Just curious if there are any 6" or possibly 8" designs out that are FLH or TH that can provide 50hz and up in 3-4cuft external?
I know its not much but I was only curious. I most likely will just use a 15" ported in a similar cabinet size. But for that I will need about 1200watts. So I liked the idea of using the same amount of space and using a horned design that needs much less wattage. I do seem to like the tactile performance of the FLH over a TH but realize I am on a size constraint. Also I would prefer to have SPL over extension. While 40hz would be nice if I cant fit it in my cabinet then I can move on up to 50 or so Hz. This will be more of a balancing act between spl size and extension. SPL and small form factor are the key elements in this one.
I dont expect miracles and know an 8" wont compare to a 15. BUT before I continue my speaker build I am trying to explore all options. So to anyone that can help I would greatly appreciate it.
As far as drivers
18 Sound NMB420 or other 8"
I know the 18 Sound works in FLH's but I am not sure what else is out there. Not a lot of options here in Australia unless I want to pay a lot of money. If I had to pay money I would go with the TC Sounds Epic 8". I am restricting myself to a 11" width or mouth opening. So an 8" is as big as I can go.
I know its not much but I was only curious. I most likely will just use a 15" ported in a similar cabinet size. But for that I will need about 1200watts. So I liked the idea of using the same amount of space and using a horned design that needs much less wattage. I do seem to like the tactile performance of the FLH over a TH but realize I am on a size constraint. Also I would prefer to have SPL over extension. While 40hz would be nice if I cant fit it in my cabinet then I can move on up to 50 or so Hz. This will be more of a balancing act between spl size and extension. SPL and small form factor are the key elements in this one.
I dont expect miracles and know an 8" wont compare to a 15. BUT before I continue my speaker build I am trying to explore all options. So to anyone that can help I would greatly appreciate it.
As far as drivers
18 Sound NMB420 or other 8"
I know the 18 Sound works in FLH's but I am not sure what else is out there. Not a lot of options here in Australia unless I want to pay a lot of money. If I had to pay money I would go with the TC Sounds Epic 8". I am restricting myself to a 11" width or mouth opening. So an 8" is as big as I can go.
There's been a bunch of 8" TH designs posted including the 8NMB420, which yields a solid 35 Hz with dual drivers in ~70 L net.
GM
GM
I saw the Anarchy sub and have the plans for that design. I just wanted to see if I could get more SPL without going as low. When shipping was included the driver cost the same price as the 8NMB420. I can go as wide as 11" so I figured I should try an 8".
Thanks GM I will do another search and see if I can find the dual 8 design. In saying that, that 70l is probably too big for my cabinet. And its depth/width would be 17" I think. Will have to have a look.
Thanks GM I will do another search and see if I can find the dual 8 design. In saying that, that 70l is probably too big for my cabinet. And its depth/width would be 17" I think. Will have to have a look.
I saw that design also.The 38hz single fold would fit also but I was hoping for an 8" design. And after seeing the 177mm internal I guess I wont be squeezing an 8" in there.😀
I also saw a few designs on your thread that seamed interesting. Like the dual PP 8" design and a few others. I dont want to spend to much money because I can always just use one of my 15's in the side. Even sealed would be fine although I would much prefer ported but I dont have enough room for that particular 15.
So for me a single horn loaded 8" or other design that has great spl and very small would be great. SO I look forward to your results also.
I also saw a few designs on your thread that seamed interesting. Like the dual PP 8" design and a few others. I dont want to spend to much money because I can always just use one of my 15's in the side. Even sealed would be fine although I would much prefer ported but I dont have enough room for that particular 15.
So for me a single horn loaded 8" or other design that has great spl and very small would be great. SO I look forward to your results also.
What about stretching the 177mm dim to 204mm to fit the 8" driver?
A sim should be able to confirm similar or very different performance.
Stretching involves cutting all the side to side panels 27mm wider.
A sim should be able to confirm similar or very different performance.
Stretching involves cutting all the side to side panels 27mm wider.
Martinson has a Tham 6.5" on his blog.
Martinsson's Blog -
Could be used as a basis for a design - it is only 42 litres external.
Martinson makes some suggestions to what other drivers may be suitable. Hopefully that could be useful to you, as I understand that driver availability in Australia can be quite limited.
Martinsson's Blog -
Could be used as a basis for a design - it is only 42 litres external.
Martinson makes some suggestions to what other drivers may be suitable. Hopefully that could be useful to you, as I understand that driver availability in Australia can be quite limited.
