Calling all clever people :) What do you make of this?

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#762
I've seen this discussed to death on a few other forums and the general direction of the threads goes like... (as I’ve seen it is no different here from just reading the first 2 pages)

1. Lots of people say it won’t take off
2. Someone who understands physics proves that it will
3. Most people agree
4. Someone comes along swearing black and blue that it won’t take off yet with a poor argument to back it up
5. Most of the mob starts agreeing with him
2. Someone who understands physics proves that it will
3. Most people agree
4. Someone comes along swearing black and blue that it won’t take off yet with a poor argument to back it up
Jump to line 2.

Countless pages have been repeating the same thing over and over

The consensus in the end is that the question has been worded a bit wrong

The question stating that the conveyor matches the wheel speed ends in the wheels and conveyor accelerating to an infinite velocity and in reality wheel bearings won’t take this so the question fails there

Really, the question should have been worded that the conveyor matches the opposite speed of the plane relative to the ground and in this case it will take off with the wheels spinning at 2X the normal velocity
 
#765
there is a area that is about as high as the wings are long that is a area of LOWER preasure less resistance that will allow the plane to take off. now in a normal situation a plane can take off in ground effect even before it hits the speed that it needs to fly ...if i had a plane and ... that hard part a really big rotaiting belt .. i would bet the plane would take off
 
#766
For those still stuck on the thrust thing:

We understand the wheels are free wheeling and that thrust should have no problem pushing the plane along the belt, but, if we look beyond the mode of propulsion and just at the wheels and belt for a moment, we see that if the plane has moved forward on the belt, in relation to the ground, it is because the wheels are turning faster than the belt.

Can someone explain that without changing the question?
 
#769
DaKi][er said:

The consensus in the end is that the question has been worded a bit wrong

The question stating that the conveyor matches the wheel speed ends in the wheels and conveyor accelerating to an infinite velocity and in reality wheel bearings won't take this so the question fails there

Really, the question should have been worded that the conveyor matches the opposite speed of the plane relative to the ground and in this case it will take off with the wheels spinning at 2X the normal velocity
Click to expand...

Well, the question was worded that belt speed matches wheel speed, not plane speed.

We can not say that it was worded incorrectly as we don't know the exact intent of the question poser.

I would assume that it was their intent to specify the matching of belt to wheel speed in order to illicit just such arguements.

If it were simply plane speed matching the belt, then there would be no arguement.

But, AS IT IS WORDED, the plane stays on the ground, physics be damned.

Max
 
#772
Hello,
It's incredible. I see my job is to solve this kind of stupid questions, but... no. No, I'm wrong. I'm use to solve even stupid problems. :bawling: :dead:
Well, the solution.
If the conveor belt assures the right speed of the weels and the plane is firmly stop either the weels and the conveyor both stands firmly stop. And also the plane.
If the plane starts engines it begins to advance, wells starts to rolls and the convetors belt starts to move at the same speed. But the plane continues to accelerate till take off. Taking no care of the well rotating speed or the belt linear speed since planes do not use weels to advance but engine thrust.
Is this so easy? Could I misunderstand the problem? Did I miss something?🙄
Cheers 🙂
 
#775
v1d9uy said:
you guys know nothing about aerodynamics other wise this thread would not have 70+ pages .. it would have one reply ... simpley say ... yes
Click to expand...

Once again someone wandering down the wrong path.

There is only one line that need be said and I'll say it again:

"The only way for the plane to make progress along the belt, is if the wheels are turning faster than the belt."

Nothing else matters folks. It is elementary mathematics, nothing to do with aerodynamics.

If you want to go on about the free wheeling transport system, that's fine but take the time to read that line until it finally sinks in. Once you grasp that notion enlightement is but seconds away.

This is difficult to believe that otherwise very intelligent people are not quite grasping this.

And please don't respond with something about thrust, it only shows you haven't grasped it yet.
 
#776
Hiya Cal,
Thrust acts upon the air with such force that the plane will move. The belt is free to move in relation to a fixed point on the earth as is the fuselage of the plane in relation to the belt.

Can you break down your logic so I can see if I'm missing anything?


:darkside: as the virus takes hold, and you were worried about avian flu! :darkside:

-Chris
 
#779
You guys haven't let that line sink in, I can tell. When you do you'll go "of course, why in heck didn't that sink in sooner?"

Max, do you have any better way of explaining this? Perhaps it's just an inability on my part. I thought I had broken it down to it's simplest form.

No wait, they didn't believe you either, never mind.
 
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