Version
I installed v1.6 and I did not notice a change. But I'll do some tests when I find time. I happen to have 2 units, One with 1.15 and the other recently "upgraded" to 1.16. Those behringer people are very hermetic about explaining things.
About the link to computer: It woould be nice to use the cat5 option instead of going serial. (cat5 is chep, smaller and esay to crimp) Unfortunelly they've chosen a different protocol, right? Anybody using it?
cheers
Ric
I installed v1.6 and I did not notice a change. But I'll do some tests when I find time. I happen to have 2 units, One with 1.15 and the other recently "upgraded" to 1.16. Those behringer people are very hermetic about explaining things.
About the link to computer: It woould be nice to use the cat5 option instead of going serial. (cat5 is chep, smaller and esay to crimp) Unfortunelly they've chosen a different protocol, right? Anybody using it?
cheers
Ric
The connectors on the back of the DCX that look like Cat5 network connectors are not really.....they're RS485 serial links for daisy chaining multiple DCX's or other components. The serial hardware/software interface is the only link to the outside world supported by the DCX.
A long serial cable is easily built for next to nothing. A chunk of twisted-pair shielded cable and a couple DB9 connectors from Radio Shack is all that's required. Just a few bucks.
Cheers,
Davey.
A long serial cable is easily built for next to nothing. A chunk of twisted-pair shielded cable and a couple DB9 connectors from Radio Shack is all that's required. Just a few bucks.
Cheers,
Davey.
DCX is allright
Hi,
I have recently bought the DCX and I am feeding it with the Spdif output of my Harman Kardon CD player using a cinch to XLR converter.
Compared to my passive 12dB with Harman Kardon HK1200 Amp the sound is the same; yet resolutions seemed to be better when KME SPA 240 Amps were used post DCX. Due to budget I finally switched to the Alesis RA 150, which is basically the same as the HK 1200 in regards to sound and resolution.
I am presently not using a post DCX volume control. Instead I am using the +-15dB gain of the DCX; gain of my Alesis RA 150 Amps is addjusted to be working fine.
Speakers are Vifa PLW18 and XT ringradiator. XO is 24dB 1900Hz. I have tried various frequencies, without any significantly audible improvement; the "digital version" speaker does NEITHER sound MORE nor LESS natural, it is the same as the analog, none of the points I hoped to be improved or feared to be worsen were changed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You might consider my ear to be the weak point, may be it is, may be my violoncello playing and drumming have made me deaf
However, I can state, that an orchestra, especially strings, do not fully sound like they are reproduced, "space" and "ambience" is ca. 10% missing, but are very close to, same in both analog and digital version.
Conclusion: DCX doesnt help nor does it harm, however 10min. to tweak the system is "consumer friendly" and an effective way to save time for more important things.
Hi,
I have recently bought the DCX and I am feeding it with the Spdif output of my Harman Kardon CD player using a cinch to XLR converter.
Compared to my passive 12dB with Harman Kardon HK1200 Amp the sound is the same; yet resolutions seemed to be better when KME SPA 240 Amps were used post DCX. Due to budget I finally switched to the Alesis RA 150, which is basically the same as the HK 1200 in regards to sound and resolution.
I am presently not using a post DCX volume control. Instead I am using the +-15dB gain of the DCX; gain of my Alesis RA 150 Amps is addjusted to be working fine.
Speakers are Vifa PLW18 and XT ringradiator. XO is 24dB 1900Hz. I have tried various frequencies, without any significantly audible improvement; the "digital version" speaker does NEITHER sound MORE nor LESS natural, it is the same as the analog, none of the points I hoped to be improved or feared to be worsen were changed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You might consider my ear to be the weak point, may be it is, may be my violoncello playing and drumming have made me deaf
However, I can state, that an orchestra, especially strings, do not fully sound like they are reproduced, "space" and "ambience" is ca. 10% missing, but are very close to, same in both analog and digital version.
Conclusion: DCX doesnt help nor does it harm, however 10min. to tweak the system is "consumer friendly" and an effective way to save time for more important things
.The DCX is now up and running controlling the subs only at this point.
I have the input via digital from the DEQ2496, which has a switch for a lower input, the sub out channel on the processor is set to 0, but has a +/- 12 setting. Watching a movie at near reference level the input lights on the DCX peaked at the -5, therefore I am guessing the input levels are okay. Using the output level controls and the subs level controls I have every thing working fine at the moment. The Decibel Hi Fi kit wont be here until sometime next week according to their email, so what do others think of those fixed F-Type attenuators as a quick fix?
