Has anybody used/heard these mid-bass units? The only distributor I know of in the country is 3000 miles away (in Perth)... and they are a little expensive... so if someone has any info on them it would be a help.
I was planning on mating them (MTM) with a G2 (or ESg2 or ATG2) ribbon and using Lambda bass units...
I was planning on mating them (MTM) with a G2 (or ESg2 or ATG2) ribbon and using Lambda bass units...
)
Thanks, Uli.
I'll send a note off to Gydotron in the hopes that he(?) can speak English
. It sure looks likes he's about to build a unit using the C95's (the Gydolon MKIII) although I can't read the language of the site - is it German
?. And after the beautiful units he's got there already (Eidolon clones) it sounds like he's happy with the Accuton sound.
I've only seen one other post regarding these units - where the design was 4 of these wired in series/parallel, in 2 boxes, mounted above and below a Raven R3. But that would be a little too expensive for me...
I'll send a note off to Gydotron in the hopes that he(?) can speak English
. It sure looks likes he's about to build a unit using the C95's (the Gydolon MKIII) although I can't read the language of the site - is it German?. And after the beautiful units he's got there already (Eidolon clones) it sounds like he's happy with the Accuton sound.I've only seen one other post regarding these units - where the design was 4 of these wired in series/parallel, in 2 boxes, mounted above and below a Raven R3. But that would be a little too expensive for me...
hi,
I'm using C95T6 with C12 in a 2way bass reflex box. Those are great drivers - very accurate, smooth and natural sounding, but there is a lot of work to get the crossover right. C95 has large peak at ca. 4,5kHz so you need a notch there and regarding that I wouldn't recommend crossing it over to tweeter much higher than 2,5kHz. As you are going for 3way maybe C88 would be a better choice? Look also at distorsion graphs.
regards,
Vuki
I'm using C95T6 with C12 in a 2way bass reflex box. Those are great drivers - very accurate, smooth and natural sounding, but there is a lot of work to get the crossover right. C95 has large peak at ca. 4,5kHz so you need a notch there and regarding that I wouldn't recommend crossing it over to tweeter much higher than 2,5kHz. As you are going for 3way maybe C88 would be a better choice? Look also at distorsion graphs.
regards,
Vuki
Okay,
the language of gydotron
is dutch (not german
)
You can online translate is with : translingo . Just type in the URL of the website : www.gydotron.com and it will popup in english.
I've to inform you that the mkIII is indefinte on hold....
Ralph
(living in holland (no province of germany) where they speak dutch but aren't dutch)
the language of gydotron
is dutch (not german
)You can online translate is with : translingo . Just type in the URL of the website : www.gydotron.com and it will popup in english.
I've to inform you that the mkIII is indefinte on hold....
Ralph
(living in holland (no province of germany) where they speak dutch but aren't dutch)
Hi. 🙂
To me those drivers come out a little on the expensive side. Not much bang for the buck, to be blunt.
Linkwitz posted an article on his site " distortion tests ":
http://www.linkwitzlab.com./mid_dist.htm
The ceramic drivers didn´t come out that well really.
I wouldn´t have any of those drivers on my top list. I would go for something like Audax, Peerless HDS 134 or Seas Excel M15 instead.
To me those drivers come out a little on the expensive side. Not much bang for the buck, to be blunt.
Linkwitz posted an article on his site " distortion tests ":
http://www.linkwitzlab.com./mid_dist.htm
The ceramic drivers didn´t come out that well really.
I wouldn´t have any of those drivers on my top list. I would go for something like Audax, Peerless HDS 134 or Seas Excel M15 instead.
Kharma Ceramique won loudspeaker of the year 2002 in Absolute Sound magazine, rivaling Rocport Hyperions ($91,000). Also, some other well regarded loudspeakers are using Accuton drivers. Although, years ago, I was not impressed with them, with proper implementation, they might be good indeed.
