Hi everyone!
I have an odd question: How much would a pair of diy-esls cost?
And the parts, are they easy to get?
Thanks, dave
I have an odd question: How much would a pair of diy-esls cost?
And the parts, are they easy to get?
Thanks, dave
If you are concerned about the cost, then you shouldn't be messing with audio stuff at all. Find yourself a flashy girl-friend. She will cost you less disappoint you less over the long haul. But since you asked...
The cost of ESLs depends on how you get the materials and what materials you use. Perforated steel (mid price) and aluminum (higher price) are available almost everywhere. Look up sheet-metal suppliers in your local yellow pages. Some will have a scrap pile from which they will sell odds and ends very cheaply. They can usually roll the sheet flat for you also.
The most expensive part is the transformers to drive the speakers. if you buy new ones, they'll cost you $50-100 each and you will need two or four of them for a stereo pair of speakers. You may be able to scrounge them out of old tube amplifiers if you have some of those laying around (not likely as the tube audio nutz have driven the price of those through the roof).
Easy to get parts? That all depends on what YOU consider easy. The biggest challenge in making ESLs is finding the materials. The McMaster-Carr catalog has most of the raw materials you will need, but you can save a lot of money by scrounging.
You will probably want to do some electronic equalization of the response. Initially you can put resistors in series with the stators, but that tends to be lossy so you'll want to build an op-amp circuit to put just ahead of your power amp. A basic 1st order LPF is suffiecient. The parts are cheap, but it takes some time and skill to build it.
You will also need to make some sort of frames to hold the speaker panels.
Finally, you need high voltage bias supplies. Again, cheap parts but requiring some skill to assemble.
Figure $50 for perf steel for two speakers 2' x 2', $150 for two transformers, $80-100 for two frames (cheap and ugly), 2 HV bias supplies $30 (surplus), the rest of the items are nickel and dime stuff...
I_F
The cost of ESLs depends on how you get the materials and what materials you use. Perforated steel (mid price) and aluminum (higher price) are available almost everywhere. Look up sheet-metal suppliers in your local yellow pages. Some will have a scrap pile from which they will sell odds and ends very cheaply. They can usually roll the sheet flat for you also.
The most expensive part is the transformers to drive the speakers. if you buy new ones, they'll cost you $50-100 each and you will need two or four of them for a stereo pair of speakers. You may be able to scrounge them out of old tube amplifiers if you have some of those laying around (not likely as the tube audio nutz have driven the price of those through the roof).
Easy to get parts? That all depends on what YOU consider easy. The biggest challenge in making ESLs is finding the materials. The McMaster-Carr catalog has most of the raw materials you will need, but you can save a lot of money by scrounging.
You will probably want to do some electronic equalization of the response. Initially you can put resistors in series with the stators, but that tends to be lossy so you'll want to build an op-amp circuit to put just ahead of your power amp. A basic 1st order LPF is suffiecient. The parts are cheap, but it takes some time and skill to build it.
You will also need to make some sort of frames to hold the speaker panels.
Finally, you need high voltage bias supplies. Again, cheap parts but requiring some skill to assemble.
Figure $50 for perf steel for two speakers 2' x 2', $150 for two transformers, $80-100 for two frames (cheap and ugly), 2 HV bias supplies $30 (surplus), the rest of the items are nickel and dime stuff...
I_F
MR. Geolemon
You definitely have an avid interest in ESL's So I think that you should get roger sanders book. Oh yeah it describes a great way to make curved cells to. And it's pretty easy to boot!
Mark
You definitely have an avid interest in ESL's So I think that you should get roger sanders book. Oh yeah it describes a great way to make curved cells to. And it's pretty easy to boot!
Mark
ESL build up
I want to share with you guys my experience of building my ESL from scratch.
Going to three years ago I became interested in building electrostatics
as opposed to bying Martin Logans or other brand of ESL which were
out of my league pricewise. I even considered bying a kit but after
some research (a lot of research was done, bless me...) I didn't find
any kit that impressed me. And I wanted to learn something about
the subject because my knowledge on ESL at the time was an absolute zero!
First thing I did was to research the Audio circuit on elect. and there
I aquired some notions that made me aware of the difficulty of the
project and there also I came upon the Rob McKinley web site. And
this was definitively the best thing I did not only because I bought
most of the materials from him but also (and this was the biggest thing)
because Rob was untiresomely helpful in teaching me how to deal
with the project. Now I can say that if it wasn't for him I would never
be so successful in building the ESL. He was absolutely the real
reason why my ESL are still playing after almost three years.
Cost, I believe I spent around $400 altogether, I didn't buy the
transformers (old heafty transformers from a discarded tube amp)
and some other minor items aquired locally. I did buy the HV
supply also from Rob and this the best decision I took because
this one works great (around 5,000 volts) and two others I
built didn't do it so nicely.
Last year I decided to build another pair and for that I was going
to use some of the materials that I had left, like membrane, compound and so on. I even bought PVC spacers. I had to buy a whole
sheet and now I have A LOT of cut spacers left that I want to sell.
Unfortunately I didn'd go ahead with the second version due
to being sick during the summer, but this year I intend to continue
my saga with the second pair, this time phisically different from
the other ones, more on the Quad style.
Difficulties? Oh, yes, I had a lot f them, It took me a while to
grasp the concept of the ESL applied to the materials, not the
theoretical concept, but the distances, sizes etc.
But the result paid off and after all this time I have a pair of
speakers I am very proud of and above all just because I
didn't have to spend a few thousand dollars....
Again I want to thank Rob for the pacience and understanding
of assisting me in this endeavour.
I want to share with you guys my experience of building my ESL from scratch.