BTW the DCX is a great unit, the software makes setting it up a breeze.
I have the input via digital from the DEQ2496, which has a switch for a lower input, the sub out channel on the processor is set to 0, but has a +/- 12 setting. Watching a movie at near reference level the input lights on the DCX peaked at the -5, therefore I am guessing the input levels are okay. Using the output level controls and the subs level controls I have every thing working fine at the moment. The Decibel Hi Fi kit wont be here until sometime next week according to their email, so what do others think of those fixed F-Type attenuators as a quick fix?
BTW the DCX is a great unit, the software makes setting it up a breeze.
Thanks DSP_Geek...
This brings about an interesting problem, for years I have been using RG6 Quad Shield for my interconnects which is of course 75 ohm, so far they are working with all the Behringer products I currently own, but you think these RF attenuators may create a mismatch?
I am only guessing but I assume these only have a resistor network built into them.
Anyway I am going to get a couple during the week to give them a try, as they are only a couple of $, I have plenty of F-Type adaptors on hand.
Okay it got the better of me...
I whipped up this little adaptor
Made no apparent difference to the sound, and DID NOT attenuate the signal
So these are off the menu... now we wait.
I whipped up this little adaptor
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Made no apparent difference to the sound, and DID NOT attenuate the signal
So these are off the menu... now we wait.
Ok, some questions to all of the DCX2496 users out there.
I got my unit last week and I have now been slowly studing it.
As it is a professional unit with all of it's XLR connectors and professional signal levels I would like to mod my unit to use RCA sockets. Also I of course would like to upgrade the analog stages, both the input and output.
So, the conclusion that I came to is that it would be possible to make a new module for analog stages and analog inputs/outputs using good quality opamps and making the whole schematic diffrently so that the levels in and out of the unit would be standard consumer levels. This module could be made so that to install it needs only unscrewing the original analog module and installing a new one and connecting it with exactly the same kind of cable and connectors as in original form. So the DSP and AD would not need changing. Also there would be a number of tweaks that could be worthwhile, but are hard to do and need a lot of soldering skill and steady hand.
***
So the question:
Would there be general interest in such module among the DCX users?
If so, I could put more effort into it and make a PCB design for the module and also some instructions etc. I could basicly then get some amount of PCB-s manufactured and sell either a PCB or complete module for a small additional money for the effort put into the raw price.
The whole project would not be a money making scheme, but rather a way to get the money I spend on the parts that I need back again
The specs would be something like
*RCA sockets with XLR type socket mounting - so no drilling would be needed
*Input C would be replaced by either also a RCA on BNC socket and configured for SPDIF in (properly terminated with 75 ohm etc)
*Analog inputs would be configured for something like 2.2V RMS so ~2.1V RMS would be ADC-s clipping point
* The opamps for analog stage cane be designed to use high quality sockets so each can use his favourite type (I would most likely use OPA2134)
*Analog input single end to balanced signal conversion (needed for ADC) could be done with transformer - more expensive but I think will give better result.
Any additional suggestions welcome
Regards,
Ergo
I got my unit last week and I have now been slowly studing it.
As it is a professional unit with all of it's XLR connectors and professional signal levels I would like to mod my unit to use RCA sockets. Also I of course would like to upgrade the analog stages, both the input and output.
So, the conclusion that I came to is that it would be possible to make a new module for analog stages and analog inputs/outputs using good quality opamps and making the whole schematic diffrently so that the levels in and out of the unit would be standard consumer levels. This module could be made so that to install it needs only unscrewing the original analog module and installing a new one and connecting it with exactly the same kind of cable and connectors as in original form. So the DSP and AD would not need changing. Also there would be a number of tweaks that could be worthwhile, but are hard to do and need a lot of soldering skill and steady hand.
***
So the question:
Would there be general interest in such module among the DCX users?
If so, I could put more effort into it and make a PCB design for the module and also some instructions etc. I could basicly then get some amount of PCB-s manufactured and sell either a PCB or complete module for a small additional money for the effort put into the raw price.
