Not concerned. I just want to know. How the spots coincide with the ribs will have an effect on how they damp things.
dave
Well, I just did a very long reply and am not sure if it will post. I never learned to type and so I am very slow and almost always get logged out before I'm through getting all my thoughts down! Basically, you have many options as to size, shape and number of treatment areas and where you decide to place them. Just start small and add more areas only if need be. Avoid any parallel edges between adjacent treatment areas (circles were my first choice here). I tried to say I did not calculate the total area treated nor did I calculate the percentage of treated verses untreated areas. Go back through some of my earlier posts you may remember I did a second treatment between my original 6 areas. With an ENABL 7P; this may not be necessary!??
Well, I'm sure the doping I did will help the En7P in the main area of the cone but if you already have an edge treatment at the boundry of the surround, the tacky glue may not help or be necessary here.
I guess my very large reply didn't post after all. One thing I was trying to say there is maybe you could do 8 total areas of tacky glue treatment; 2 areas per quadrant with a larger gap or spacing directly above the spokes. In this case, an oval shape would probably work. Again, I wanted to leave enough un-treated areas so as to not radically alter the main sound character of the paper cone. (the goal, of course, was to minimize or totally eliminate the HF harshness and glare without having to use a much lower X/O frequency). At present; I am still running the 7P's straight. I haven't decided yet if I want to re-introduce an X/O. I'll leave things as they are for the time being.
For now, I am sticking with my original small Fostex BLH boxes I got from Madisound; they are doing what I need them to do. I had to make several mods. to these so I don't really recommend anyone else trying these (as others pointed out, there are MANY box choices available from the various suppliers). If anyone out there DOES want to use my same boxes; PM me and we'll take it from the there. The mods. are somewhat complicated and difficult to explain via a thread in this forum. Again, I do NOT have a digital camera nor do I have any known way of doing electronic drawings or sketches! Low tech. old school here! Anyone want to design vacuum tube circuits with a slide rule? ha ha; I USED to be able to do that (40+ years ago!).
Interesting doping nipper1.
EMP cant stop a pad of paper, a pencil and a slide rule..... is what my dad told me when I asked for an electronic calculator 40 yrs ago!
I also sometimes suffer with the long post time out problem. If you select all of your text before posting , right click the mouse in the text and select copy. It puts a copy of your text in the computers copy buffer. Then if it doesnt post, open a new reply right click the mouse in the new reply and select paste and it will paste all ofyour text into a new reply, which you can post quickly before time out.
Greetings Nipper and other lads,
I'm looking seriously at the 7P for a couple of small bookshelves. I've found some enclosure ideas on Mark Audios website, but I'm curious about your stated hearing condition.
I'm 71 and my hearing is buggered, so I'm wondering why the need for a tweeter when I'll be very lucky to hear beyond 7 or 8khz. No need for a tweeter if you can't hear it?
What have I missed?
As for doping cones and dustcaps I use Damar varnish in a supposed effort to reduce harshness in the top. What are your thoughts on this fellas?
Cheers Martin
I'm looking seriously at the 7P for a couple of small bookshelves. I've found some enclosure ideas on Mark Audios website, but I'm curious about your stated hearing condition.
I'm 71 and my hearing is buggered, so I'm wondering why the need for a tweeter when I'll be very lucky to hear beyond 7 or 8khz. No need for a tweeter if you can't hear it?
What have I missed?
As for doping cones and dustcaps I use Damar varnish in a supposed effort to reduce harshness in the top. What are your thoughts on this fellas?
Cheers Martin
I really like the 7P; other's much prefer the metal cones. My advice to you is start off with just the 7P fullrange. Give it at least 100 hours of break-in time before judging it's sound character. I really like these but there are some bothersome ringing and other funny issues going on. If you have severe hearing loss above 7KHz, you may not even notice. I did many different crossovers with and without a Zobel and never quite got the sound I was looking for. After I began doping; the sound quality became much more open and realistic. Even with the highest quality X/O components, the 7P just sounded restrained somehow. I have moved on to another system and design right now but regardless; I always use a high sensitivity super tweeter. My hearing starts to roll off above 8KHz and drops like a rock above 10KHz but the high output tweeters still bring their extra magic!
Thanks Nipper,
I've never much liked the idea of metal cones, or PP for that matter, I think paper just has that something, and is amenable to tweaking with dope. Looking at the SP for the 7P a rising treble could be tamed, I would imagine, by a judicious treatment of Damar, or indeed the other possibilities you've raised in your posts, with regard to various glue treatments.
I think I'll go with the 7p's, no tweater, (that's today) although there are many alternatives to consider, dunno yet, I'm still at the investigative stage, rather than rush in, as is the norm for me...
The whole idea of using a full range driver and doing without any crossover has always held great appeal to me. It saves a task, and crossover design is fraught with difficulty as most well know. To bin it and let one driver do the lot isn't a panacea and brings its own issues, but on balance, being too lazy to learn the math, for me, single drivers are my path to some measure of audio satisfaction...
Cheers for now, Martin
I've never much liked the idea of metal cones, or PP for that matter, I think paper just has that something, and is amenable to tweaking with dope. Looking at the SP for the 7P a rising treble could be tamed, I would imagine, by a judicious treatment of Damar, or indeed the other possibilities you've raised in your posts, with regard to various glue treatments.
I think I'll go with the 7p's, no tweater, (that's today) although there are many alternatives to consider, dunno yet, I'm still at the investigative stage, rather than rush in, as is the norm for me...
The whole idea of using a full range driver and doing without any crossover has always held great appeal to me. It saves a task, and crossover design is fraught with difficulty as most well know. To bin it and let one driver do the lot isn't a panacea and brings its own issues, but on balance, being too lazy to learn the math, for me, single drivers are my path to some measure of audio satisfaction...
Cheers for now, Martin
Best of luck! If you DO decide to dope the cone; do NOT over do it on the dust cap! I put quite a bit of dope on my 3rd try on the dust cap; killed some of the treble and made the bass too boomy! (luckily, I was able to remove it before it set!) Go in stages; a little at a time. I wish they would do a 2nd generation 7P that fixes the problems I was having. To some; this may be too subtle to even notice but I am especially sensitive to these things as a former musician. When I DO need crossovers; I always start with 1st order and I always try to keep the mid to tweeter X/O as high as possible for better phase purity in the upper mid band. I NEVER worry or care about beaming; to me, that is the LEAST important parameter (to my tastes). Accurate timbral balance including harmonics, overtones, formants, etc. is what separates good from great sounding speakers! When in doubt, go listen to live musicians in a good acoustic setting; I do this to "re-calibrate" my hearing (ha ha ha). [Acoustic instruments without microphones, amplifiers, speakers, etc. MUCH preferred for this; i.e. jazz, classical, etc.]
If it's not to protect a driver near the bottom of its range, the first order Solen Split is my go to crossover calculator.
It just sounds smoother and better integrated to me.
Would it sound smoother by even slightly randomizing the spacing of the glue dabs?
I'm thinking equadistant spacing may just reinforce their common effect on damping, sort of like a wider q single band setting on a parametric equalizer.
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