Going to three years ago I became interested in building electrostatics
as opposed to bying Martin Logans or other brand of ESL which were
out of my league pricewise. I even considered bying a kit but after
some research (a lot of research was done, bless me...) I didn't find
any kit that impressed me. And I wanted to learn something about
the subject because my knowledge on ESL at the time was an absolute zero!
First thing I did was to research the Audio circuit on elect. and there
I aquired some notions that made me aware of the difficulty of the
project and there also I came upon the Rob McKinley web site. And
this was definitively the best thing I did not only because I bought
most of the materials from him but also (and this was the biggest thing)
because Rob was untiresomely helpful in teaching me how to deal
with the project. Now I can say that if it wasn't for him I would never
be so successful in building the ESL. He was absolutely the real
reason why my ESL are still playing after almost three years.
Cost, I believe I spent around $400 altogether, I didn't buy the
transformers (old heafty transformers from a discarded tube amp)
and some other minor items aquired locally. I did buy the HV
supply also from Rob and this the best decision I took because
this one works great (around 5,000 volts) and two others I
built didn't do it so nicely.
Last year I decided to build another pair and for that I was going
to use some of the materials that I had left, like membrane, compound and so on. I even bought PVC spacers. I had to buy a whole
sheet and now I have A LOT of cut spacers left that I want to sell.
Unfortunately I didn'd go ahead with the second version due
to being sick during the summer, but this year I intend to continue
my saga with the second pair, this time phisically different from
the other ones, more on the Quad style.
Difficulties? Oh, yes, I had a lot f them, It took me a while to
grasp the concept of the ESL applied to the materials, not the
theoretical concept, but the distances, sizes etc.
But the result paid off and after all this time I have a pair of
speakers I am very proud of and above all just because I
didn't have to spend a few thousand dollars....
Again I want to thank Rob for the pacience and understanding
of assisting me in this endeavour.
Also check out www.justrealmusic.com
They are very knowledgible and willing to help. They have kits as well as excellent prices on individual parts. ER audio is an excellent source for diaphram material and coating as well.
Sheldon and his website are very good sources. I was very fortunate to live only a few minutes away and he helped me a tremendous amount. I am extrememly grateful to him... otherwise my speakers would not have turned out nearly as nice.
I have built up a pair of estats from scratch (only the high voltage supplies were bought) and I love them... unfortunately I don't have time to go into details now, maybe this summer after finals.
Roger Sanders book is an excellent reference, and the actual construction is quite easy.
-Wes
They are very knowledgible and willing to help. They have kits as well as excellent prices on individual parts. ER audio is an excellent source for diaphram material and coating as well.
Sheldon and his website are very good sources. I was very fortunate to live only a few minutes away and he helped me a tremendous amount. I am extrememly grateful to him... otherwise my speakers would not have turned out nearly as nice.
I have built up a pair of estats from scratch (only the high voltage supplies were bought) and I love them... unfortunately I don't have time to go into details now, maybe this summer after finals.
Roger Sanders book is an excellent reference, and the actual construction is quite easy.
-Wes
Just to share my experience.
Last year, I managed to buy a pair faulty Quad ESL-63 at US$150. Knowing that the problem was due to the diaphragm and dust cover, I ordered a repair kit and fixed them at about US$100. The repair work was quiet straight forward but you need patience on coating and stretching the diapragm. In total, I spent less than US$300 for a pair of great ESL speakers. Sometimes, it is much cheaper and time saving to do this rather than building them from scrap. This is just my point of view.
As for book, I agreed with "wrl". Roger Sanders book is an excellent reference.
Last year, I managed to buy a pair faulty Quad ESL-63 at US$150. Knowing that the problem was due to the diaphragm and dust cover, I ordered a repair kit and fixed them at about US$100. The repair work was quiet straight forward but you need patience on coating and stretching the diapragm. In total, I spent less than US$300 for a pair of great ESL speakers. Sometimes, it is much cheaper and time saving to do this rather than building them from scrap. This is just my point of view.
As for book, I agreed with "wrl". Roger Sanders book is an excellent reference.
ec1288 said:
Mr. Ec1288,
I am sorry that I am a little bit of the topic but I would like to ask You a few questions regarding Your DIY Ongaku. Please contact me at dmustran_remove_@yahoo.co.uk
thanks in advance
daniel
Martin Logan CLS electrostatic panels
I have two CLS panels for sale .Mine didn't work properly so in talking to a young man from the martin logan service dept.he advised me to wash them as crazy as this sounds.The one worked real good after the cleaning but the other still did not work well.So I ordered a new set they cost 1575 shipping and all.That all took place around August.Got the new panels but before I installed them I thought I'd try that panel one more time because throwing them away would be like throwing away an old girlfriend.Well low and behold the panel after sitting two months sounded great.Afterwards speaking with the young tech he said that maybe the bad sound was due too high a humidity and it was humid but I think that the washing had something to do with it.Seeing as the new panels were special order I couldn't return them as they were specially built for me.So if anybody wants them and is capable of building the needed power supply's here they are.Send me and E-mail and we'll discuss price.
I have two CLS panels for sale .Mine didn't work properly so in talking to a young man from the martin logan service dept.he advised me to wash them as crazy as this sounds.The one worked real good after the cleaning but the other still did not work well.So I ordered a new set they cost 1575 shipping and all.That all took place around August.Got the new panels but before I installed them I thought I'd try that panel one more time because throwing them away would be like throwing away an old girlfriend.Well low and behold the panel after sitting two months sounded great.Afterwards speaking with the young tech he said that maybe the bad sound was due too high a humidity and it was humid but I think that the washing had something to do with it.Seeing as the new panels were special order I couldn't return them as they were specially built for me.So if anybody wants them and is capable of building the needed power supply's here they are.Send me and E-mail and we'll discuss price.
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