http://www.stereophile.com/showarchives.cgi?684
http://www.stereophile.com/printarchives.cgi?756
http://search.msn.com/results.asp?FORM=sCPN&RS=CHECKED&un=doc&v=1&q=kharma ceramique&X=1
http://www.stereophile.com/showarchives.cgi?684
http://www.stereophile.com/printarchives.cgi?756
http://search.msn.com/results.asp?FORM=sCPN&RS=CHECKED&un=doc&v=1&q=kharma ceramique&X=1
Hi Anders,
Accutons are expensive but I think they are worth it. With all due respect to Mr Linkwitz, I think that his measurements don't tell much about how any of tested drivers sound, because they indeed have their own "sound". Of course not everyone has the same taste, so to each his own... For example; I worked with Linkwitz's beloved "big yellow" SS, but wasn't enchanted with it's sound, although it's really nice driver to work with -efficient, smooth and relatively wide ranged. I also worked with Excel 17cm magnesium drivers which are somewhat like Accutons - smooth with a large resonant peak, and showed very good results in Linkwitz's test, but their sound is very different than Accutons- to my ears they sound to "polite" - as if dynamics is compressed, and I had the same feeling listening to them in Jamo Concert 8's, and some Joseph Audio's. On the other hand - I liked the sound of Kharma, Avalon and some other speakers (can't remember the name) that used Accuton drivers, very much, and I also find my Accutons to sound great. 🙂
regards,
Vuki
Accutons are expensive but I think they are worth it. With all due respect to Mr Linkwitz, I think that his measurements don't tell much about how any of tested drivers sound, because they indeed have their own "sound". Of course not everyone has the same taste, so to each his own... For example; I worked with Linkwitz's beloved "big yellow" SS, but wasn't enchanted with it's sound, although it's really nice driver to work with -efficient, smooth and relatively wide ranged. I also worked with Excel 17cm magnesium drivers which are somewhat like Accutons - smooth with a large resonant peak, and showed very good results in Linkwitz's test, but their sound is very different than Accutons- to my ears they sound to "polite" - as if dynamics is compressed, and I had the same feeling listening to them in Jamo Concert 8's, and some Joseph Audio's. On the other hand - I liked the sound of Kharma, Avalon and some other speakers (can't remember the name) that used Accuton drivers, very much, and I also find my Accutons to sound great. 🙂
regards,
Vuki
Hi vuki.
To be more specific, it is more the high price than any technical deficiencies that catches my attention with the Accuton drivers and as Peter Daniel states: they can be quite a handful to get right.
What you say about taste is ofcourse extremely relevant and the only thing that counts in the end.
The Seas driver I was referring to is not one of the magnesium ones. It´s a customized midrange with a pp cone:
http://www.seas.no/excel_line/excel/E0016.PDF
To be more specific, it is more the high price than any technical deficiencies that catches my attention with the Accuton drivers and as Peter Daniel states: they can be quite a handful to get right.
What you say about taste is ofcourse extremely relevant and the only thing that counts in the end.
The Seas driver I was referring to is not one of the magnesium ones. It´s a customized midrange with a pp cone:
http://www.seas.no/excel_line/excel/E0016.PDF
I've never heard acuton drivers, but i would really like to build a speaker with them.
The guy I buy my parts from rates them very high, especially the tweeters.
You can take a look at http://www.diyparadiso.com/advicespeak1.htm
He doesn't really like the bass drivers though.
I don't think you will be dissapointed in them.
The guy I buy my parts from rates them very high, especially the tweeters.
You can take a look at http://www.diyparadiso.com/advicespeak1.htm
He doesn't really like the bass drivers though.
I don't think you will be dissapointed in them.
I still didn't sell mine. After reading Kharma Ceramique and some other (using Accutons) speaker's reviews, I'm seriously thinking about finishing that project using revised crossovers.😉
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4470&highlight=grand+slamm
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4470&highlight=grand+slamm
Peter: Have you considered active filters together with a bunch of your gainklones for that project?
Would one ampchannel per driver work?
Would one ampchannel per driver work?
I might try it too. But somehow, I don't feel comfortable with driving a tweeter with a separate amp channel. I would probably go for series crossover between tweeter/mids and use two channels of one stereo amp for highs and lows.
Graph is of my 2way Accuton C95 & C12 with crossover - and I'm very satisfied with the sound. Measured with CLIO at 1m, so please ignore measurement below ca. 300Hz.
I also have Tannoy HPD385's, Davis/Accuton bookshelf (pictured at: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=189886#post189886 ), Morel MW142/MDT39 bookshelf, Fostex FE164 (modified) in mini-onken and some more 😉 , but I those Accutons are the most neutral, detailed and smooth of the bunch. Sometimes I prefere Tannoys (especially with 300B SE amp) which are more coloured but there are times when music just suits them better.
I also have Tannoy HPD385's, Davis/Accuton bookshelf (pictured at: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=189886#post189886 ), Morel MW142/MDT39 bookshelf, Fostex FE164 (modified) in mini-onken and some more 😉 , but I those Accutons are the most neutral, detailed and smooth of the bunch. Sometimes I prefere Tannoys (especially with 300B SE amp) which are more coloured but there are times when music just suits them better.
