?
For a transistor to glow means it is in the process of turning on (or off). The slope is not infinate and during that time a lot of energy is dissipated, if there is no limit to this energy what will happen.
Am I of the mark?
So Dx amplifiers are not designed properly and fail with stiff power supplies.
But the designer relies too much on impressing forum users with his work to get the daily dose of self-esteem that he does not know how else to get. Accepting the mistake would really hurt him.
If you were doing something really impressive, you would not feel such an urge to show it to the world in search of acceptance.
Also, the designer fears facing the problem because he does not want his audience to know he does not have a clue of what is actually happening. That would hurt him similarly.
Even worse, he loves himself so little that he feels completely incapable of understanding the problem.
You have to look for self esteem inside, not outside, Carlos.
But blaming a transformer and keeping all these things wrong inside your brain is always easier.
You would end up loving yourself much more and feeling much much better if you were able to solve the problem and see yourself making abusive tests to your amplifier with the toroid transformer without burning anything.
I promise. I have a long experience in that field.
But the designer relies too much on impressing forum users with his work to get the daily dose of self-esteem that he does not know how else to get. Accepting the mistake would really hurt him.
If you were doing something really impressive, you would not feel such an urge to show it to the world in search of acceptance.
Also, the designer fears facing the problem because he does not want his audience to know he does not have a clue of what is actually happening. That would hurt him similarly.
Even worse, he loves himself so little that he feels completely incapable of understanding the problem.
You have to look for self esteem inside, not outside, Carlos.
But blaming a transformer and keeping all these things wrong inside your brain is always easier.
You would end up loving yourself much more and feeling much much better if you were able to solve the problem and see yourself making abusive tests to your amplifier with the toroid transformer without burning anything.
I promise. I have a long experience in that field.
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