Hi,
That's just my personal experience backed up with that of some audio acquaintances, YMMV.
But...if you reconnect that wire in reverse you can start all over again!!
That's no problem for me either. I checked my stock and I still have plenty of RCA suckers left.😀
If that's what you mean by terminated...
Collective listening only works against you, at best it has some merit when none of the participants are acquainted with any of the others.
Not to mention 80% of the participants being at a disadvantage due to their seating in the room.
Where the heck does this come from??
I don't see how anyone can make extra money by this...
Maybe I'm missing that Midas touch...
Cheers,😉
That's just my personal experience backed up with that of some audio acquaintances, YMMV.
But...if you reconnect that wire in reverse you can start all over again!!
That's no problem for me either. I checked my stock and I still have plenty of RCA suckers left.😀
If that's what you mean by terminated...
Collective listening only works against you, at best it has some merit when none of the participants are acquainted with any of the others.
Not to mention 80% of the participants being at a disadvantage due to their seating in the room.
Where the heck does this come from??
I don't see how anyone can make extra money by this...
Maybe I'm missing that Midas touch...
Cheers,😉
fdegrove said:Where the heck does this come from??
I don't see how anyone can make extra money by this...
Maybe I'm missing that Midas touch...
There are at least a couple of cash offerings out there for anyone who can demonstrate under proper blind conditions the audibility of interconnects and/or speaker cables. One of them is $4,000 and another $1,000.
Do a search through rec.audio.high-end.
se
"That's fine. And these will be unterminated, yes?"
Yes.
"Agreed. But again, any positive result will be quite an extraordinary claim to many who will demand extraordinary proof, hence my deside to go to 5 trials if possible."
I'm cool with how ever many trials.
"Yeah, but if what Frank said has any merit and the effect diminishes with use, then your single reference cable will be running out of steam along the way. That's why I'd prefer to use pairs so that no single cable is run any longer than any other."
I'd prefer both methods.
"Don't think it'd save much on shipping costs unless we were going to use some big heavy connectors like WBTs or something. But it certainly helps with material costs."
Take your pick.
"Perhaps. Though if I might make a suggestion, I'd recommend going through them yourself first and then bring others in. Collective listening also has the side effect of the other participants influencing others and could in fact work against you."
Yes, this was to be my method.
Collective listening means one extra listener at a time, and on my and other systems.
"Sure. Perhaps we can split that $4,000 offer. I could use a spare $1,000. "
Me too.
Eric.
Yes.
"Agreed. But again, any positive result will be quite an extraordinary claim to many who will demand extraordinary proof, hence my deside to go to 5 trials if possible."
I'm cool with how ever many trials.
"Yeah, but if what Frank said has any merit and the effect diminishes with use, then your single reference cable will be running out of steam along the way. That's why I'd prefer to use pairs so that no single cable is run any longer than any other."
I'd prefer both methods.
"Don't think it'd save much on shipping costs unless we were going to use some big heavy connectors like WBTs or something. But it certainly helps with material costs."
Take your pick.
"Perhaps. Though if I might make a suggestion, I'd recommend going through them yourself first and then bring others in. Collective listening also has the side effect of the other participants influencing others and could in fact work against you."
Yes, this was to be my method.
Collective listening means one extra listener at a time, and on my and other systems.
"Sure. Perhaps we can split that $4,000 offer. I could use a spare $1,000. "
Me too.
Eric.
Hi,
Me too...just consider electron cloud initiation one direction or the other.
Are you still there?
Ciao,😉
Me too...just consider electron cloud initiation one direction or the other.
Are you still there?
Ciao,😉
Re: SE Gone Quiet ?...........
Nothing at the moment. I have to buy the wire and I'm waiting for a paycheck to arrive first. I'm buying a bunch for myself to try out (it's something that's been on my to do list for about six months now).
se
mrfeedback said:
Nothing at the moment. I have to buy the wire and I'm waiting for a paycheck to arrive first. I'm buying a bunch for myself to try out (it's something that's been on my to do list for about six months now).
se
mrfeedback said:
As I've said about half a dozen times, I propose using the 26 gauge high purity OCC copper magnet wire that Vampire sells.
Vampire sells only 10 pound spools (about 30,000 feet) but Michael Percy sells it for $5 per 50 feet with discounts for longer lengths.
se
Keep Your Shirt On Steve..........
Oh, so you mean this wire.
Part #EC-26 - Magnet Wire
The #EC-26 is our 26 gauge, Continuous Cast Copper premium internal hook up wire (magnet wire). It has EC solid stranding, red soldron insulation and is available in clear only. Priced per 10 lb. spool.
Price: $200.00
10c/foot from Michael Percy - go for it.
Eric.
Oh, so you mean this wire.
