I've always wanted to do a full dipole setup and the Orion seems just right. Only downfall is: the drivers cost too much. The alternative is the new dayton RS. What do you guys think?
1. RS28 or a Seas standard tweeter + rs170 + 2 tc subs
or
2. Fountek ribbons/AC + 2 rs170 + 2 tc subs
all active by dcx
amps= unknown as of now
1. RS28 or a Seas standard tweeter + rs170 + 2 tc subs
or
2. Fountek ribbons/AC + 2 rs170 + 2 tc subs
all active by dcx
amps= unknown as of now
I was going to say "no, the crossovers cost too much" but then realized crossover boxes such as yours and the Beringer 2496 are getting really cheap- I saw the 2496 for $200
Can you do the crossovers from the bass to the mids, mids to the tweeters and shape the low end for 2 channels? all with one of those crossover gizmos?
What are tc subs? The 4 Peerless subs he specs are really the expensive thing!
Can you do the crossovers from the bass to the mids, mids to the tweeters and shape the low end for 2 channels? all with one of those crossover gizmos?
What are tc subs? The 4 Peerless subs he specs are really the expensive thing!
Variac said:
Yes, the dcx2496 is the reason why i can afford to go active.
I'm not too familiar with all the settings yet though. As far as I know, it can bandpass all outputs (6) and has a few parametric bands on each output. It also does time alignment and phase as well.
TC subs are these http://www.oaudio.com/TC2_PLUS.html
if i remember correctly, a member on here did compare the TC sub to the xls and the TC came out to be a better sub.
DearSX said:
I'm not quite sure if the RS 10" would do that well down low in a dipole setup.
If I went with this dipole route, I would not want a separate sub.
I think that amplification cost will be what kills my pocket.
*Edit*
as I'm typing this, I remember that Mark K did have a dipole RS project with the dcx,
just as I go to check out his site, the link is gone.
if you're reading this Mark, help a fellow out
a link would help
The amps for this type of speaker has been discussed in other threads.
Since you will need about 8, and cost is a big factor, chip amps seem the best solution. Linkwitch even suggests this as an option.You can use a large power supply to power all 4 of one channel. A power transformer twice as big is only a few dollars more. A diode brige can handle a lot more poweri f it has a decent heatsink.
Since you will need about 8, and cost is a big factor, chip amps seem the best solution. Linkwitch even suggests this as an option.You can use a large power supply to power all 4 of one channel. A power transformer twice as big is only a few dollars more. A diode brige can handle a lot more poweri f it has a decent heatsink.
I'm a former Orion owner and currently have a set of MTM dipoles which use the RS180 woofers and RS28A tweeter. I happen to also be using a DCX2496 with them. They have a very high bang-for-the-buck ratio but (IMHO) fall short of offering Orion-level performance.
Cheers, mac.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Cheers, mac.
mac said:
Could you please elaborate on the shortfalls of the dxc+ RS set up?
does the gain in efficiency worth it? or should i stick with the mt setup like the Orion?
AJinFLA said:
Thanks AJ, that's the project that I was thinking of.
Looks like the owner thinks the wait for the new RS woofers worth the wait. What do you think?
Hello,
I'm currently in the process of building the RS Dipole project mentioned (http://www.mfk-projects.com/rs_dipole.htm). I will post pics and let you know the results when it's finished - hopefully sometime quite soon.
There are a few things I'm doing slightly differently:
1 - I have purchased a DEQ2496 to play around with the RTA functions, it looks like fun.
2 - I have constructed a 6 channel volume control. The plan at the moment is to go optical out from CD Player -> DEQ, AES digital from DEQ -> DCX, then DCX -> 6ch volume control (via diy XLR to RCA cables) -> power amps -> rs dipoles. Downside is I only have 1 input, my cd player, but this is all I will be using anyway. Upside is digital all the way to dcx outs, hence no loss of resolution from low signal fed into dcx.
2 - I plan to use a sub (ascendant atlas 15") to augment the bottom, hence I am not too worried about the lack of excursion from the RS270 woofers.