Attachments
Thank you for your input...
Vuki, thank you for your input. I've heard an older (I think it was the C78) midrange and a C88-based speaker, and really liked the way they sounded. So I thought I would try the C95's. How did you cope with the 4-5KHz peak (I think it's about 6dB from the plots I have seen)? I was initially going to experiment with an active crossover before I decided on building the passive version. I'm going to be actively crossing to the bass module anyway and I have at least 1 spare channel on each box. Any tips you have from your cross-over experiments would be gratefully received.
Ralph, Apologies, but unfortunately I don't know Dutch from German (and I would probably mistake many other languages also - English and a little Indonesian is as far as I can claim). I've tried translingo from work, but it is blocked - so I will have to wait until I get home. A bit sad about the MkIII...
Peter and Anders, thanks for your contributions. Without starting any arguments (I hope), I have found that some of the more pleasant amps and speakers to listen to are because they have (rather than don't have) some form of minor 'distortions'. Critical listening is good for me most of the time, but sometimes you just want to get carried away with the music, and, for some CD's at least, you couldn't listen to them using a really accurate system. But that's another story...
Now back to the scrimping and saving...
Vuki, thank you for your input. I've heard an older (I think it was the C78) midrange and a C88-based speaker, and really liked the way they sounded. So I thought I would try the C95's. How did you cope with the 4-5KHz peak (I think it's about 6dB from the plots I have seen)? I was initially going to experiment with an active crossover before I decided on building the passive version. I'm going to be actively crossing to the bass module anyway and I have at least 1 spare channel on each box. Any tips you have from your cross-over experiments would be gratefully received.
Ralph, Apologies, but unfortunately I don't know Dutch from German (and I would probably mistake many other languages also - English and a little Indonesian is as far as I can claim). I've tried translingo from work, but it is blocked - so I will have to wait until I get home. A bit sad about the MkIII...
Peter and Anders, thanks for your contributions. Without starting any arguments (I hope), I have found that some of the more pleasant amps and speakers to listen to are because they have (rather than don't have) some form of minor 'distortions'. Critical listening is good for me most of the time, but sometimes you just want to get carried away with the music, and, for some CD's at least, you couldn't listen to them using a really accurate system. But that's another story...
Now back to the scrimping and saving...
Here is how my xover looks like:
on C95 midbass: parallel 1,2mH/15uF/6R8 before 2mH in series with C95 and series 3R3/4,7uF/0,15mH in parallel with C95
on C12 tweeter: second order with 4,7uF and 0,45mH , 2R2/8R2 attenuation and series 2,2uF/4R7 in parallel with C12
speakers in phase
inductors on bass are <0,35R each (I'm using Mundorf foils)
capacitor on tweeter is Mundorf Supreme and 15uF in midbass' RLC is Mundorf PP
forgive me for not drawing the schematics
on C95 midbass: parallel 1,2mH/15uF/6R8 before 2mH in series with C95 and series 3R3/4,7uF/0,15mH in parallel with C95
on C12 tweeter: second order with 4,7uF and 0,45mH , 2R2/8R2 attenuation and series 2,2uF/4R7 in parallel with C12
speakers in phase
inductors on bass are <0,35R each (I'm using Mundorf foils)
capacitor on tweeter is Mundorf Supreme and 15uF in midbass' RLC is Mundorf PP
forgive me for not drawing the schematics
Re: C²95 mid-bass from Thiel & Partner (Accuton)
Hi Clothears,
just give Pat at WAR Audio a phone call and he should be able to answer any questions that you have.
He is well experienced and aproachable, and should give you all the tips that you need.
Eric.
Cloth Ears said:
Hi Clothears,
just give Pat at WAR Audio a phone call and he should be able to answer any questions that you have.
He is well experienced and aproachable, and should give you all the tips that you need.
Eric.
Thank you for your cross-over schematic, Vuki. I will keep this in mind if I decide to go 'passive' (although most people I know think I'm passive enough - heh, heh).
Eric, I'm going to call Pat when I have saved enough for the C95's, but I have a couple of other bits to get first. He's the distributor I mentioned in my first post...
Back to the grind...
Eric, I'm going to call Pat when I have saved enough for the C95's, but I have a couple of other bits to get first. He's the distributor I mentioned in my first post...
Back to the grind...
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