The whole project would not be a money making scheme, but rather a way to get the money I spend on the parts that I need back again
The specs would be something like
*RCA sockets with XLR type socket mounting - so no drilling would be needed
*Input C would be replaced by either also a RCA on BNC socket and configured for SPDIF in (properly terminated with 75 ohm etc)
*Analog inputs would be configured for something like 2.2V RMS so ~2.1V RMS would be ADC-s clipping point
* The opamps for analog stage cane be designed to use high quality sockets so each can use his favourite type (I would most likely use OPA2134)
*Analog input single end to balanced signal conversion (needed for ADC) could be done with transformer - more expensive but I think will give better result.
Any additional suggestions welcome
Regards,
Ergo
I have been buiding my system for years and upto now I have not gone to balanced operation. I have one power amp capable of balanced (The End milleenium from LCAudio) but the other one not (Hawk Audio A-18). Also the volume control problem is less hard to solve with single ended signal.
All in all I think that there are many people out there who do not consider a balanced operation the only way and as me have already a system with single ended RCA connections and consumer levels. They also might rather change the DCX than to rebuild all the rest of the system.
Anyway, part of the good effects of balanced signal are left even with the new module I plan. The analog input would have a transformer just after input terminals that converts the SE signal to balanced signal for DAC. Output stages would take a balanced signal from DAC's and the LP filter part would use balanced to a good effect. Just the final result is to make the signal single ended again.
Ergo
ergo said:
I am doing pretty much this - except I am only doing the outputs. Analog input is not of interest to me.
You can do the same as me - simply take the digital signals from the existing DAC's and replace DAC chips and amplifiers. From memory I seem to recall that the analog filters are on the PCB at the output stage - if so you can replace the analog sections there but my recommendation would be to junk everything and start with the DAC chips. The flat connector between the boards does not seem very niced to me.
Except for some small connections to solder to, this is a pretty easy DAC since you don't have to worry about input receiver, reclocker etc.
Of course - just adding some decoupling + changing the output stage might be useful as well. I am going a bit further, though.
Petter
Petter
Ok, I have tought about replacing DAC chips also, but that is a major work if better result is to be expected.
What kind of DAC chips are you Petter using?
I find PCM1704 to be one of the best candidates, but the cost will be real high, especially if done balanced.
BB newer DACs are not usually graded too good. Same goes for crystal DACs.
So which ones you guys would like to see used for upgrade?
Ergo
What kind of DAC chips are you Petter using?
I find PCM1704 to be one of the best candidates, but the cost will be real high, especially if done balanced.
BB newer DACs are not usually graded too good. Same goes for crystal DACs.
So which ones you guys would like to see used for upgrade?
Ergo
Peter,
I am in the process of doing much the same work as you have planned. I too intend to replace the DACs and use my own (passive) filters followed by descrete topology buffers.
I built a number of outboard DACs in the past utilizing Analog Devices chips (older 20-bit ladder types the AD1872K) and Asynchronous Sample Rate Converters to boot along with excellent power regulators courtesy of the work done by Jan Didden (thanks Jan!) . I am sure I can replicate the same DACs here using more modern chips.
Tell me, have you managed to trace out the schematics of the analog output section of the DCX? Also, have determined a convenient point to pick off the digital signals that going to the DAC, - as you know, we need the word clock, the bit clock and the data? I guess the best thing to do would be to ‘collect’ all of the signals, wire the traces to a connector and then take the umbilical cord outside. So far this is what I am thinking of doing. What is your approach?
Well, I would really like to look at the DCX schematics before I do any ‘surgery’.
Vadim
I am in the process of doing much the same work as you have planned. I too intend to replace the DACs and use my own (passive) filters followed by descrete topology buffers.
I built a number of outboard DACs in the past utilizing Analog Devices chips (older 20-bit ladder types the AD1872K) and Asynchronous Sample Rate Converters to boot along with excellent power regulators courtesy of the work done by Jan Didden (thanks Jan!) . I am sure I can replicate the same DACs here using more modern chips.
Tell me, have you managed to trace out the schematics of the analog output section of the DCX? Also, have determined a convenient point to pick off the digital signals that going to the DAC, - as you know, we need the word clock, the bit clock and the data? I guess the best thing to do would be to ‘collect’ all of the signals, wire the traces to a connector and then take the umbilical cord outside. So far this is what I am thinking of doing. What is your approach?
Well, I would really like to look at the DCX schematics before I do any ‘surgery’.
Vadim
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