3 - I am using the Seas 27TDFC tweeter, rather than the Usher tweeter that Monte uses, however I wish I had waited a little bit longer and gone with the RS28 as it can extend lower, so I wouldn't worry about damaging it.
Overall I'm excited to finally hear these play sometime soon. If they're as good as I'm hoping I will eventually upgrade to the Orions.
Pete.
I'm currently in the process of building the RS Dipole project mentioned (http://www.mfk-projects.com/rs_dipole.htm). I will post pics and let you know the results when it's finished - hopefully sometime quite soon.
There are a few things I'm doing slightly differently:
1 - I have purchased a DEQ2496 to play around with the RTA functions, it looks like fun.
2 - I have constructed a 6 channel volume control. The plan at the moment is to go optical out from CD Player -> DEQ, AES digital from DEQ -> DCX, then DCX -> 6ch volume control (via diy XLR to RCA cables) -> power amps -> rs dipoles. Downside is I only have 1 input, my cd player, but this is all I will be using anyway. Upside is digital all the way to dcx outs, hence no loss of resolution from low signal fed into dcx.
2 - I plan to use a sub (ascendant atlas 15") to augment the bottom, hence I am not too worried about the lack of excursion from the RS270 woofers.
3 - I am using the Seas 27TDFC tweeter, rather than the Usher tweeter that Monte uses, however I wish I had waited a little bit longer and gone with the RS28 as it can extend lower, so I wouldn't worry about damaging it.
Overall I'm excited to finally hear these play sometime soon. If they're as good as I'm hoping I will eventually upgrade to the Orions.
Pete.
Thanks ucla88,
I didn't really expect any problems, but it's certainly comforting to know that I couldn't have done too much better for the price.
Variac - Monte uses the Dayton RS180 and the RS270. It's a shame they didn't have the high excursion 10" or 12" earlier in the year. I was over in America and brought the drivers home with me down under.. it would be way too expensive to ship them here.
While I'm on the topic, I am powering them with BrianGT's chip amp (lm3886) kits for the tweeters and mid's, and an alesis studio amp for the bass.
Pete.
I didn't really expect any problems, but it's certainly comforting to know that I couldn't have done too much better for the price.
Variac - Monte uses the Dayton RS180 and the RS270. It's a shame they didn't have the high excursion 10" or 12" earlier in the year. I was over in America and brought the drivers home with me down under.. it would be way too expensive to ship them here.
While I'm on the topic, I am powering them with BrianGT's chip amp (lm3886) kits for the tweeters and mid's, and an alesis studio amp for the bass.
Pete.
Pete,
I'm very excited that you're building Montes design! I'm almost ready to pull the trigger and order the parts as well. I will be going with the RS28, though, as Monte felt it would be a great match and crossover tweaking will be minimal.
I also just bought an Atlas 15 to augment my bass but am uncertain which Qtc setting I'll be using and which size enclosure. Any idea which one you're going for, and how you're going to cross it over to your RS dipoles? I have a 240w PE plate amp with a 24db/oct crossover I was thinking of using, crossing over somewhere between 40-50hz. I also have 6 Shivas laying around that I was going to build dipole subs with, or sealed subs, to take care of the down low stuff. Which route would you choose? The Atlas is on its way but I could always build a sub for a family member with that.
I'm very excited that you're building Montes design! I'm almost ready to pull the trigger and order the parts as well. I will be going with the RS28, though, as Monte felt it would be a great match and crossover tweaking will be minimal.
I also just bought an Atlas 15 to augment my bass but am uncertain which Qtc setting I'll be using and which size enclosure. Any idea which one you're going for, and how you're going to cross it over to your RS dipoles? I have a 240w PE plate amp with a 24db/oct crossover I was thinking of using, crossing over somewhere between 40-50hz. I also have 6 Shivas laying around that I was going to build dipole subs with, or sealed subs, to take care of the down low stuff. Which route would you choose? The Atlas is on its way but I could always build a sub for a family member with that.