Part #EC-26 - Magnet Wire
The #EC-26 is our 26 gauge, Continuous Cast Copper premium internal hook up wire (magnet wire). It has EC solid stranding, red soldron insulation and is available in clear only. Priced per 10 lb. spool.
Price: $200.00
10c/foot from Michael Percy - go for it.
Eric.
Hi,
I must say I'm mighty impressed by their use of words:
"solid stranding"
What's that supposed to mean??
A wire's either stranded or it's a single solid core one.
"red soldron"
I don't know about you guys but that only tells me two things:
it's probably red and it's probably directly solderable...or should one say "soldrble'?
Errr...and do they say somewhere that it's directional?
Not that they have to but it could have helped...
Anyway, let's see what happens.
Cheers,😉
I must say I'm mighty impressed by their use of words:
"solid stranding"
What's that supposed to mean??
A wire's either stranded or it's a single solid core one.
"red soldron"
I don't know about you guys but that only tells me two things:
it's probably red and it's probably directly solderable...or should one say "soldrble'?
Errr...and do they say somewhere that it's directional?
Not that they have to but it could have helped...
Anyway, let's see what happens.
Cheers,😉
My cables aren't directional, but each end is different. I use Canare Start Quad Microphone cable and the very nice Canare RCA connectors for unbalanced cables in my system. The star quad mic cable has two blue wires and two white wires and a shield.
I use the two blue wires as the return and the two white wires as the signal (everybody knows that blue wires make a more musical return than signal line 🙂 ). Now I have the shield to deal with. If it's connected to both ends, it's not a shield but rather also a return, so I attach it to only one end and mark that end with a sharpie dot. the measured noise floor of my system seems to be the lowest with all the shields connected at the pre-amp.
So my cables are directional and not directional...
Sheldon
I use the two blue wires as the return and the two white wires as the signal (everybody knows that blue wires make a more musical return than signal line 🙂 ). Now I have the shield to deal with. If it's connected to both ends, it's not a shield but rather also a return, so I attach it to only one end and mark that end with a sharpie dot. the measured noise floor of my system seems to be the lowest with all the shields connected at the pre-amp.
So my cables are directional and not directional...
Sheldon
fdegrove said:
If they sold it as such I would presume it would have to be marked, which is definitely not what is wanted! If you want to test wire that is specifically marketed as directional, I think it is going to be tough making certain that it's directionality can't be determined visually....
Regards,
Tony.
Re: Vapourware ?............
Should be any day now. Just be aware that it sometimes takes Michael Percy a couple of weeks to fill orders. Though there'll also be several hundred dollars worth of Black Gate caps on this order so perhaps that'll speed things up a bit. 🙂
se
mrfeedback said:
Should be any day now. Just be aware that it sometimes takes Michael Percy a couple of weeks to fill orders. Though there'll also be several hundred dollars worth of Black Gate caps on this order so perhaps that'll speed things up a bit. 🙂
se
Steve Eddy sent me a note about this test after a post I made on another forum.
So this is my first post here.
How many will it take?
I'm not sure exactly how you're setting up the tests.
If you have cable A (wired correct) and cable B (worng direction):
Lets say you ask everyone to say whether they prefer A or B.
Lets say you believe that A is truly 0.1% better than B. (So given enough trials A will be chosen 50.1% of the time and B 49.9%.)
Lets say you want Power of the study to be .95 (5% chance that you find no difference when there actually is a difference).
And the Probability of Alpha to be 0.05 (5% chance that you find a difference and it is due to chance only (no real difference).
Guess what sample size you need. Ready?
1,624,993.
So if you send the cables to 100 people, then each of you needs to do 16,250 trials.
If you believe that there is a 1% difference between the cables, then plan on a total of 16,243 samples.
So this is my first post here.
That's the key isn't it?
How many will it take?
I'm not sure exactly how you're setting up the tests.
If you have cable A (wired correct) and cable B (worng direction):
Lets say you ask everyone to say whether they prefer A or B.
Lets say you believe that A is truly 0.1% better than B. (So given enough trials A will be chosen 50.1% of the time and B 49.9%.)
Lets say you want Power of the study to be .95 (5% chance that you find no difference when there actually is a difference).
And the Probability of Alpha to be 0.05 (5% chance that you find a difference and it is due to chance only (no real difference).
Guess what sample size you need. Ready?
1,624,993.
So if you send the cables to 100 people, then each of you needs to do 16,250 trials.
If you believe that there is a 1% difference between the cables, then plan on a total of 16,243 samples.
Ophth said:
Howdy, Ophth. Welcome aboard.
Well, the test isn't about preference or other quality factors across a population but rather simple detection of difference. So the question is how many correct identifications of a difference out of how many trials would be required to establish to a reasonable degree of confidence that the correct identifications were due to actual audible differences as opposed to random chance?
se
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