I installed big phase plugs on my 12inch Tannoy fullrangers. They have a horn tweeter sitting on the end of the phase plug. I was really surprised at how much cleaner it made the top end sound.
Shoog
Shoog
So you're saying that I could probably improve the performance of my Kenwood KFC-6949s by modding them with a phase plug? They're 6"x9" speaks with round whizzer. When I EQ these things, I spend more effort flattening out from 2kHz up than I do trying to pump up the bottom end (I can get about 45Hz at -3dB and around 35Hz at -10dB with very minimal EQ in OB config; definitely not enough to color or distort the mids or highs). The Kens easily beat my 16kHz hearing barrier, but they have tons of peaking at various points from 2kHz on up?
Other than just the Kens, where could I find info on how to do this sort of mod, and where might I find a source for parts (or do they have to be custom machined)?
Thanks,
Kensai
Other than just the Kens, where could I find info on how to do this sort of mod, and where might I find a source for parts (or do they have to be custom machined)?
Thanks,
Kensai
I have a tough time getting past the way Zu spec's the druid. It's TOTAL ******** speccing, I even like the design, I minimalize crossovers in the midrange in my own designs, sometimes not using them at all, but the claims they make are hard to get past.
Per Zu website:
Sensitivity: 101 dB
Bandwidth: 35Hz - 25kHz
Power Handling: 300 Watts
********! Throw 300WRMS at that driver and it'll melt. Throw 35Hz at it and it'll be about 75dB w/m. And the midrange driver, phase plugged or no, is not giving 101dB w/M.
One of my criteria for a speaker system I'm working on is 35Hz f3, at high (97dB) efficiency into 8 ohms..... guess what.... without infinite baffle, it's awful hard 'cause you gotta start with more like 101dB or so to get that kinda bass post baffle step......
In other words..... I call bullhonkey on Zu!
Per Zu website:
Sensitivity: 101 dB
Bandwidth: 35Hz - 25kHz
Power Handling: 300 Watts
********! Throw 300WRMS at that driver and it'll melt. Throw 35Hz at it and it'll be about 75dB w/m. And the midrange driver, phase plugged or no, is not giving 101dB w/M.
One of my criteria for a speaker system I'm working on is 35Hz f3, at high (97dB) efficiency into 8 ohms..... guess what.... without infinite baffle, it's awful hard 'cause you gotta start with more like 101dB or so to get that kinda bass post baffle step......
In other words..... I call bullhonkey on Zu!
Hi frequency peaking is exactly the thing that a phase plug will address.
It works by eliminating some of the interference created when the waveform from the opposite sides of the driver meet in the middle and create an interference pattern. The phase plug sort of guides the waves to a focus where the interaction is more predicatable and spread over a smaller frequency range. Only at the higher frequencies are these effects significant.
Planet10's web site might have a technical explanation of the process of adding a phase plug.
Shoog
It works by eliminating some of the interference created when the waveform from the opposite sides of the driver meet in the middle and create an interference pattern. The phase plug sort of guides the waves to a focus where the interaction is more predicatable and spread over a smaller frequency range. Only at the higher frequencies are these effects significant.
Planet10's web site might have a technical explanation of the process of adding a phase plug.
Shoog
loudandclear said:
Dave has installed phase plugs on my B200's. I've got a second pair of drivers on the way so once I get a couple hundred hours on them I'll be able to do a before and after comparison.
J
The 2nd one just yesterday. Trying to set up a head-to-head with the Silver Iris before i ship them back.
dave
dave
MY two cents
I've tried pairing old RatShack 40-1534s, both sharing the front baffle, both running full range in a 1.5 cu.ft. ported box tuned to 50hz. Yes, there was much more bass. But problems cropped up, like the interaction twix the whizzer and main cone being exaccerbated by having two drivers pointed the same direction and a shrunken soundstage (though I believe a bipolar config would solve those problems). Power handling also declines whenever you put a driver (especially a fullranger) in an over sized, ported box.
Single driver is 'where its at' for imaging, if that's your thing. For bass...multiple drivers or larger drivers, or...just better drivers.
One could always build/buy a powered sub, as long as it played real low.
I've tried pairing old RatShack 40-1534s, both sharing the front baffle, both running full range in a 1.5 cu.ft. ported box tuned to 50hz. Yes, there was much more bass. But problems cropped up, like the interaction twix the whizzer and main cone being exaccerbated by having two drivers pointed the same direction and a shrunken soundstage (though I believe a bipolar config would solve those problems). Power handling also declines whenever you put a driver (especially a fullranger) in an over sized, ported box.
Single driver is 'where its at' for imaging, if that's your thing. For bass...multiple drivers or larger drivers, or...just better drivers.
One could always build/buy a powered sub, as long as it played real low.
The Zu's were measured by HiFi + magazine this month at 95db 1w/1m. Methinks they're being a little selective in where they get that 101db efficiency rating. It might be at one particular point in the frequency range. One very small, particular point. But that's it.
Refering to the original question, this one here is using two fullrangers in push-push configuration in an active speaker:
http://www.voice-point.com/
Regards
Charles
http://www.voice-point.com/
Regards
Charles
Dont use two fullrange drivers in normal configuration. You will never get the drivers close enough to avoid lobbing at mid, and high frequencies.
phase_accurate,
The speaker system in the link you just posted does NOT show two fullrangers in use. It shows a 1.5 system in which the back driver only operates in lower frequencies (less than 300-400 hz?). Because the rear driver is not operating full range lobing problems are avoided. So, the advice is still relevant. Do not use two drivers full range, you can't get them close enough to avoid lobing......
The speaker system in the link you just posted does NOT show two fullrangers in use. It shows a 1.5 system in which the back driver only operates in lower frequencies (less than 300-400 hz?). Because the rear driver is not operating full range lobing problems are avoided. So, the advice is still relevant. Do not use two drivers full range, you can't get them close enough to avoid lobing......
Sorry 'bout that. I knew that but forgot to mention. I wanted to show a way of cleverly using two identical drivers but completely failed to mention this detail !
Regards
Charles
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