Hi sqlkev and mazeroth,
I have half of mine up and running! So far i have completed a 4 channel chipamp and i have purchased an alesis power amp for the bottom. The four channel amp currently has some ground loop hum problems, but I'm confident I will fix that next weekend.
Playing with just one speaker sounds fantastic - I can't wait to get both playing. The only two issues i have left to deal with are my current dirt-cheap cd player that needs replacing, and the wiring that connects them all up. I have made my own XLR -> RCA interconnects, and the wire i'm currently using from amps -> drivers is very very cheap wire from Jaycar Electronics - I dont know if I should bother gettign more expensive stuff or not.
As for the finish on them, I hope to use some attractive veneer for the main front panel, then paint the rest black.
I will update you when I am at the next stage - at the moment I seem to have no spare time at all, which is getting very frustrating!!
Pete.
I have half of mine up and running! So far i have completed a 4 channel chipamp and i have purchased an alesis power amp for the bottom. The four channel amp currently has some ground loop hum problems, but I'm confident I will fix that next weekend.
Playing with just one speaker sounds fantastic - I can't wait to get both playing. The only two issues i have left to deal with are my current dirt-cheap cd player that needs replacing, and the wiring that connects them all up. I have made my own XLR -> RCA interconnects, and the wire i'm currently using from amps -> drivers is very very cheap wire from Jaycar Electronics - I dont know if I should bother gettign more expensive stuff or not.
As for the finish on them, I hope to use some attractive veneer for the main front panel, then paint the rest black.
I will update you when I am at the next stage - at the moment I seem to have no spare time at all, which is getting very frustrating!!
Pete.
Pete,
glad to hear back from you mate!
Are you using the files from Monte Kay in the dcx? If so, how does that work with your TDFC?
Right now, I have a pair of TFFC (very similar to the TDFC) and a pair of XT19 just lying around. Wonder if i could throw those into the mix to see how they perform with the rest of the system.
Have you find any weaknesses in the 1 speaker that you built? Which configuration did you end up with? the TMM or MTM?
I'd love some info on the chipamp as well. Currently, I can only order from chipamp.com but it seems like lots of things are OOS.
Hope you have some free time and finish it up.
Update us from time to time mate!!!
Gluck
Kev
glad to hear back from you mate!
Are you using the files from Monte Kay in the dcx? If so, how does that work with your TDFC?
Right now, I have a pair of TFFC (very similar to the TDFC) and a pair of XT19 just lying around. Wonder if i could throw those into the mix to see how they perform with the rest of the system.
Have you find any weaknesses in the 1 speaker that you built? Which configuration did you end up with? the TMM or MTM?
I'd love some info on the chipamp as well. Currently, I can only order from chipamp.com but it seems like lots of things are OOS.
Hope you have some free time and finish it up.
Update us from time to time mate!!!
Gluck
Kev
Hi sqlkev,
Yes I'm using Monte's DCX files, but I haven't had time to change the settings yet to accomodate the TDFC. In fact, it still has the big dip at 46hz as well, and I'm positive my room is different to Monte's.
It's hard to gauge what they are doing right and wrong at the moment . This is my first pair of proper DIY speakers, so it has taken alot of mucking round to get to this stage, and I really have nothing to compare them to. This is a shame in some ways because I really would like to be able to critique elements which i could improve on, but at the same time: ignorance is bliss when they sound so amazing.
I'll take some photos and update you over the weekend (hopefully) on any progress.
Pete.
Yes I'm using Monte's DCX files, but I haven't had time to change the settings yet to accomodate the TDFC. In fact, it still has the big dip at 46hz as well, and I'm positive my room is different to Monte's.
It's hard to gauge what they are doing right and wrong at the moment . This is my first pair of proper DIY speakers, so it has taken alot of mucking round to get to this stage, and I really have nothing to compare them to. This is a shame in some ways because I really would like to be able to critique elements which i could improve on, but at the same time: ignorance is bliss when they sound so amazing.
I'll take some photos and update you over the weekend (hopefully) on any progress.
Pete.
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