Cutting dimensions would be easy but I dont know how to change the input parameters for that horn to reflect the width change.
His 6.5" works also. I saw the 6.5's he used and most of them are available to me. Almost every design but the volvoteer 38hz design I would have to refold so it can fit in my cabinet. Huge learning curve as I have not attempted this yet. Never tried to fold anything yet.😱😱
You're welcome!
Hmm, you said up to 4 ft^3, well 70 L net once built will be somewhat less and drivers would be in tandem.
Regardless, in my haste I was looking at the wrong HR record [my version of lilmike's Exodus loaded 'Insubnia']. The dual 8NMB420 is [impossibly?] small @ ~38 L net due to its extremely powerful motor, which is made 'worse' in that its Qes is even lower @ 0.27 Vs 0.31 based on its other published specs, ergo will probably have to be bigger with some of its space filled in to get it to match the sim.
Factor in that such powerful motors 'demand' a wide BW for best overall transient and flattest frequency response at the expense of peak SPL, i.e. becomes increasingly under-damped with decreasing BW, it may not be worth messing with in your case.
GM
The ever popular and good sounding MCM 55-2421 8 incher makes a nice 3.5 cu ft tapped horn described here:
High output 8" Tapped horn - AVS Forum
High output 8" Tapped horn - AVS Forum
The design detailed in post's #2, #8 and #58 would work for your application, just cut it to the width you want:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subwoofers/216701-midbass-tapped-horns.html
Edit: -5 dB at 50 Hz, probably not low enough for what you want.
Art
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I did not realize you meant net as in built. I was thinking I still needed to add on another 30% for construction. TO increase the bandwidth are you saying that this driver needs more volume to smooth out the peaks?
Or would a chamber be better for this driver like in a FLH?
Yah I had looked at his a couple of times. I liked what it could do and I was going to chat with him again to see if he ever did any single folds of it. I know because of shipping the cost is the same as a car audio 10" also though. (JBL GTO1014)
I had looked at LilMikes T-6 and shrunk L23 to make it closer to a 42hz tuned design and that would easily fit in my cabinet also. His current T-6 as it stands is 6cuft design.
Thanks Art. I have always liked a bunch of your designs I just never built any of them do to budget. It would be nice aesthetically to have a Keystone exit at the bottom of the cabinet.😀
But yes I would like to go as low as I can. I do plan on building HT subs later on but that is months away.
That being said what 10" did that use Art in post 58, I believe?
I think your dual 6" design dropped off at 65hz or so also but still very interesting.
The 10" subs used Kappa Pro 10", not really a "sub" driver at all, but they still kick hard.
The basic cabinet design could be "stretched" in height for a lower Fb.
No, 'net' is the actual volume of air to be energized, so add ~25%, which still clocks in well below your 4 ft^3 limit.
Correct, the 8NMB420's lower BW limit is around 8 Hz, so it really needs to be tuned at least a 1/2 WL below Fs to flatten out, ergo needs to be longer, which in turn increases its net Vb; but its low Xmax means it won't play loud except in a rigid/massively constructed corner.
Normally, one uses a FLH only for loading above Fs, so at 61 Hz it's too high for your app.
GM
15 x 15 x 26.5" for your 10TH Art. I would only have 12" max width so 15 wide exit wont work. The horn would be shaped like an L to fit in my cabinet. Or a rectangle and a longer mouth. Hope that makes sense.
UMMM Ya. I can input parameters in HornResp. I understand how changing some things can affect this or that. But I dont know how to fold my simulation. If I knew how to do that then I could build anything I simulate. So when I change L23 in LilMike's T-6 to get something smaller tuned higher that is easy. But I dont know what dimension that changes on a finished product like his T-6 plans.
And after I finish the simulation I would have to fold the design to fit my box anyways. So I still have a lot to learn when it comes to finishing a simulation. Hence why I started the thread.
And after I finish the simulation I would have to fold the design to fit my box anyways. So I still have a lot to learn when it comes to finishing a simulation. Hence why I started the thread.
Can you see that adding 27mm to the width of an existing speaker design changes the width from 177mm to 204mm?
All the S values use the original width of 177mm.
To take account of the 27mm extra width you multiply all the S values by 1.15 to arrive at the modified S values.
Nothing else changes as far as I know.
All the folding is the same.
All the lengths and thicknesses are the same.
All the port, driver and corner locations are the same.
The T/S parameters will be for the new driver.
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